OKC Boulevard

[Laramie]

Good point, Geographer

I lived in Fort Worth (Green Oaks area, near Ridgemar Mall) in the late 90s. Definitely remember the talk about moving the expressway 4 blocks south as we have recently done here in Oklahoma City.

Really liked how Fort Worth cemented its western & cowboy culture brand; Cowtown is so historic. The old Cowtown Coliseum is as historic as it gets.


The old historic Fort Worth Courthouse, featured on many of the Walker, Texas Ranger episodes along with the magnificent churches in the area highlights Fort Worth.

[Plutonic Panda]

Picture update from OKC Streetcar page



https://www.facebook.com/okcstreetca...e=3&permPage=1

[bradh]

No one's posted it yet, but they're completed punched through the rail line now, anyone know the timeframe for completion of this section?

[rte66man]

No one's posted it yet, but they're completed punched through the rail line now

IMG_2398 by rte66man, on Flickr

[baralheia]

They do still have one more rail bridge to place on the west side before the rail viaduct portion of this project is complete, but it's rather amazing to me to see a hole through there where there was none previously. Wow. We're nearing the home stretch on this section of the Boulevard.

[ABCOKC]

Drove by today and they've finished the intersection of the Boulevard and Oklahoma, even have the stoplights up.

This seemed odd though because Steve's article in the paper the other day seemed to imply that the U-Haul people hadn't yet agreed to allow Oklahoma to cut through what is currently their parking lot and loading dock. Wasn't the plan at one point to have the Boulevard intersect with Compress? Will they be able to get that land from U-Haul so that Oklahoma is continuous? Because if not that intersection could be a complete nightmare.

On another note, what is the plan for the landscaping around the road? Maintaining a sense of connectivity will be crucial to the success of the Maps 3 park and surrounding development, as well as the Producer's Co-Op, but right now (obviously its nowhere near a finished product) the road looks awfully big and uninviting to pedestrians. Hopefully the lanes are narrow or those cars flying off the highway will have no reason to adhere to the (rightfully) artificially low speed limit.

[MagzOK]

I noticed over the weekend driving SB I235 that the offramp to the new OK Boulevard has a speed limit of 35MPH. So once the ramp is open you'll have traffic at 60+MPH and before the ramp curves to the west there are 35MPH signs. I just thought that was interesting.

[baralheia]

If I'm not mistaken, I don't think that's legal, either - I seem to recall that reductions in speed like this must be reduced in 10mph increments (or less) and there's a minimum distance allowed between the signs. Maybe the new boulevard is signed the way it is because it's a different road? I dunno, but it seems foolhardy to slam the speed limit down that low right on the off-ramp.

[MagzOK]

If I'm not mistaken, I don't think that's legal, either - I seem to recall that reductions in speed like this must be reduced in 10mph increments (or less) and there's a minimum distance allowed between the signs. Maybe the new boulevard is signed the way it is because it's a different road? I dunno, but it seems foolhardy to slam the speed limit down that low right on the off-ramp.

That's what I thought, too. Now of course I was going 60ish when I noticed the 35MPH signs and don't recall seeing any gradual incremental drop-off signs, so there could be some there. But I just remember driving by and seeing those and was like, what a sham to be 35MPH and be such a large new road...and coming right off an interstate! lol Oh well.

[warreng88]

If I'm not mistaken, I don't think that's legal, either - I seem to recall that reductions in speed like this must be reduced in 10mph increments (or less) and there's a minimum distance allowed between the signs. Maybe the new boulevard is signed the way it is because it's a different road? I dunno, but it seems foolhardy to slam the speed limit down that low right on the off-ramp.

The speed limit on 44 is 60-65, depending on where you are. The signs in the middle of the off ramps show an exit sign at 40mph. I know this is not the same thing, but one could probably get pulled over for driving 60 on the off ramp if a cop was so inclined. So, I would think since this is an exit onto a city street from a highway, they could effectively drop the speed limit immediately.

[Laramie]

You see a similar concern traveling north on I-44 to the N.W. 10th Street exit ramp that takes you west. The speed drops to 30 mph right at the bend of the curve as you incline onto N.W. 10th Street.

[warreng88]

You see a similar concern traveling north on I-44 to the N.W. 10th Street exit ramp that takes you west. The speed drops to 30 mph right at the bend of the curve as you incline onto N.W. 10th Street.

That's probably a better example as each exit does not have a light that you hit quickly after you exit like 23rd.

[Teo9969]

That's what I thought, too. Now of course I was going 60ish when I noticed the 35MPH signs and don't recall seeing any gradual incremental drop-off signs, so there could be some there. But I just remember driving by and seeing those and was like, what a sham to be 35MPH and be such a large new road...and coming right off an interstate! lol Oh well.

You're singing the song of Plutonic Panda's people

[baralheia]

The new boulevard absolutely should have a slower speed limit, but it just seems weird to have it right at 35mph right on the off ramp. Doesn't seem like they're going to give motorists much room to slow down, and since there's no dedicated exit lane on 235, I could see that causing some serious problems. Seems to me like a more sensible solution would be to have a gradual reduction in speed, to where the 35mph zone would begin at or near the Oklahoma Ave intersection.

[warreng88]

The new boulevard absolutely should have a slower speed limit, but it just seems weird to have it right at 35mph right on the off ramp. Doesn't seem like they're going to give motorists much room to slow down, and since there's no dedicated exit lane on 235, I could see that causing some serious problems. Seems to me like a more sensible solution would be to have a gradual reduction in speed, to where the 35mph zone would begin at or near the Oklahoma Ave intersection.

