Ten Commandments

[Bunty]

Right now it's no big deal--it's part of the process. Fallin hasn't won some glorious victory by refusing to take the monument down. The Supreme Court has stayed their ruling pending the rehearing they granted when the AG asked for one. I don't think there is any new information to present to the Court except perhaps the AG feels that the Court may be persuaded by all of the calls for their impeachment and removal, which I guarantee you is not part of the equation.

So it's a mere delay of the inevitable and then let the gnashing of teeth resume at full volume.

I think this Ten Commandments case will eventually have to be settled in federal court, since supporters think the U. S. Constitution and the U. S. Supreme Court is on their side from the way Pleasant Grove City v. Summum turned out in 2009. Interesting how it was decided that government could exercise it's own freedom of speech by not having to allow in monuments carrying a message it did not agree with. So if applicable to Oklahoma, no one need worry about a Satanist statue posed on State Capitol property, if the Ten Commandments monument is allowed to stay. From taking it to federal court, though, supporters will have to hope they won't meet with the same fate that Judge Roy Moore had with his Ten Commandments monument.

[Jersey Boss]

I think this Ten Commandments case will eventually have to be settled in federal court, since supporters think the U. S. Constitution and the U. S. Supreme Court is on their side from the way Pleasant Grove City v. Summum turned out in 2009. Interesting how it was decided that government could exercise it's own freedom of speech by not having to allow in monuments carrying a message it did not agree with. So if applicable to Oklahoma, no one need worry about a Satanist statue posed on State Capitol property, if the Ten Commandments monument is allowed to stay. From taking it to federal court, though, supporters will have to hope they won't meet with the same fate that Judge Roy Moore had with his Ten Commandments monument.

Not a federal issue. The ruling was based on interpretation of the Oklahoma constitution and prohibitions contained therein.

[Bunty]

Not a federal issue. The ruling was based on interpretation of the Oklahoma constitution and prohibitions contained therein.

But I already know that full well. The point is opponents of the Ten Commandments monument may eventually have to resort to making a federal case out of it, most likely after Oklahoma voters have made changes in the Oklahoma Constitution to allow the monument.

While I'm no lawyer, It does kinda look like Pleasant Grove City v. Summum decision could allow a privately funded Ten Commandments monument on any government property, if the government body wants to exercise its freedom of speech that way. Perhaps it could further work by someone wanting to present as a gift to a public school district a bunch of plaques engraved with the Ten Commandments, enough to put one on display in every classroom. All that is required is for the school board to approve of it and it's done.

[Bunty]

STEVE FAIR: Purpose of the Ten Commandments - Stillwater News Press: Opinion

[Midtowner]

STEVE FAIR: Purpose of the Ten Commandments - Stillwater News Press: Opinion

I love it.. a small town editorial board knows more Constitutional law than the United States Supreme Court.

[Just the facts]

It wasn't written by the small town editorial board.

[bombermwc]

It wasn't written by the small town editorial board.

So the last line says "Steve Fair is National Committeeman for the Oklahoma Republican Party."

Given the stance the Oklahoma Republican Party has been taking on all sorts of things these days, it seems like it's right in line. It's the tired argument of the majority woeing themselves about the attacks on their "rights". Face it folks, sometimes the majority is NOT right. Some times groups like SCOTUS or the SCOTSO (that's Oklahoma's Supreme Court for he acronym challenged) have to step in to ensure that the minority isn't shoved to the side. There's a good editorial article HERE that expresses a lot of what I feel these days when I hear the republican party (ESPECIALLY in Oklahoma) complain. Most times when I hear Boehner complain, I just wanna facepalm myself. It seems that if you're Republican these days, you have to disagree with any progress made in rights to individuals and have to skew it to be an attack on yourself.

Not before you jump on me, what we can all wait for is to see if the Democratic party plays the same game when the sides are switched. The presidential election will be a major deciding point. If the R party wins, then you'll see congress turn blue. It's a pattern repeated over and over in history. So it's TBD if the Democratic Party will be considered as obstructionist as the Republicans have been....but it would be pretty hard to match their level of stubbornness.

[Bunty]

I love it.. a small town editorial board knows more Constitutional law than the United States Supreme Court.

