New State Fair Coliseum

[Pete]

As someone else mentioned, the Cox Center is going away in the near future and it would be nice to have a quality secondary arena for minor league sports and scheduling conflicts with CHK.

[warreng88]

As someone else mentioned, the Cox Center is going away in the near future and it would be nice to have a quality secondary arena for minor league sports and scheduling conflicts with CHK.

Yeah, that was my initial thought and the timing of it makes the most sense.

[BDP]

If your into the equestrian and livestock show business, then this proposal is a no-brainer. If your not then it might seem like a waste of money. Exactly like some people thought the Chesapeake arena renovation was a waste of money.

Which is sort of funny, because it's much easier to see the direct impact in dollars alone with the horse shows than it is with the renovations that helped bring the Thunder to Oklahoma City. I certainly think all of the lifestyle improvements facilitated by MAPS have had a huge impact on making OKC a viable economic destination, but it's a lot harder to get to how much new money it actually generates. I honestly do think that the MAPS improvements have generated benefits that go beyond just what people spend in bricktown when they go to a game or a concert. I think people and companies locate here in part because of all the lifestyle improvements MAPS has been responsible for. But again, it's harder to make the direct correlation to determine a true ROI, even though I believe it is significant.

With the horse shows, you can simply look at the attendance, which is largely from out of state, and estimated their spending and revenue generated from taxes, all while knowing that this is largely new money injected into the economy. So, I think it makes a lot of sense to nurture the industry and try and get it to grow, even though I have little personal interest in horses or horse shows.

[catch22]

On the surface it may seem like a waste but I agree with others that it is a no-brainer that we continue to invest in the fairgrounds for equestrian related uses.

It kind of seems dirty and opposite of what we are trying to attract in OKC, but the reality is most show horse owners are very wealthy, definitely moreso than your average NBA fan. Having outdated facilities and lack of first class amenities for them does reflect poorly on OKC, just like an outdated NBA facility would reflect on us. Also, if I am not mistaken, these shows can last a week long or more, which means they are staying in hotels for a full week or more, eating out in our restaurants. Your out of town NBA attendee might be in town just for one night, and they might aim to spend most of their money on tickets and less on eating out.

With this State Fair Arena upgrade, the coming MAPS3 Convention Center and Hotel, and the previous renovations to the CHK arena -- OKC will be a top-tier amenity provider for all 3 of our major tourist attendees. We will have a state of the art facility catering to each major section. OKC is on the right track here.

[BDP]

@BDP, thanks for that insightful post. My initial reaction to this project was, "why?". Now I'm thinking, "why not?"

No problem. Things can often get dismissed because of personal interest, but, imo, it's really just about the ROI analysis. And given that I'm only talking about the horse shows that this project is catering to, and not the other events it could host, I think there's a lot to like about it. Amenities do matter for promoters when picking venues, and for a 10k venue this looks like it could have some nice features.

Of course, this all depends on how much it will cost and how exactly it will be paid for.

[LakeEffect]

The City accepted Letters of Interest for the actual programming and design of a facility last week... Just an FYI.

[Bill Robertson]

I have to wonder if there would be as many naysayers if this were proposed for the old oil mill coop site or anywhere within a couple minutes of Downtown, Midtown, Deep Deuce, etc.

[_Cramer_]

Call me crazy but I see a lot of potential at the Fair Park, especially with this addition and demolition of the CCC.

Below is a map of potential growth I could see in this area in the next 8-12 years. It includes, hotels, new rail spur out to Yukon/Airport, retail, etc. Reno would make a great spur route with that wide center median. You could have stops here, White Water Bay, Outlet Shoppes, all the way to Czech Hall Rd (Yukon).

[SoonerDave]

No problem. Things can often get dismissed because of personal interest, but, imo, it's really just about the ROI analysis. And given that I'm only talking about the horse shows that this project is catering to, and not the other events it could host, I think there's a lot to like about it. Amenities do matter for promoters when picking venues, and for a 10k venue this looks like it could have some nice features.

Of course, this all depends on how much it will cost and how exactly it will be paid for.

