Ed Shadid Launches Formal Attack on MAPS 3 Conv Center in tandem with Mayoral Bid

[betts]

No city is the same; no time is the same. That's just fear-mongering to advance your agenda.

[soonerguru]

I'm with ya Dave. We need to be very careful on this "slippery" slope of "Formal Actions". The Scorched Earth approach could undo decades of success for our beautiful city.

The debate of the Hotel is seperate. Let's keep it seperate. Let's make it a better process for the MAPS 4 initiatives.

Regarding the Proposed CC Hotel, the consultants are guessing. Both sides. The one thing that insures the success of a convention center & hotel, is a thriving economy. This is a certainty that the consultants will not state. The Convention Center ( our Living Room , Urban Pioneer) needs to be a " statement & welcome "at the same time.

The CC Hotel is not a requirement for the success of the Convention Center, but it does go well together ( ie, Denver ). And, OKC could certainly benefit from another Tower Hotel that makes a statement.

Very well said! You're on a roll, OKVision. Keep it up!

[bradh]

Can we get do-overs on his Council seat election as well?

If Shadid is trying to get a petition to recall portions of MAPS 3, you might be able to find enough ward 2 constituents who were hoodwinked by Ed and now want to see him headed out of town on either of our 3 major interstates.

[kevinpate]

Maybe Ed should join the chamber as a member! LOL

Not sure that would work. Doesn't the chamber encourage its members to vote regularly?

[mkjeeves]

I was a member of the chamber at one time. I quit from the PITA of the other members marketing to me 24/7. It's not called the Chamber of Commerce for nothing.

[betts]

I don't belong to the OKC Chamber of Commerce. They've obviously got a pro-business bias, have the numbers to generate a fair amount of political power and their agenda doesn't always jibe with mine. But when I look at what they have accomplished for OKC over the years and compare it with what Ed has done, its no contest. All Ed has done is sow dissension and division. He's made nothing good happen for Oklahoma City. He's alienated his peers, he's ignored the demonstrated desires of his constituency, he's lied, he's undercut other Councilors, he's spit on the voters of Oklahoma City. I should worry about the Chamber? They may be the lesser of two evils, but Shadid makes the Chamber look like neophytes in the evil department.

[kevinpate]

I get what you are noting betts. At the same time, the day a chamber of commerce doesn't have a pro business slant, given its membership, they probably ought to reorganize under a different banner.

[betts]

And the prospect of having Ed as mayor excites developers....not.

http://m.newsok.com/oklahoma-citys-y...rticle/3921308

"City Hall politics may throttle other prospects, with the first contentious mayoral race underway since Kirk Humphreys prevailed over Guy Liebmann in 1998. I've been told by a handful of developers they are holding out on moving forward with some riskier ventures until the outcome of the election is known."

[warreng88]

And the prospect of having Ed as mayor excites developers....not.

Oklahoma City's year in review for downtown development | NewsOK.com

"City Hall politics may throttle other prospects, with the first contentious mayoral race underway since Kirk Humphreys prevailed over Guy Liebmann in 1998. I've been told by a handful of developers they are holding out on moving forward with some riskier ventures until the outcome of the election is known."

Wait, wait, wait. That can't be right. Because didn't Ed or one of his cronies say that businesses were going to flock here if he became Mayor?

[mkjeeves]

An Oklahoman writer blogging against Ed? Naw...Who woulda thought.

[warreng88]

An Oklahoman writer blogging against Ed? Naw...Who woulda thought.

Have you read most of Steve columns or know who he is? Did you read the article? He is saying that he is hearing from developers that they are holding off on moving forward until the election outcome is known. He did not say anything about Ed.

[SoonerDave]

An Oklahoman writer blogging against Ed? Naw...Who woulda thought.

You really think that blog makes a difference now?

[mkjeeves]

Have you read most of Steve columns or know who he is? Did you read the article? He is saying that he is hearing from developers that they are holding off on moving forward until the election outcome is known. He did not say anything about Ed.

Both you and Betts said it was about Ed, so make up your mind. Yes, I know who Steve is. We've met actually, though he would be unlikely to remember.

[warreng88]

Both you and Betts said it was about Ed, so make up your mind. Yes, I know who Steve is. We've met actually, though he would be unlikely to remember.

I said it and Betts said, sure. I will give you that. My point is Steve did not say it.

[betts]

An Oklahoman writer blogging against Ed? Naw...Who woulda thought.

I think Steve deserves quite a bit more credit than you're giving him here. I think he's been remarkably free of bias in his reporting of this race. Now, if you want to read something with so much bias that it gives you a saccharine headache, I'll give you the Red Dirt "reporter".

While Steve didn't say it, does anyone seriously think he was talking about Mick?

[mkjeeves]

I think Steve deserves quite a bit more credit than you're giving him here. I think he's been remarkably free of bias in his reporting of this race. Now, if you want to read something with so much bias that it gives you a saccharine headache, I'll give you the Red Dirt "reporter".

Steve's pretty unbiased most of the time.

This discussion belongs in Mayors Race doesn't it?

[betts]

This discussion belongs in Mayors Race doesn't it?

Yes, mea culpa. Maybe Pete will move some of these last posts to that thread.

[BDP]

If Shadid is trying to get a petition to recall portions of MAPS 3, you might be able to find enough ward 2 constituents who were hoodwinked by Ed and now want to see him headed out of town on either of our 3 major interstates.

