OKC Commuter Rail

[Spartan]

Though it would definitely improve efficiency, BNSF wouldn't necessarily need to go to double track (DT) or two main track (2MT) operation in order to enable commuter rail - and no grade crossings would have to be eliminated. Several of the lines that Metra runs over have significant sections that are single-track with more than half of their road crossings at grade. You would definitely need at least a siding in single-track areas for stations, however.

I have heard vague rumors that BNSF is thinking of going 2MT on the Red Rock Sub (the North-South BNSF mainline that we're discussing here) because of the level of freight traffic over the line, so if they decide to do that, it could help the RTA as well.

Where does OKC stand with double stacked freight? I know that's been a huge economic development boon for Columbus. It might be a good win-win to help them pay for double-stack lines across the metro and work with the state to enable the line north to Kansas and south to Texas. In addition to the boon that rail transit would be, having double-stack freight access to Texas and Kansas would really make the OKC metro an attractive place for manufacturing.

OKC only has about 2/3rds its natural share of manufacturing jobs, so that sector is under represented. We also talk a lot in a vacuum about "economic diversification" whatever the hell that means. Infrastructure and workforce training are the only two means to prove we mean it when it comes to economic diversification and development. Sadly, we know the state is an unreliable partner toward that end, let alone toward anything that benefits OKC. Mostly because we don't know what we want from the state, and our voters seem to just want more social conservatism and we'll call it good. Only reason I bring that is up is because the state owes us a lot.

[baralheia]

To my knowledge, BNSF's Red Rock Sub, cutting north-south through OKC, has the necessary clearances required to handle double-stack intermodal trains, and I'm almost positive I've seen double-stacks roll through town. Compared to the BSNF Transcon, the transcontinental route through northwest Oklahoma, intermodal volume on the Red Rock Sub pales in comparison - despite it handling the third highest intermodal volume of any rail line in Oklahoma in 2009.

[warreng88]

Not sure where to put this, but I thought this was the most relevant spot. Feel free to move it if you want:

Regional transit could be on track by 2019

By: Brian Brus The Journal Record February 3, 2016

OKLAHOMA CITY – Metro area residents could see a ballot as soon as 2019 to establish governance and funding for a regional transit authority, officials said Wednesday.

Members of the multi-municipality task force examining the question under the umbrella of the Association of Central Oklahoma Governments said the likelihood of creating some sort of cross-metro bus or rail system soon is high. More research is in the works, said Edmond City Council member Victoria Caldwell, but ACOG talks over the last few years suggest the funding structure would involve an equation of population or rider ratios to avoid disproportionate costs.

That assumption is reflected in how the six cities – Edmond, Oklahoma City, Midwest City, Del City, Norman and Moore – have split costs so far. John Johnson, ACOG president, said the cities paid $511,000 for the first year of research, with Oklahoma City contributing about 64 percent of that total.

“This is a new concept for Oklahoma,” Johnson said. “It’s going to take a while politically and to work out the relationship between these six cities. That level of resources shows a serious commitment to the idea, that they’re willing to fund the enterprise as we go down the road.”

Johnson said the task force will meet at least once per month this year to draft the skeleton of an RTA for public review and approval. Each involved city will need to approve the plan for it to take off.

Caldwell said earlier dialogue suggested only a general sense of where primary transit lines might be needed – commuter rail linkages near the University of Oklahoma campus, for example, downtown Oklahoma City and Tinker Air Force Base. Some reorganization of bus routes, or rubber-tire technology, probably will be needed to improve continuity between cities, she said. Edmond’s bus stops at city limits aren’t necessarily near Oklahoma City’s bus stops.

The task force needs an open mind about governance structure, Johnson said, such as whether a single entity should run the full system across multiple transit modes – bus and rail. Task force members cited several examples for comparison such as the Utah Transit Authority, which began as a system of four cities in 1970 and now serves 80 percent of Utah residents across 75 cities in six of the state’s 29 counties.

The Massachusetts Association of Regional Transit Authorities represents perhaps an epitome of how multiple agencies can work together without losing their identities. The state’s 16, densely packed RTAs grew out of state legislation in 1973 to allow contracting for transit services within districts. The MBTA, or Massachusetts Bay Transportation Authority, is the largest and provides transit for the Boston metro.