Surely. I guess my thought is that, slowly but surely, it seems we're losing the soul of the Fairgrounds, and it's becoming mostly...horse barns. I get the value of those shows, the value of those visitors, the value of that industry, but I lament the loss of the Fairgrounds...a little bit at a time. Seems the only thing left will be the space needle. Wish someone would come in and put in a contemporary replacement in the vein of what Dallas did at their fairgrounds, but I guess that's another topic for another day.

[Bill Robertson]

Surely. I guess my thought is that, slowly but surely, it seems we're losing the soul of the Fairgrounds, and it's becoming mostly...horse barns. I get the value of those shows, the value of those visitors, the value of that industry, but I lament the loss of the Fairgrounds...a little bit at a time. Seems the only thing left will be the space needle. Wish someone would come in and put in a contemporary replacement in the vein of what Dallas did at their fairgrounds, but I guess that's another topic for another day.

To me that he old "soul" of the Fairgrounds died with the demolition of the Speedway. Now they just need to make it whatever it will be going forward. I wouldn't keep my faith in the Space Needle. It's non functional and won't be repaired. It won't be long before that space (no pun intended) looks good for something else.

[Patrick]

To me that he old "soul" of the Fairgrounds died with the demolition of the Speedway. Now they just need to make it whatever it will be going forward. I wouldn't keep my faith in the Space Needle. It's non functional and won't be repaired. It won't be long before that space (no pun intended) looks good for something else.

More horse barns.

[Pete]

I still like the old exhibit halls that remain.

I was there a few months ago for a car show and brought back tons of fond memories.

But the rest the place has changed so much I'm not too worried about future plans in terms of nostalgia.

In fact, I was feeling a little blue over losing the arena because I remember going to see the Blazers play way back in the 60's, but the truth is I haven't been in there for 30 years and so it's a bit selfish to expect them to keep it.

[SoonerDave]

To me that he old "soul" of the Fairgrounds died with the demolition of the Speedway. Now they just need to make it whatever it will be going forward. I wouldn't keep my faith in the Space Needle. It's non functional and won't be repaired. It won't be long before that space (no pun intended) looks good for something else.

And I personally believe they could repair it...if they wanted to. And they don't...just like they manufactured a reason to raze the speedway. Just disingenuous IMHO.

[warreng88]

I was there a few months ago for a car show and brought back tons of fond memories.

In fact, I was feeling a little blue over losing the arena because I remember going to see the Blazers play way back in the 60's, but the truth is I haven't been in there for 30 years and so it's a bit selfish to expect them to keep it.

I grew up in Tulsa and this is home to my first concert outside of Tulsa, Family Values Tour 1998 featuring Korn, Rammstein, Ice Cube, Limp Bizkit and Orgy. Drove up with 15 friends in two cars and drove back after the show the same night. I just remember my ears ringing and it being a pretty smelly car ride home...

[Sancho]

What good is retractable seating on the upper level?

Oh neat, a very wide walkway up here....

[BDP]

Surely. I guess my thought is that, slowly but surely, it seems we're losing the soul of the Fairgrounds, and it's becoming mostly...horse barns. I get the value of those shows, the value of those visitors, the value of that industry, but I lament the loss of the Fairgrounds...a little bit at a time. Seems the only thing left will be the space needle. Wish someone would come in and put in a contemporary replacement in the vein of what Dallas did at their fairgrounds, but I guess that's another topic for another day.

I get that. And I'd like to see a nicer fairgrounds like Dallas has too. I was just trying to address the concerns of this project being a waste of money. Again, while I'd like to see other improvements, anything that doesn't really cater to the horse shows is sort of a vanity project. The fair itself is only once a year for 10 days or so and is hardly the international draw that some of the twenty or so horse shows we have a year are. So, the immediate return just isn't there.

I'm not trying to run down anyone's nostalgia for or fondness of the fair or things that have been lost along the way. I'm just saying the improving horse facilities and infrastructure does seem to be easily justified by the numbers. Personally, when I see how much space there is at the fairgrounds, I don't really understand how it's become an issue of trading one for the other. Seems like we could do both, as long as there was funding for both.