This is what has happened to me. I lived in that ward during the last election and liked Shadid's promises of transparency and call for more openness in city government. I was concerned about some of his statement on MAPS 3 projects, so I reached out to his campaign and was assured that Shadid supported the completion of MAPS3 as proposed and he publicly reinforced that sentiment before the election.

I feel lied to on both counts. He essentially has become nothing more than an obstructionist. I'm not a big fan of the CC in the mix of MAPS3 projects, but that is mainly due to where they want to put it and the "CC first" agenda that has given it priority over other projects that will enhance the life of those that live here the most. However, every time I walk through the Cox Convention center it is readily apparent that we need new convention space, even for the convention business we already get. However, I think there are better places for it and probably better integration concepts than what we've seen. Also, it seems to me that placing the CC closer to other hotels and attractions (say adjacent to or in bricktown) both mitigates the need for extra rooms and the risk to potential hotel developers because they can better leverage the demand across more attractions downtown, rather than being so dependent on convention business. I'm no hotel manager, but I would think that the value of being branded as the only full service hotel in bricktown COMBINED with being THE convention center adjacent hotel would be a winning proposition. But, obviously, and like usual, the process of selecting a CC site and the potential hotel development seemed to have taken a piecemeal approach instead of a holistic approach of evaluating how the CC and hotel could both contribute to the economy AND leverage current market assets.

But anyway, Shadid's approach is to shut it all down. I don't like that on many levels. It's very much like those in congress who didn't get their way and said "fine, then we're not going to play and at the same time, no else can either". They're operating more just to make a political point than to better our country. Shadid has acted much in the same way in his service to our city and this is just the cherry on top of his obstructionist policy portfolio. He can't seem to sell anyone on his vision ( in large part because I don't think he's really presented a coherent one ), so all he wants to do is wreck the vision of others. I just think he could have contributed more positively to the whole process, but he has used up so much of his political capital being an antagonist, that no one wants to work with him, even if he did offer up some constructive and genuinely productive ideas. What I thought he was going to be, and what I think he could have been, was a better advocate and representative for the ideas and opinions that come from people or independent groups in the broader community that otherwise have little organized representation within city government. He has helped some along the way, but in general he seems to have spent more time attacking processes than constructively contributing to the process.

So, I guess it's my turn to do the same. There are things wrong with the CC plan as it to date, imo. But this action is the wrong process and the wrong precedent to set.

[Midtowner]

Edgar, the document doesn't belong to you. It belongs to an organization. One made up of members, voting members. They are more than capable of releasing anything they'd like. If OKC Beautiful did a CC study, you'd have just as much right to read it then -- which is zero.

The CC study is a red herring and once again, just makes Ed appear really inexperienced.
The Chamber doesn't owe you, me, taxpayers, or the city anything. They campaigned for what they wanted in MAPS 3 and that's the same right you have.

I don't necessarily agree that it's not a public document. It depends on how OKC Alliance is funded. If they receive any public money for funding, I don't see how they can say it's not a public document. On the other hand, if they're paid consulting fees and these are purely internal documents, it may be privileged. That'd take a fair bit of research.

Regardless of what they say, we need a new convention center. Our current facility was built in 1972 and is no longer suitable for a city of our current size. I'm not talking about having it to attract out of town business. We need something to host local events and the Cox ain't cutting it. Whether we build a convention hotel is probably something best left for another day unless a major hotel reaches out about a public-private partnership, but this is a city facility and most (maybe all) of our city facilities are not profitable. That's why we have to pay taxes to subsidize them. We pay taxes because there are things we can all do together which we couldn't otherwise do alone.

[kevinpate]

BDP, take heart.
The cc turns out not to have been moved up to first despite reports to the contrary.

They've yet to lock down its location. Meanwhile, on other parts of the urban prairie:

Trails are being built, sidewalks have been set in place, and despite cutbacks, more miles are back in the mix. the streetcar route is set. Things are moving along well on acquisition on Santa Fe station. Park is moving along. Stuff is progressing at the fairgrounds, the river and the whitewater area breaks ground within the year (few months?) and they are still fussing about with the aquatic centers. All while they are still trying to find a way to put the cc at its desired and as yet unpurchased location.

Coulda been a whole lot worse.

[Edgar]

No city is the same; no time is the same. That's just fear-mongering to advance your agenda.

Right, it isn't 2012, and OKC ain't Boston. $30 million in Boston money- what would the conversion rate be for OKC? Ed is merely asking the pertinent questions obvious questions as should a good steward and is branded anti-mo and an obstructionist.

[OSUFan]

Right, it isn't 2012, and OKC ain't Boston. $30 million in Boston money- what would the conversion rate be for OKC? Ed is merely asking the pertinent questions obvious questions as should a good steward and is branded anti-mo and an obstructionist.

I would say he is doing more than asking question.

[Midtowner]

Don't you mean the CoC? And taking public money for other contract work doesn't mean all the work you do is suddenly the public's, right?

Right. And there is nothing about the CoC which is a public document unless it was paid for with public money. Then that's more of a gray area. I actually know of an AG's opinion which took a CoC-like group, the old Oklahoma Industry Authority had to turn over its records. I think Alliance, depending on its structure could be more public/private, but even then, I think them having confidential records is questionable unless some sort of privilege applies.

[Urban Pioneer]

Great post BDP. Do you mind if I repost that to Facebook?

[OKVision4U]

I would say he is doing more than asking question.

That is called the "Polite while Slashing & Burning" maneuver when (just doing a little looking into / good stewardship) regarding the MAPS3 Already Voted By the People Convention Center.