State Capitol Building

[rte66man]

Sorry, the math I got from the other post was a little off. The building is 450,000 square feet and the state has already allocated a massive $120 million or about $267 per square foot to repair the building. But that isn’t enough, they want another $124 million bringing the total cost up to $542 per square foot. That’s not counting the $65 million for a parking garage, landscaping and archway to show off the grandeur of the state that has cut the most education spending nationally, by far.

$542 per square foot for repairs? Almost DOUBLE the square foot cost to construct the Devon tower?

Seriously, the building is just a large mid-rise box with a big dome on top and marble façade. And the dome is newish. What on earth is so expensive?

I have to wonder if you've ever visited the Capitol building with your comments. Your ignorance of modern building codes is also showing. The earlier "repairs" were concentrated in limited areas (restrooms, 1st floor west, etc). The lack of any climate control in the public areas is criminal. THat lack is causing irreparable damage to the artwork. I could go on, but my time on the soapbox is almost up.

[Spartan]

Sorry, the math I got from the other post was a little off. The building is 450,000 square feet and the state has already allocated a massive $120 million or about $267 per square foot to repair the building. But that isn’t enough, they want another $124 million bringing the total cost up to $542 per square foot. That’s not counting the $65 million for a parking garage, landscaping and archway to show off the grandeur of the state that has cut the most education spending nationally, by far.

$542 per square foot for repairs? Almost DOUBLE the square foot cost to construct the Devon tower?

Seriously, the building is just a large mid-rise box with a big dome on top and marble façade. And the dome is newish. What on earth is so expensive?

Your math isn't a little off. It's a lot off.

You're just objecting to state dollars being spent in the state's largest city by far...

[Bellaboo]

Restoration of historic structures has to be more costly than new construction i'd think. Imagine replacing plumbing and wiring on a 5 story 100 year old building with extremely high ceilings. They've also done a restore of the exterior surfaces as well with scaffolding all the way to the top floor.

[Spartan]

Restoration of historic structures has to be more costly than new construction i'd think. Imagine replacing plumbing and wiring on a 5 story 100 year old building with extremely high ceilings. They've also done a restore of the exterior surfaces as well with scaffolding all the way to the top floor.

HP isn't that much more expensive, but we're talking about a nearly all-marble and granite building, to which a cap was added that it could never structurally support.

Swake is double counting things to cover up how far his rhetoric got ahead of himself.

[Swake]

Your math isn't a little off. It's a lot off.

You're just objecting to state dollars being spent in the state's largest city by far...

Why don't you show where my math is off.

Here's more math:

The state is facing a budget shortfall this year of between $600 million and ONE BILLION dollars. State education spending has decreased more than 15% since 2008 on an inflation adjusted and per pupil basis. We can’t even hire enough teachers anymore because the pay and conditions are so bad. The Oklahoma Health Care Authority is already cutting Medicare and SoonerCare payments by 3% this year and have cut $446 million in healthcare for the poor since 2010. Prisons are only staffed for 65% of the amount needed for our prison population.

But by God let’s spend $542 per square foot to restore our capitol. And do it now.

Energy slump, policies contribute to state?s budget shortfall | Examiner Enterprise

Energy slump, policies contribute to state?s budget shortfall | Examiner Enterprise

Budget cuts hurt SoonerCare, official warns | News OK

[Laramie]

The state capitol building showed signs of inefficiencies (crumbling) before it was crowned with a long overdue dome. The addition of the dome structure only hastened what was needed to be done in the first place.

This is our state house, a centerpiece for Oklahoma's government. At one time it was the only Roman Corinthian style capitol building without a dome.

Don't know what the final price tag will be for repairs; however, we need to get this completed.

I know that there are concerns that an additional penny sales tax increase for education could cause problems for OKC future MAPS IV momentum (no new taxes). We need to address the concerns of State Education and those aging building on the capitol grounds in need of repairs. The attention to the badly needed capitol buildings' repairs has been put on hold for far too long.

Oklahoma City should be a proud capital. The capitol buildings are our show piece.

[Bellaboo]

Maybe these shortfalls will force more consolidation of school districts, which should have been deeper in 1987. If they really want to fix education, they need to get rid of the top heavy administrative redundancies. Check out the number of school districts Oklahoma has compared to Florida, which has 3 times the number of students ? You will be shocked, even within our region our administrative overhead is way out of line.

But this is for another thread -

[Just the facts]

I agree Laramie. As for the tax issue, the people of Oklahoma are the ones who decided to live inefficiently and for the most part have vehemently rejected any attempt to live with their means so it is time to shut up and pay up.

[Spartan]

Why don't you show where my math is off.

Here's more math:

The state is facing a budget shortfall this year of between $600 million and ONE BILLION dollars. State education spending has decreased more than 15% since 2008 on an inflation adjusted and per pupil basis. We can’t even hire enough teachers anymore because the pay and conditions are so bad. The Oklahoma Health Care Authority is already cutting Medicare and SoonerCare payments by 3% this year and have cut $446 million in healthcare for the poor since 2010. Prisons are only staffed for 65% of the amount needed for our prison population.

But by God let’s spend $542 per square foot to restore our capitol. And do it now.