The Massachusetts RTAs are supported by local taxes as well as state and federal assistance, MARTA spokeswoman Jeannette Orsino said. Regions collaborate with each other on projects as needed, typically paying proportionally by ridership or population with underlying government subsidies ensuring no one is denied service.

Oklahoma City might be more interested in younger systems more to the south and west, Norman Mayor Cindy Rosenthal said, citing examples such as Phoenix, Denver and Dallas. One such system, the Rio Metro Regional Transit District in Albuquerque, New Mexico, was formed in 2003. It is governed by the Mid-Region Council of Governments, which also serves as the agent for the New Mexico Department of Transportation to run the state’s Rail Runner Express commuter train between Belen and Santa Fe.

By early 2005, the New Mexico Transportation Commission approved the formation of the Mid-Region Transit District, encompassing three counties and their cities. The Mid-Region Council of Governments also developed commuter rail between Belen and Santa Fe at about the same time. Ultimately, voters in the three counties approved a one-eighth-of-a-cent tax to fund Rio Metro, with half of the revenue dedicated to rail and half to the overall system. Consolidated bus service came later.

As Orsino said, transit grows and evolves over time. The Oklahoma City metro system drawn up by the task force will certainly go through many changes as more travelers are attracted to it.

“We just don’t know what it’s going to look like yet,” said Michael Scroggins, spokesman for Oklahoma City’s Embark bus system, previously known as COTPA. “There are a lot of models to consider. Is the goal to bring all the bus services under a regional transit authority, or should that only involve commuter rail? It’s going to depend on what the public needs. This is COTPA’s 50th year and we have been the regional funding recipient for all the federal funds in the region, we have the knowledge and experience under our belt of how to navigate that system. It may be that we transition into that role. We just don’t know yet.”

[shawnw]

Maybe it's time for an "RTA" thread?

[Just the facts]

All mass transit metro-wide needs to be brought in under a single entity, that also includes the airport and Amtrak. It maybe should include all forms of non-personal transportation and loop in oversight of Grayhound, Taxis, Uber/Lift, pedicabs, bike lanes, and sidewalks.

Then give it a cool name like GOCART - Greater Oklahoma City Area Regional Transit.

[Urban Pioneer]

GOCART sounds like a kid's toy and not a serious solution, imhop.

How would AMTRAK operate under a regional municipal authority? The only way I can see that work is if you extended the RTA zone all the way down to Marrietta and get each city along the route to help subsidize service. The state would love that but that would be quite a burden for small towns.

[jerrywall]

I don't know... I like GOCART. It's easy to remember, and yeah, at first blush it does sound like something from childhood, until you know what it stands for (and even then, not a bad thing to have positive emotion associate with something you want folks to adopt).

[catch22]

Let's get the thing built first. We can name it any time.

[shawnw]

probably harder to trademark gocart vs the existing Embark. I suspect they nominally disassociated it with a particular region hoping it could be considered for the RTA perhaps...

[Zuplar]

All mass transit metro-wide needs to be brought in under a single entity, that also includes the airport and Amtrak. It maybe should include all forms of non-personal transportation and loop in oversight of Grayhound, Taxis, Uber/Lift, pedicabs, bike lanes, and sidewalks.

Then give it a cool name like GOCART - Greater Oklahoma City Area Regional Transit.

GOCART is the absolute coolest name for metro transit. You get an A++ in my book. Any other name other than this is going to be a complete disappointment in my book.

[AP]

I really like the name too....

[Mississippi Blues]

Better than the SLUT in Seattle. I know that's an acronym appointed by residents and not its official name, but still.

[baralheia]

I'm pretty ambivalent about GOCART - it wouldn't be a bad name, and we could do much worse with acronyms and initialisms - but honestly, I really prefer the Embark name. Embark just sounds much more professional to me, and it's an already established brand. Additionally, as the largest transit agency of the RTA member cities, the rebranding effort would cost less if the smaller cities adopted the Embark brand as part of the RTA.

[Just the facts]

GOCART sounds like a kid's toy and not a serious solution, imhop.

How would AMTRAK operate under a regional municipal authority? The only way I can see that work is if you extended the RTA zone all the way down to Marrietta and get each city along the route to help subsidize service. The state would love that but that would be quite a burden for small towns.

They only part of Amtrak that would fall under a regional transportation authority would be the lease agreement at Santa Fe station and the schedule of any service expansion - but all transportation should fall under one organization that actually cares about non-automobile transit.

