BOK Park Plaza

[KayneMo]

Not to rub it in any more (lol), but had there been 5 more floors at the typical 14' per floor, BOK Park Plaza would have been the 2nd tallest in the city, surpassing Chase Tower by 3 feet.

[Sancho]

DC . .. that's the point, it appears nobody on this forum wants to HEAR to the opinion of expats.

Nobody said OKC was another Seattle nor did anybody expect OKC should have the same skyline. What I DID say was that it BOKPP might be the LAST and only time OKC will add another skyscraper of significant height, too bad it isn't above 500 ft. .. This is reality, because as everyone on here mentions - OKC is not Seattle (where we are adding multiples already as we speak), so likely there wont be another 500 ft tower because it is not needed (or speculated, since it is such a bad thing for OKC... ).

Hmm, .. My conclusion on this are (after I don't know, so many times trying to state/restate my opinion offering constructive criticism) - Ill now chose to refrain from my enthusiasm for OKC on this board because - I see that despite OKC being a much better city than when I grew up (including people now proud of and even defending OKC), the city/people still has a defeatist, 2nd-rate attitude. The "well, better than nothing" is still prevalent and if somebody says otherwise then it's not taken constructively but instead ridiculed/even attacked. Truth is, you'll never compete against Tier II markets if you don't think big, take a chance.

Too bad, because I actually am about to close on a house in OKC and was looking forward to being part of the community - again. GoPokes - I actually had an idea to actively promote the idea of opening an OKC office for my company (a major IT player, btw) however, Ill shelve that as I don't think people in my industry would fit. ... No wonder the potential relocation from San Fran (and elsewhere. ..) never even got traction - just look at this forum and you get an idea of OKC's culture.

Given the reaction to my posts; rather than lending a constructive, big city prospective I'll now focus my attention elsewhere and wont waste my time posting on here. I suppose OKC getting the NBA was 'good enough'. ..

I think Steve L might have been right after-all. ... Signing out!

Last Post on OKCTalk. 4,476

LMAO. That is not how business decisions are made.

[Pete]

DC . .. that's the point, it appears nobody on this forum wants to HEAR to the opinion of expats.

Nobody said OKC was another Seattle nor did anybody expect OKC should have the same skyline. What I DID say was that it BOKPP might be the LAST and only time OKC will add another skyscraper of significant height, too bad it isn't above 500 ft. .. This is reality, because as everyone on here mentions - OKC is not Seattle (where we are adding multiples already as we speak), so likely there wont be another 500 ft tower because it is not needed (or speculated, since it is such a bad thing for OKC... ).

Hmm, .. My conclusion on this are (after I don't know, so many times trying to state/restate my opinion offering constructive criticism) - Ill now chose to refrain from my enthusiasm for OKC on this board because - I see that despite OKC being a much better city than when I grew up (including people now proud of and even defending OKC), the city/people still has a defeatist, 2nd-rate attitude. The "well, better than nothing" is still prevalent and if somebody says otherwise then it's not taken constructively but instead ridiculed/even attacked. Truth is, you'll never compete against Tier II markets if you don't think big, take a chance.

Too bad, because I actually am about to close on a house in OKC and was looking forward to being part of the community - again. GoPokes - I actually had an idea to actively promote the idea of opening an OKC office for my company (a major IT player, btw) however, Ill shelve that as I don't think people in my industry would fit. ... No wonder the potential relocation from San Fran (and elsewhere. ..) never even got traction - just look at this forum and you get an idea of OKC's culture.

Given the reaction to my posts; rather than lending a constructive, big city prospective I'll now focus my attention elsewhere and wont waste my time posting on here. I suppose OKC getting the NBA was 'good enough'. ..

Last Post on OKCTalk. 4,476

I was an ex-pat for 25 years until about a year ago. We still have a bunch of others.

Has nothing to do about where you live. Put opinions out there, expect others to express their's as well.

[dankrutka]

I was an ex-pat for 25 years until about a year ago. We still have a bunch of others.

