Access Oklahoma Turnpike Projects

[jedicurt]

Telling the city of Norman that they shouldn't negotiate with OTA. I'm sure that will work out for them.

https://kfor.com/news/local/city-of-...ental-impacts/

and there exactly is the separation on this project... The city of Norman is having these discussions, and agreeing and working deals with the OTA... this project is happening. The cities involved are okay with them, the State is okay with them, the State Supreme Court is okay with it... if the real concern is the watershed around lake thunderbird, then Pike Off, needs to start talking with the OTA about alternatives that aren't just "don't build it" and they might actually be heard.

[BoulderSooner]

Telling the city of Norman that they shouldn't negotiate with OTA. I'm sure that will work out for them.

https://kfor.com/news/local/city-of-...ental-impacts/

these are unserious people

“Imagine that you are in the later days of the Roman Empire. You wake up one morning and you go outside and you see that there’s a group of Visigoths camped outside your town. And so at this point, you have two choices. You can alert the town and try to prevent an invasion, or you can form a study committee to try to mitigate the damage that will come from the looting and destruction is sure to follow.”

[BoulderSooner]

if the real concern is the watershed around lake thunderbird, then Pike Off, .

it was never the real concern .. it was the next concern after the other failed ..

[jn1780]

these are unserious people

“Imagine that you are in the later days of the Roman Empire. You wake up one morning and you go outside and you see that there’s a group of Visigoths camped outside your town. And so at this point, you have two choices. You can alert the town and try to prevent an invasion, or you can form a study committee to try to mitigate the damage that will come from the looting and destruction is sure to follow.”

The irony of that comparison. The Roman Empire would just build a road or coliseum wherever they felt like. Probably make someone disappear in the middle in the night if you complained too much.

[BoulderSooner]

https://www.citynewsokc.com/news/ana...e67b034ab.html

...No studies had been done at the time to prove a "public need" that justified a governmental exercise of eminent domain, and indeed, to this day (July 27, 2024), over two years later, not a single study has been attempted to justify Governor Kevin Stitt's heavy-handed approach in using the OTA to satisfy his toll road ambitions.

In 2023 AG Drummond requested an audit of OTA by the State Auditor, Byrd. Audit still pending

Now comes Norman Ward 5 City Councilperson Michael Nash with what could be a true turnpike stopper. His "RESOLUTION TO PROTECT AND PRESERVE THE LAKE THUNDERBIRD WATERSHED, THE CANADIAN RIVER CORRIDOR, THE CITY’S DRINKING WATER SUPPLY, AND THE CITY’S FLOOD HAZARD AREAS" leaves few stones unturned.

The resolution uses the law as its foundation, starting with 11 OK Stat § 37-115, which states, in part, "No person, firm, partnership, or corporation, or any of the partners, officers, managers, or employees thereof, shall pollute or permit the pollution of the water supply of a municipality, or any stream, pond, spring, lake, or other water reservoir or groundwater aquifer, which is used or which is being held for use as a water supply by a municipality. A municipality may bring an action in the district court to enjoin any activity that will cause pollution of the water supply of a municipality whether or not such activity is regulated, licensed, or inspected."

That's it, and since the OTA pollutes everything it touches, it should be a no-brainer. Using this foundation, it is clear to see that powers have been given to Cities to control what happens to their water supply. The old saw that "State trumps city" falls apart under this sort of scrutiny. This time, City trumps the State.

As if that weren't enough, the resolution goes on to cite the City’s Flood Hazard Ordinance, Water Quality Protection Zone Ordinance, the Oklahoma Floodplain Management Act, and the National Pollutant Discharge System Stormwater Program, Phase II MS Compliance. If enacted by the City Council, this could be a true turnpike stopper.



Years, if ever away.

how is this working out for you??

To that end, Pike Off members called on the city council to adopt a resolution, which would formally commit the city to oppose the toll roads, and commit to “the protection and preservation of the watershed” serving the area.

The council did not take any action Tuesday evening.

[Jersey Boss]

how is this working out for you??

Lol, bless your heart.

[Plutonic Panda]

Another article for anybody that wants to read it. It’s about the protesters and the OTA’s Response.

https://okcfox.com/news/local/broken...nst-turnpikes#

[aDark]

I'm *not* taking sides on the turnpike issue or the arena issue in Norman. I understand how each side feels the other is woefully wrong.

That said, I do want to point out that the citizens of Norman who are against something come out in really strong numbers. I feel like I read about a protest of some kind in Norman every other month and I'm always impressed by the turnout.

Kudos to involved citizens.

[BoulderSooner]

Another article for anybody that wants to read it. It’s about the protesters and the OTA’s Response.

https://okcfox.com/news/local/broken...nst-turnpikes#

TLDR is that if norman wants input on the east west connector (ie getting the OTA To build frontage roads ) they need to commit to playing ball by sept 1 ..

[rcjunkie]

If someone knocked on your door and told you they were taking ownership of your land/property you've owned for years, you would likely fight it until the end as well.

I woulkd say where's the check, load my truck and move to my cabin in Ozark Arkansas

[MagzOK]

TLDR is that if norman wants input on the east west connector (ie getting the OTA To build frontage roads ) they need to commit to playing ball by sept 1 ..

Yep. If they were smart they'd totally do that. I mean, service roads can equal future revenue. Look at all the commercial development along the service roads of the major highways in Dallas, per se.