[hoya]

Better than the SLUT in Seattle. I know that's an acronym appointed by residents and not its official name, but still.

I would go to Seattle just to ride their SLUT, over and over again. I don't think you could get me off of their SLUT, as a matter of fact.

[Laramie]

A sure way to get caught riding the SLUT would be to get stuck.

[HOT ROD]

Better than the SLUT in Seattle. I know that's an acronym appointed by residents and not its official name, but still.

South Lake Union Trolley actually WAS the official name until the media highlighted the negative connotation of riding the SLUT. I think the substituted Streetcar for Trolley. ... But we all still call it the SLUT. A SLUT with lipstick on her is still a SLUT.

[ljbab728]

For those who are interested in getting involved.

http://www.acogok.org/acog-seeks-pub...tral-oklahoma/

[Plutonic Panda]

http://journalrecord.com/2016/09/16/...-general-news/

10 Billion dollars investment into transit to 2040. I'm sure they will pump a fair amount into highways, but a good chunk should go to mass transit which could be good for commuter rail.

[warreng88]

ACOG eyes $10 billion transit plan

By: Brian Brus The Journal Record September 16, 2016

OKLAHOMA CITY – The projected costs associated with the Association of Central Oklahoma Governments’ next big undertaking gave Executive Director John Johnson pause.

“$10 billion was a bit of sticker shock for me,” Johnson said. “That’s a pretty significant investment in our transportation infrastructure. So I think it’s important that the public participates with feedback, and they understand there is a plan and what it contains.

“We want people to comment, complain, criticize, whatever, as we go forward with this,” he said.

ACOG recently posted a schedule of public forums on Encompass 2040, the draft plan for an Oklahoma City regional transportation study. The plan will serve as central Oklahoma’s guide for investing more than $10 billion in a multimodal transportation system through 2040. The meetings begin at 1 p.m. Sept. 16 at Capitol Hill Library in Oklahoma City and will run through October.

Johnson said his organization and its member municipalities are trying to get ahead of the residential and business projections for the metro area. Although people might be intimidated by a large cost for the system now, it will be far more expensive if civic leaders wait and react to population growth as it occurs.

A multimodal system must allow for pedestrian traffic, bicycles, rail, buses and streetcars, as well as seamless transitions between each – being able to load bicycles on buses, for example, or dedicating street lanes to high-occupancy vehicles.

The plan has been in the works for five years. Participants include the Central Oklahoma Transportation and Parking Authority, Cleveland Area Rapid Transit, the state Department of Transportation, the Oklahoma Turnpike Authority, Federal Highway Administration and Federal Transit Administration.

The draft provides an outline of major projects, the largest of which will be street and highway maintenance at $5.2 billion. New street and highway construction will cost $2.5 billion, with public transportation systems next at $1.3 billion.

The smaller cost portions of the plan include $322 million for right-of-way property acquisition, $273 million for bicycle and pedestrian projects and $58 million for information technology system improvements.

Johnson said the ACOG group has already identified several probable sources of revenue for the work, such as Federal Highway Administration programs, turnpike revenue, public transportation revolving funds, fuel taxes returned to cities, bonded debt and dedicated sales taxes. Many of those options will require matching local funds.

“We can’t put a list of projects in the plan unless there is a reasonable way to ascertain where that money is going to come from,” he said.

ACOG’s Intermodal Transportation Policy Committee will consider final adoption of Encompass 2040 on Oct. 27.

[baralheia]

Reading through the draft plan summary posted on the ACOG site, it seems like their main focus is on streets and highways; items like the RTA and commuter rail only get a brief mention as an "illustrative project" because of the current lack of funding for implementation. I know the RTA task force is working towards creating the RTA, but they haven't even come to an agreement on boundaries for the transit district - much less getting a public vote on funding the RTA on the schedule. Based on the task force's meeting minutes, it sounds like that vote likely won't come until after the 2018 general election.

In short, much to my dismay, it doesn't sound like that this is really a priority for ACOG, unfortunately.

[HOT ROD]

i got the same feeling, more than half of the cost is for highway and street maintenance??? Isn't there already supposed to be funding and oversight mechanisms for streets and highways? I thought ACOGS regional transit district was to develop Transit within the district not add (or better yet provide) funding for already existing infrastructure.