Has nothing to do about where you live. Put opinions out there, expect others to express their's as well.

+1

[Laramie]

DC . .. that's the point, it appears nobody on this forum wants to HEAR to the opinion of expats.

Nobody said OKC was another Seattle nor did anybody expect OKC should have the same skyline. What I DID say was that it BOKPP might be the LAST and only time OKC will add another skyscraper of significant height, too bad it isn't above 500 ft. .. This is reality, because as everyone on here mentions - OKC is not Seattle (where we are adding multiples already as we speak), so likely there wont be another 500 ft tower because it is not needed (or speculated, since it is such a bad thing for OKC... ).

Hmm, .. My conclusion on this are (after I don't know, so many times trying to state/restate my opinion offering constructive criticism) - Ill now chose to refrain from my enthusiasm for OKC on this board because - I see that despite OKC being a much better city than when I grew up (including people now proud of and even defending OKC), the city/people still has a defeatist, 2nd-rate attitude. The "well, better than nothing" is still prevalent and if somebody says otherwise then it's not taken constructively but instead ridiculed/even attacked. Truth is, you'll never compete against Tier II markets if you don't think big, take a chance.

Too bad, because I actually am about to close on a house in OKC and was looking forward to being part of the community - again. GoPokes - I actually had an idea to actively promote the idea of opening an OKC office for my company (a major IT player, btw) however, Ill shelve that as I don't think people in my industry would fit. ... No wonder the potential relocation from San Fran (and elsewhere. ..) never even got traction - just look at this forum and you get an idea of OKC's culture.

Given the reaction to my posts; rather than lending a constructive, big city prospective I'll now focus my attention elsewhere and wont waste my time posting on here. I suppose OKC getting the NBA was 'good enough'. ..

I think Steve L might have been right after-all. ... Signing out!

Last Post on OKCTalk. 4,476

Hope you continue to post here; let's discard this knee jerk reaction to posters who don't agree with you. Moving causes a lot of stress, so take a deep breath and a temporary vacation from the forum--then return.

Glad to hear that you have faith in OKC or you wouldn't be moving back. Continue your mission to return and make a difference as Pete has done.

Would love for you to join: Oklahoma City Thunderfans' community (Betts message board):
http://www.thunderfans.com/vforum/index.php We have some other topics besides the Thunder; please check it out.

Welcome you & your family back to Oklahoma City, HOT ROD!

You can make a difference; stay focused my friend. You're an original...

[OkieNate]

Will the crown consist of the tubular steel like the Devon crown does? Also, will there be a topping off celebration with a tree like Devon and a few other projects have had?

[Pete]

Will the crown consist of the tubular steel like the Devon crown does? Also, will there be a topping off celebration with a tree like Devon and a few other projects have had?

I'm not sure of the construction but you can bet there will be a topping off ceremony.

That should happen in the next 3-4 weeks I would estimate.

[tyeomans]

This may be a stupid question, but what is the building just to the left of BOKPP? Is this just for decoration, or is there something in the works for the lot directly south of it?

[Pete]

This may be a stupid question, but what is the building just to the left of BOKPP? Is this just for decoration, or is there something in the works for the lot directly south of it?

That was the proposed OG&E / Clayco development that has now completely stalled:

http://www.okctalk.com/showthread.php?t=38469

[tyeomans]

Is it stalled indefinitely? Or will it pick back up?

[Pete]

Is it stalled indefinitely? Or will it pick back up?

Those old plans are completely out the window.

OG&E says they will eventually build on that site but no telling what and when.

[tyeomans]

That's a shame. I love the look of the buildings. So different from what we currently have. It would have been a lovely campus.

[hoya]

Companies will build taller buildings when it makes economic sense to do so.

Right now, we're still in the first wave of new downtown construction post urban renewal. There are lots and lots of, well, lots that are still empty. As long as we've got grassy fields and surface parking all over downtown, we'll continue to get 4 and 5 story developments all over the place. We're in a position where you can get $200 to $300 per square foot rent for a wooden frame apartment, where financing for these types of buildings is easily available. That's really easy money. Builders aren't going to turn that down.