[stile99]

Call me crazy but I see a lot of potential at the Fair Park, especially with this addition and demolition of the CCC.

Below is a map of potential growth I could see in this area in the next 8-12 years. It includes, hotels, new rail spur out to Yukon/Airport, retail, etc. Reno would make a great spur route with that wide center median. You could have stops here, White Water Bay, Outlet Shoppes, all the way to Czech Hall Rd (Yukon).

All things old are new again. It wasn't that long ago that we spent money digging/covering up the rails that were there from the days of old along sections of Reno.

[Bill Robertson]

And I personally believe they could repair it...if they wanted to. And they don't...just like they manufactured a reason to raze the speedway. Just disingenuous IMHO.

I'm sure I've said before. An old friend of mine that I started working with 30 years ago spent many years as the Fairgrounds electrician. I worked with him then when he needed help and we both contract with the Fairgrounds now. The reasons given of the Speedway being too expensive to rewire to code was absolute crap. Complete fabrication. The needle, not so much. I've been in the control "bunker". It's completely trashed, rusted away, gone. An engineer specializing in elevator controls could start from scratch and design new controls. Then there's the "bunker" itself. The walls are cracked which allowed the flooding and were then made worse by the flooding. The walls are also part of the needle base. So to demolish them the needle would have to be held upright while the walls were rebuilt. That would be an engineering nightmare. I drive I44 every day and love seeing a fond memory that I rode in every fall. But even I don't want the $$$$$$$$$ it would cost to repair the needle spent on it.
On a side note. I also had to get on top of the car at the top of the needle to work on the cameras you can see on the top. That was NOT FUN!! In a light wind that puppy sways a foot or so. And I don't like heights.

[jn1780]

To put a timeline on things, the expo center was officially added to the State Fair's master plan in April of 2009 and the claim's that the State Fair speedway had to close because of electrical repairs came in December of 2009. The new midway sits where the speedway use to be. Seems pretty obvious why they closed the speedway.

[Laramie]

Big League City, continue the momentum.

A new arena at the State Fair Grounds is long overdue. The State Fair Arena opened in 1965 (Original cost $2 million). This structure is 51 years old; with an entire roof that needs to be replaced. State Fair Arena doesn't compare to the old Municipal Auditorium (Civic Center Music Hall). Let's not continue to put bandages on this antiquated structure.

The horse industry brings in a lot of tourists to Oklahoma City--the horse show capital of the world.; an industry that brings in new dollars to our community. We're positioned in the geographic center of the United States (I-35/I-40 Crossroads).

We could bring back the 5A - 6A High school basketball finals.
Bid for the National College Finals Rodeo.
Continue to make OKC more attractive to the horse show industry.

A 10,000-seat arena could accommodate the return of AA or AAA ice hockey which would be an added incentive. City leaders are thinking outside the box with plans for the future.


By the looks of the drawings by Populous, the arena has room for a modest future expansion. The Oklahoma State Fairgrounds has plenty of paved parking to accommodate an arena of this size. Let's get started.

Fort Worth, Texas is OKC's competition. They would love to pluck some of our horse show events & activities. We have to maintain and continue to upgrade our facilities at Fair Park.

[OKCRT]

I have to wonder if there would be as many naysayers if this were proposed for the old oil mill coop site or anywhere within a couple minutes of Downtown, Midtown, Deep Deuce, etc.

Prob more naysayers if they tried to build this at the Co-OP site. Not nearly Grand enough for that site IMO. This would be a massive let down.

[Bill Robertson]

Prob more naysayers if they tried to build this at the Co-OP site. Not nearly Grand enough for that site IMO. This would be a massive let down.

OK. That site I should have left out.

[mugofbeer]

I wonder what the feasability would be to cut a canal from the river into the fairgrounds? There is already a large drainage cut. Could bring the water taxis to another high tourist area. Might also attract some new development to the south of the 'grounds and provide the fairgoers with another attraction.

[bradh]

Ugh that's a long water taxi treck

[mugofbeer]

Use your imagination. The river to main St. in Bricktown would have been dull if not for what developed along it. Build a new arena, encourage some new hotels or a soccer stadium on the south side ...who knows?