Appears to be the typical bait and switch action Oklahoman's are used to, bait us with (hey - here is a Commuter Rail study that will take 10+ years to implement; then in the REAL study it's mostly about improving existing roads with a mere mention of Transit and most of that being the Existing Bus system)....

I was hoping/expecting the RTD to come back with a pure transit plan that consisted of $1B for the North-South Commuter Rail (effectively Guthrie/Edmond to Downtown to Norman/Purcell: all stations and rail enhancement/additions and trainsets included), $500M for the E-W Commuter Rail (effectively Shawnee or Choctaw/Harrah to MWC and Tinker to Downtown), $500M for immediate expansion of the existing Embark bus network (including purchases of new hybrid and electric trolley buses), $300M for Embark Commuter Bus Routes (connecting downtown OKC and one or two other major OKC nodes with the major suburbs), maybe $250M for CART and 'other' transit agencies to expand their networks, $200M for Streetcar expansions (downtown districts and the inner city expansions AND new lines at Norman/OU, Edmond/UCO, and maybe WRWA), $200M for Transit Centers across the region, $150M for dedicated HOV in the inner core area of OKC, $100M for transit shelters, $100M for the M&O yard, $100M+ for the downtown METRO station/expansion and bringing Greyhound back, and $50M for the Ops Center.

This $3.5B RTD plan I mention above was my expectation of ACOG, not their so called $10B plan with a slush fund 'guess' of $5.6B in improvements to existing highway/road and only $1B in transit (in total). ....

ODOT's entire annual budget for highways is far less than ACOGs plan so it seems as though ODOT wants ACOG to pay for its mission in the disguise of 'OKC regional transit'.

[Plutonic Panda]

i got the same feeling, more than half of the cost is for highway and street maintenance??? Isn't there already supposed to be funding and oversight mechanisms for streets and highways? I thought ACOGS regional transit district was to develop Transit within the district not add (or better yet provide) funding for already existing infrastructure.

Appears to be the typical bait and switch action Oklahoman's are used to, bait us with (hey - here is a Commuter Rail study that will take 10+ years to implement; then in the REAL study it's mostly about improving existing roads with a mere mention of Transit and most of that being the Existing Bus system)....

I was hoping/expecting the RTD to come back with a pure transit plan that consisted of $1B for the North-South Commuter Rail (effectively Guthrie/Edmond to Downtown to Norman/Purcell: all stations and rail enhancement/additions and trainsets included), $500M for the E-W Commuter Rail (effectively Shawnee or Choctaw/Harrah to MWC and Tinker to Downtown), $500M for immediate expansion of the existing Embark bus network (including purchases of new hybrid and electric trolley buses), $300M for Embark Commuter Bus Routes (connecting downtown OKC and one or two other major OKC nodes with the major suburbs), maybe $250M for CART and 'other' transit agencies to expand their networks, $200M for Streetcar expansions (downtown districts and the inner city expansions AND new lines at Norman/OU, Edmond/UCO, and maybe WRWA), $200M for Transit Centers across the region, $150M for dedicated HOV in the inner core area of OKC, $100M for transit shelters, $100M for the M&O yard, $100M+ for the downtown METRO station/expansion and bringing Greyhound back, and $50M for the Ops Center.

This $3.5B RTD plan I mention above was my expectation of ACOG, not their so called $10B plan with a slush fund 'guess' of $5.6B in improvements to existing highway/road and only $1B in transit (in total). ....

ODOT's entire annual budget for highways is far less than ACOGs plan so it seems as though ODOT wants ACOG to pay for its mission in the disguise of 'OKC regional transit'.

ACOG is an MPO(Metropolitan Planning Organization) for the OKC Metro and MPO's serve every mode of transit. They help fund highway construction in addition to ODOT which can get new projects going that otherwise would not happen without ACOG. Same thing with Metro in Los Angeles that is help funding I-5 north and south improvements in LA County.

[HOT ROD]

our MPO (or Regional Transit District) in Seattle area is not concerned with anything but Transit.

See SoundTransit.

I believe Denver's RTD is similar (transit only).

[catch22]

our MPO (or Regional Transit District) in Seattle area is not concerned with anything but Transit.

See SoundTransit.

I believe Denver's RTD is similar (transit only).

Yes Denver RTD focuses only on improvements to transit. If they touch a roadway it is either for bus stop enhancements or railway crossings.