[TornadoKegan]

How i see it is If Lake Thunderbird is the Issue, Negotiate for the route to go a 1/2 mile to a mile to the west that goes west of the lake. posting Potentially Disturbing Images to scare people into being on your side and Screaming WILL NOT get you anything but thrown out of any public meeting. Its going down in the ground regardless if their idea about the watershed is true. Most of Moore will need to go, Normans Only Airport would also have to go, Parts of Tinker AFB would need to go as well. They are Asking for a mess by making the waterrshed a issue

[Plutonic Panda]

It's just one excuse after the other. First it was the rose rocks, Now it's watershed. They're just trying to delay the inevitable.

[Snowman]

How i see it is If Lake Thunderbird is the Issue, Negotiate for the route to go a 1/2 mile to a mile to the west that goes west of the lake. posting Potentially Disturbing Images to scare people into being on your side and Screaming WILL NOT get you anything but thrown out of any public meeting. Its going down in the ground regardless if their idea about the watershed is true. Most of Moore will need to go, Normans Only Airport would also have to go, Parts of Tinker AFB would need to go as well. They are Asking for a mess by making the waterrshed a issue

Shifting the part currently closest to north side of Thunderbird more north/south could make it more direct to 40, giving the east side of Norman a better path to OKC than 35, which is already past it's capacity during peak hours and likely getting worse by the time this is completed.

[TornadoKegan]

They are wanting the First Section of the East-West Connector Drivable by the End of 2027 with construction starting at the end of next year. those on Indian hills in the way from I-44 and OK 37 to Midwest Blvd will receive eminent domain notices Within the Next 365 Days

[The]

I'm very excited for this new connection. And if the interchange they've been displaying is what gets built, hell yeah. Should make getting to Norman even quicker for OU games. I won't hold my breath for that stack interchange though.

[Plutonic Panda]

I'm very excited for this new connection. And if the interchange they've been displaying is what gets built, hell yeah. Should make getting to Norman even quicker for OU games. I won't hold my breath for that stack interchange though.

I’ve talked to the OTA and they’ve assured me this will in fact be a Texas style five stack. But I didn’t really ask whether or not it was going to be built in phases. I’m just going based off of what I read. Hopefully it’s all built and not in piecemeal fashion.

[bombermwc]

I dont recall seeing them typically doing phases for projects like that. They like to get segments done all at once. It wouldn't do them any good to not have the interchange but have the road anyway.

Now can get the money to do it on their timeline? Not sure. Worse case there, it delays a year for more to flow in.

Sort of like how it's going to be 15 years before Turner is 3 lane all the way to OKC at the pace their going. So we'll just have to deal with 15 years of construction nightmares there that slow you down. Good thing is there, when you get "released" to the completed section, you can go 85 now to make up the time. I mean 80 right, because everyone goes on the speed limit...cough cough.

[David]

I'm very excited for this new connection. And if the interchange they've been displaying is what gets built, hell yeah. Should make getting to Norman even quicker for OU games. I won't hold my breath for that stack interchange though.

Are there renderings of it that could be posted? I haven't see any fun graphics yet.

[warreng88]

I dont recall seeing them typically doing phases for projects like that. They like to get segments done all at once. It wouldn't do them any good to not have the interchange but have the road anyway.

Now can get the money to do it on their timeline? Not sure. Worse case there, it delays a year for more to flow in.

Sort of like how it's going to be 15 years before Turner is 3 lane all the way to OKC at the pace their going. So we'll just have to deal with 15 years of construction nightmares there that slow you down. Good thing is there, when you get "released" to the completed section, you can go 85 now to make up the time. I mean 80 right, because everyone goes on the speed limit...cough cough.

And when the Turner is done, they will need to start work again on the older areas... And when those are done... It's like the Golden Gate Bridge...

[josefromtulsa]

Yep. If they were smart they'd totally do that. I mean, service roads can equal future revenue. Look at all the commercial development along the service roads of the major highways in Dallas, per se.

And this is why highway construction is just going to lead to more sprawl and eventually this highway will be full of traffic as well. And then the "outer outer" loop will need to be built as part of OTAs 2035 BUILD bond.

This is all just masked corruption to make money for the construction magnates, land owners, and developers while the actual transportation issue will remain unsolved.

[MagzOK]

And this is why highway construction is just going to lead to more sprawl and eventually this highway will be full of traffic as well. And then the "outer outer" loop will need to be built as part of OTAs 2035 BUILD bond.

This is all just masked corruption to make money for the construction magnates, land owners, and developers while the actual transportation issue will remain unsolved.

The highways were needed 10 years ago.

[catcherinthewry]

And this is why highway construction is just going to lead to more sprawl and eventually this highway will be full of traffic as well. And then the "outer outer" loop will need to be built as part of OTAs 2035 BUILD bond.

That's like saying we shouldn't build any new schools because they are just going to fill up and we'll have to build new ones

[Laramie]

I’ve talked to the OTA and they’ve assured me this will in fact be a Texas style five stack. But I didn’t really ask whether or not it was going to be built in phases. I’m just going based off of what I read. Hopefully it’s all built and not in piecemeal fashion.

Doubt if you'll see many of these five stacks in Oklahoma City area until you see Edmond 98,300 - Norman 130,000 (North-South), Yukon-El Reno 50,000 and Shawnee 31,000 (West-East) approach 100,000 population on the edge of the outter spoke wheel.

[mugofbeer]

And this is why highway construction is just going to lead to more sprawl and eventually this highway will be full of traffic as well. And then the "outer outer" loop will need to be built as part of OTAs 2035 BUILD bond.

This is all just masked corruption to make money for the construction magnates, land owners, and developers while the actual transportation issue will remain unsolved.

Yeah, you just keep on with that paranoid hand-wringing.