Energy slump, policies contribute to state?s budget shortfall | Examiner Enterprise

Energy slump, policies contribute to state?s budget shortfall | Examiner Enterprise

Budget cuts hurt SoonerCare, official warns | News OK

Do you actually believe that capitol complex spending is the reason that the state doesn't have any money for anything?

[dcsooner]

The state capitol building showed signs of inefficiencies (crumbling) before it was crowned with a long overdue dome. The addition of the dome structure only hastened what was needed to be done in the first place.

This is our state house, a centerpiece for Oklahoma's government. At one time it was the only Roman Corinthian style capitol building without a dome.

Don't know what the final price tag will be for repairs; however, we need to get this completed.

I know that there are concerns that an additional penny sales tax increase for education could cause problems for OKC future MAPS IV momentum (no new taxes). We need to address the concerns of State Education and those aging building on the capitol grounds in need of repairs. The attention to the badly needed capitol buildings' repairs has been put on hold for far too long.

Oklahoma City should be a proud capital. The capitol buildings are our show piece.

AGREE! Welll said

[KayneMo]

HP isn't that much more expensive, but we're talking about a nearly all-marble and granite building, to which a cap was added that it could never structurally support.

Swake is double counting things to cover up how far his rhetoric got ahead of himself.

I've never seen anything about the structure not being able to support the dome, only that the cast stone cladding exhibited cracks, not related to any structural problems.

[Swake]

Do you actually believe that capitol complex spending is the reason that the state doesn't have any money for anything?

Where did I say that?

Anyway, How we got here is irrelevant as we are here right now. The state is broke and not fulfilling its real obligations. Make those idiots at the capitol building, you know the ones that actually put Oklahoma in this budget situation, work in a crap hole until they fix the state's real issues. Might be good for them.

I also notice that you aren't addressing your claim that my math is bad. My math is correct, the ask is for $542 per square foot for repairs. That is insane.

[Swake]

Where did I say that?

Anyway, How we got here is irrelevant as we are here right now. The state is broke and not fulfilling its real obligations. Make those idiots at the capitol building, you know the ones that actually put Oklahoma in this budget situation, work in a crap hole until they fix the state's real issues. Might be good for them.

I also notice that you aren't addressing your claim that my math is bad. My math is correct, the ask is for $542 per square foot for repairs. That is insane.

The state declared a revenue failure today. The projected deficit is $900.8 million.
State agencies told to brace for revenue failure as $900 million budget hole expected next year - Tulsa World: Capitol Report

[Jersey Boss]

My priority is for spending on people such as Sooner Care, Education, prison staffing, etc. over edifices. Lock the place up and let the legislature work out of double wides.

[Plutonic Panda]

Contractors: $122 million more needed to finish capitol renovation project | KFOR.com

[kevinpate]

Sheesh. Starting to wonder if it might of been cheaper to have built a big one story structure over near Choctaw.
</snark>

[94GTStang]

Lots of empty buildings downtown politicians can rent out to save some cash.... Ah who are we kidding

[ljbab728]

Lots of empty buildings downtown politicians can rent out to save some cash.... Ah who are we kidding

Actually there is not a lot of empty space downtown. Have you checked the vacancy space recently? Besides that, the capitol renovation has nothing to do with not having enough space and I'm sure you're not suggesting that the state should just abandon the capitol building. LOL

[Just the facts]

Nm

[rte66man]

My priority is for spending on people such as Sooner Care, Education, prison staffing, etc. over edifices. Lock the place up and let the legislature work out of double wides.

What about the other State agencies who are housed there? (State Treasurer, Secretary of State, etc) They aren't exactly awash in $$$. Doublewides for them too?

[shawnw]

Oh come on now, we all knew when we built this capitol on the cheap during MAPS 0 that we'd eventually have to pour more money into it to keep our legislature from moving to another state...

oh, wait...

[Jersey Boss]

What about the other State agencies who are housed there? (State Treasurer, Secretary of State, etc) They aren't exactly awash in $$$. Doublewides for them too?

I should have put the [s] next to my comment. However I do feel it should not be a matter of whether or not the capitol gets repaired or more state services are cut. I believe the choice should be, should the capitol be repaired or should production taxes, income taxes be reduced, or should unaccountable tax credits be continued?

[bombermwc]

What im surprised at is the fact that they expected a renovation project (of a 100 year old building) to go according to plan. How many of us find zero surprises when we do home renovations? Anyone? You have to KNOW you're going to have surprises that are going to cost a lot more money. They should have padded 50% in the original cost. Then we'd be looking at a far lower amount needed now. What they're basically going to have to do now is cut off renovations somewhere in the building and come back in 15 years (sad as it is).

[TheTravellers]

What im surprised at is the fact that they expected a renovation project (of a 100 year old building) to go according to plan. How many of us find zero surprises when we do home renovations? Anyone? You have to KNOW you're going to have surprises that are going to cost a lot more money. They should have padded 50% in the original cost. Then we'd be looking at a far lower amount needed now. What they're basically going to have to do now is cut off renovations somewhere in the building and come back in 15 years (sad as it is).

They're complete and total dumbasses for not allowing for contingencies. Very similar to OKC and Project 180 (gosh, there are basements under the buildings that go into the street, wow, who woulda thunk?). Again, why can't this damn state (and city, at times) figure stuff out that other entities (countries, cities, etc.) have known for decades, if not centuries?

[ljbab728]

You're right. Other places never underestimate the cost of projects.