As a result, until all the low hanging fruit is gone, and all the big lots downtown and near-downtown are filled, we're going to continue to see developers make this type of investment. Eventually the economics of this will change. There won't be big lots still available. We'll get enough downtown housing so that you won't be able to throw together a wooden frame 4 story apartment building with EIFS exterior and still get $250 per square foot rent. You'll have to build taller, you'll have to build nicer. When that happens, we'll start to see high rise apartment buildings and other things like that.

I think OKC can support 5 or 6 apartment towers. But nobody is going to take that kind of risk until all the easy stuff is gone. The good news is, this process that we're going through is resulting in the development of real urban neighborhoods. The shops and restaurants and other amenities increase the property values and are what justify the higher price per square foot. But before any of that happens, we'll have to fill out these larger sections of vacant land. OKC will get more highrises, but we can't expect companies to blow hundreds of millions of dollars on vanity height.

Depending on how things go with the tower on 4th and EKG, and with the First National redevelopment, we could see banks become a lot more comfortable with lending money for projects like that. We also probably need to see the price of oil and gas go way back up before expecting another big office tower.

[Laramie]

Companies will build taller buildings when it makes economic sense to do so.

Depending on how things go with the tower on 4th and EKG, and with the First National redevelopment, we could see banks become a lot more comfortable with lending money for projects like that. We also probably need to see the price of oil and gas go way back up before expecting another big office tower.

We are becoming more energy independent. Trump's recent approval (Keystone & Dakota Access oil pipelines) will have some affect on the future prices for energy (oil & gas).

BOK Park Plaza Tower will be the last of the 400 ft., plus high towers in OKC for now. Just don't foresee OG&E or Continental Resources building anything potentially new in the future (2020-2025).

[2Lanez]

Griping here should be about sprawl. If more people/business/money were focused downtown, more would be possible. Move a few of the big new corporate headquarters buildings on Memorial Road or Northwest Expressway to downtown, and the skyline is more impressive.

[HangryHippo]

Griping here should be about sprawl. If more people/business/money were focused downtown, more would be possible. Move a few of the big new corporate headquarters buildings on Memorial Road or Northwest Expressway to downtown, and the skyline is more impressive.

Exactly.

[_Kyle]

I honestly feel like we will get plenty of 400+ tall buildings in the next 10 years there are a lot of companies that have the potential to build offices downtown.

[OKCRT]

OG&E needs to get off the pot and build that 27 story building at the stage site. Or was it just a ruise to get the property and tear the Stage Center down? I remember there was another bidder that was ready to build but Rainey (never to be heard from again) won the bid with his spectacular project with Clayco. Seems like a scam to me.

[hoya]

We are becoming more energy independent. Trump's recent approval (Keystone & Dakota Access oil pipelines) will have some affect on the future prices for energy (oil & gas).

BOK Park Plaza Tower will be the last of the 400 ft., plus high towers in OKC for now. Just don't foresee OG&E or Continental Resources building anything potentially new in the future (2020-2025).

My guess is that by 2020, all the easily available stuff in the downtown area will have mostly filled up, except for the areas where they're starting all new neighborhoods. Deep Deuce, Midtown, and Auto Alley will be mostly full. Strawberry Fields will be just starting. Producers Co-Op will be still in "thinking about maybe starting" phase. So if you want to build in an area where there's already stuff there, you will have to build up.

The FNC housing should be a huge success. I have no doubt it will fill up fast once they finish their renovations. 4th and EKG, if it gets off the ground, will probably also be successful. So by 2020, we'll be seeing a conference hotel and an apartment tower, both in the 200 - 250 foot range. While not amazing, they would bulk out the skyline fairly well. While height is great, bulk is also important.