I am curious if they have to do it because it is going from a highway to a city street. That would be my thought, but I don't know much about it.

[Bill Robertson]

I saw this discussion earlier but didn't want to add this until I verified. Taking the Northbound 235 exit from Eastbound 40 the exit is 25MPH and is pretty much a hard right turn directly from 40. The 25MPH sign is actually on 40 just before the exit.

[warreng88]

I saw this discussion earlier but didn't want to add this until I verified. Taking the Northbound 235 exit from Eastbound 40 the exit is 25MPH and is pretty much a hard right turn directly from 40. The 25MPH sign is actually on 40 just before the exit.

Yeah, but it has it's own lane, so I am curious if that is why they can do that. Although I have seen many almost wrecks because of people not slowing down enough for that turn.

[rte66man]

Those speed limit signs have a yellow background and are advisory only.

http://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/SHSe/shs_2004_2012_sup.pdf
p334

[turnpup]

Those speed limit signs have a yellow background and are advisory only.

http://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/SHSe/shs_2004_2012_sup.pdf
p334

Thank you! I meant to post that yesterday but wanted to fact-check to be sure.

[Bill Robertson]

Yeah, but it has it's own lane, so I am curious if that is why they can do that. Although I have seen many almost wrecks because of people not slowing down enough for that turn.

I used to count the days between them replacing the exit marker sign and when it would be flattened again. I think they've given up and aren't going to put it back this time. They put yellow/black arrows instead.

[Scott5114]

If I'm not mistaken, I don't think that's legal, either - I seem to recall that reductions in speed like this must be reduced in 10mph increments (or less) and there's a minimum distance allowed between the signs. Maybe the new boulevard is signed the way it is because it's a different road? I dunno, but it seems foolhardy to slam the speed limit down that low right on the off-ramp.

Two things—
The gradual speed limit reductions are an Oklahoma-only thing. I don't know if it's a state law or OkDOT policy, but in other states they can and do drop speed limits by more than 10 mph at a time.

Also, as mentioned above, the color of the sign matters. A speed limit on a yellow sign (like most ramp limits) is an advisory speed, calculated by a formula to help the motorist judge how fast to take the ramp. It is not enforceable by police. You can only get tickets for speed limits on white signs.

[rte66man]

Two things—
The gradual speed limit reductions are an Oklahoma-only thing.

The Legislature passed a law back in the mid 90's to that effect. Their reasoning was to greatly reduce the speed traps set up in so many small towns on major highways (Stringtown, Rush Springs, et al) where the speed limit would drop from 70 to 45 in the space of 50 yards.

[rte66man]

The Legislature passed a law back in the mid 90's to that effect. Their reasoning was to greatly reduce the speed traps set up in so many small towns on major highways (Stringtown, Rush Springs, et al) where the speed limit would drop from 70 to 45 in the space of 50 yards.

Scroll down to subsection E for the relevant part:
§47-11-803. When local authorities may and shall alter maximum limits.

A. Whenever local authorities in their respective jurisdictions determine on the basis of an engineering and traffic investigation that the maximum speed permitted under this article is greater or less than is reasonable and safe under the conditions found to exist upon a highway or part of a highway, the local authority may determine and declare a reasonable and safe maximum limit thereon which:

1. Decreases the limit at intersections; or

2. Increases the limit within an urban district, but not to more than sixty-five (65) miles per hour; or

3. Decreases the limit outside an urban district, but not to less than thirty (30) miles per hour.

B. Local authorities in their respective jurisdictions shall determine by an engineering and traffic investigation the proper maximum speed for all arterial streets and shall declare a reasonable and safe maximum limit thereon which may be greater or less than the maximum speed permitted under Section 1-101 et seq. of this title for an urban district.

C. Any altered limit established as hereinabove authorized shall be effective at all times or during hours of darkness or at other times as may be determined when appropriate signs giving notice thereof are erected upon such street or highway.

D. As to streets and highways within the corporate limits which have been constructed or reconstructed with state or federal funds, local authorities shall have joint authority with the Transportation Commission to establish or alter speed limits; provided, however, the speed limit on an interstate highway within such corporate limits shall not be decreased to less than sixty (60) miles per hour; and provided further, that no local authority shall impose speed limits on any such street or highway substantially lower than those justified by the highway design, capacity, and traffic volume as determined by engineering studies.

E. Not more than six such alterations as hereinabove authorized shall be made per mile along a street or highway except in the case of reduced limits at intersections, and the difference between adjacent limits shall not be more than ten (10) miles per hour.

Added by Laws 1961, p. 385, § 11-803, eff. Sept. 1, 1961. Amended by Laws 1991, c. 98, § 5, eff. July 1, 1991; Laws 1996, c. 324, § 2.

[catch22]

Those speed limit signs have a yellow background and are advisory only.

http://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/SHSe/shs_2004_2012_sup.pdf
p334

I am surprised more people on this board did not already know that.

White is the law.
Yellow is a suggestion.
Red is a warning.

[d-usa]

I am surprised more people on this board did not already know that.

White is the law.
Yellow is a suggestion.
Red is a warning.

I don't know if there is any legal basis to this, but I always assumed that if you get in an accident while going faster than the suggested speed you could end up with an "operating a vehicle in a manner unreasonable and improper" ticket.