If FNC and the EKG tower are successful, and if OKC's downtown housing demand is still high, then I think around 2020 you'll see banks becoming more confident about loaning money for high rise residential. It will go slowly at first. You'll have one or two builders dipping their toes into the water. This would be one or two more buildings, probably in the 200 - 250 foot range. Again, nothing remotely like Devon, but it's more bulk for the skyline. If that round of residential is successful, then you'll have several builders try to jump on the bandwagon and propose more high rises. At least one or two of them would be in the 300 to 400 foot range. I think that's a reasonable expectation by about 2025 to 2030. Maybe 4-5 new residential high rises (beyond what is proposed today) that add depth to our skyline, if not height.

In that same time period, I think we're looking at probably one more oil and gas related tower, and one more spec office tower. Those would be timed whenever the next oil boom is. Some company will be swimming in money and will decide to make their statement like Devon did. Perhaps once Hamm retires, whoever replaces him will feel the need to make Continental Resources stand out. Or it could be some other company flush with cash. Whatever gets built, I doubt it will be the size of Devon, but breaking 500 feet would be a reasonable goal.

This is all wild speculation of course, but I think it's in line with what OKC can reasonably support. If all that comes to pass, we'd be looking at up to 9 new towers here in the next 15 years or so. That would be a huge addition to our skyline, even if none of the buildings individually are that big.

[_Kyle]

My guess is that by 2020, all the easily available stuff in the downtown area will have mostly filled up, except for the areas where they're starting all new neighborhoods. Deep Deuce, Midtown, and Auto Alley will be mostly full. Strawberry Fields will be just starting. Producers Co-Op will be still in "thinking about maybe starting" phase. So if you want to build in an area where there's already stuff there, you will have to build up.

The FNC housing should be a huge success. I have no doubt it will fill up fast once they finish their renovations. 4th and EKG, if it gets off the ground, will probably also be successful. So by 2020, we'll be seeing a conference hotel and an apartment tower, both in the 200 - 250 foot range. While not amazing, they would bulk out the skyline fairly well. While height is great, bulk is also important.

If FNC and the EKG tower are successful, and if OKC's downtown housing demand is still high, then I think around 2020 you'll see banks becoming more confident about loaning money for high rise residential. It will go slowly at first. You'll have one or two builders dipping their toes into the water. This would be one or two more buildings, probably in the 200 - 250 foot range. Again, nothing remotely like Devon, but it's more bulk for the skyline. If that round of residential is successful, then you'll have several builders try to jump on the bandwagon and propose more high rises. At least one or two of them would be in the 300 to 400 foot range. I think that's a reasonable expectation by about 2025 to 2030. Maybe 4-5 new residential high rises (beyond what is proposed today) that add depth to our skyline, if not height.

In that same time period, I think we're looking at probably one more oil and gas related tower, and one more spec office tower. Those would be timed whenever the next oil boom is. Some company will be swimming in money and will decide to make their statement like Devon did. Perhaps once Hamm retires, whoever replaces him will feel the need to make Continental Resources stand out. Or it could be some other company flush with cash. Whatever gets built, I doubt it will be the size of Devon, but breaking 500 feet would be a reasonable goal.

This is all wild speculation of course, but I think it's in line with what OKC can reasonably support. If all that comes to pass, we'd be looking at up to 9 new towers here in the next 15 years or so. That would be a huge addition to our skyline, even if none of the buildings individually are that big.

i agree

[UnFrSaKn]

https://twitter.com/stevelackmeyer/s...37032641982464

[_Kyle]

https://twitter.com/stevelackmeyer/s...37032641982464

whats steve talking about?another tower?

[TU 'cane]

whats steve talking about?another tower?

Don't think so. The first parts of his answer are in response to a question asking about BOKPP topping out.
Then he answers about more towers coming and answers about the "Times Square" and Omni hotel projects being the only ones on track.

[_Kyle]

Don't think so. The first parts of his answer are in response to a question asking about BOKPP topping out.
Then he answers about more towers coming and answers about the "Times Square" and Omni hotel projects being the only ones on track.

OHHHHH hes talking about the times square it will be on nw 4th and gaylord forgot about that.

[_Kyle]

From today, just finishing the 26th floor.

One more office floor then the crown.

is the 27th floor done yet?