So the paper gives another side of the story from an OSU professor of politics: BOB DARCY: Are the Ten Commandments basis of American legal system? - Stillwater News Press: Columns

[mkjeeves]

It's a good thing no one else is trying to use the "It's our heritage!" ploy.

[Bunty]

A fascinating look at the images portrayed at the U. S. Supreme Court building proving overwhelmingly why American law is not based on the Ten Commandments. Of course, though, Gov. Fallin and AG Pruitt would like you to be gullible enough to believe otherwise: https://ffrf.org/faq/freethought/ite...9-did-you-knowwise:

[bombermwc]

Agree Bunty...you tell a lie enough times, and people take it as fact. At some point, and i'll bet you anything it's traced to just post WWII, the country started saying that the founders were making a Christian country. That time period sort of put a twist on a great many things in the history of the U.S. as the country tried to re-identify itself as the "good guys"....even though we caused a great amount of strife globally during the next 50 years, and we're paying for it now.

[ljbab728]

Latest update.

Ten Commandments case returns to judge after ruling to remove monument | NewsOK.com

The Oklahoma Supreme Court, which reversed Oklahoma County Judge Thomas Prince's ruling and ordered removal of a Ten Commandments monument at the state Capitol grounds, returned the case to him on Thursday.

Prince now is required to formally order the monument to be carted away.

[Bunty]

Latest update.

Ten Commandments case returns to judge after ruling to remove monument | NewsOK.com

I wonder if the judge had something in mind for scheduling the status conference on 9/11?

[ljbab728]

Interfaith Alliance says Ten Commandments monument should be removed from Oklahoma Capitol grounds | NewsOK.com

[Bunty]

Interfaith Alliance says Ten Commandments monument should be removed from Oklahoma Capitol grounds | NewsOK.com

Gov. Fallin believes in picking and choosing what not to follow or obey in the Bible, like when she indulged in adultery. Now she wants to treat the Oklahoma Constitution in the same way.

[ljbab728]

It looks like it's going to be gone in two weeks.

NewsOK Videos | Panel orders Ten Commandments monument removed from OK Capitol grounds

http://m.newsok.com/panel-orders-ten...rticle/5450147

[White Peacock]

I love the unintended implications of ordering the monument off of the property by Aleister Crowley's birthday.

[kevinpate]

I've been pondering who, if anyone, might still have a trick tucked up a sleeve, or if things will simply happen on the announce schedule.

[TheTravellers]

Man yells “Freedom!” as he destroys Arkansas’ new Ten Commandments monument

"Back in 2014, a man named Michael Tate Reed used his truck to ram into a similarly designed Ten Commandments monument at the Oklahoma Capitol in Oklahoma City. It’s not clear if the same Michael Reed as was involved in Wednesday’s incident. "

[Anonymous.]

HAHA, I am soooo wanting this to be two separate people with the same name, but I know that is too good to be true.

[Roger S]

^^^

Same person... He apparently has mental a mental illness and says he hears voices.

[Dustin]

The FFRF should erect a statue next to it that just says Commandment 11: Keep thy religion to thyself.

[Bunty]

Most churches believe it's a violation of the 3rd commandment to put up a 10 Commandments monument on their property, so it's hard for the mentally ill to find such a monument to destroy.

"Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image."

[bombermwc]

Most churches believe it's a violation of the 3rd commandment to put up a 10 Commandments monument on their property, so it's hard for the mentally ill to find such a monument to destroy.

"Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image."

Interesting...never heard that. So many churches have posters or signs or whatever inside that depict the commandments, are you saying they draw the line on a monument or that they dont do either? Seems like somewhat arbitrary fuzzy logic. But religion is funny that way. Some folks say you can't use instruments because they weren't available "back in the day"....but they use electricity and A/C. Others have rock concerts for their music and tech it to the nth degree. It's all in what speaks to you.....

[Midtowner]

Both reactions I've seen (tribal Right and tribal Left) seem to really be missing the point or are just plain heartless.

What happened here is a mentally ill man acted out in a way he has previously acted out, destroying public property.

Now, if you're tribal Right and believe that we should be in the business of incarcerating mentally ill people who only caused property damage and are no threat to themselves or others, you're probably an asshole. Locking mentally ill people up who are of no threat to anyone is not WJWD. Or if you're tribal Left and think that a shattered monument is good because the ends justify the means and that causing damage to public property is a valid form of free expression, you are also an asshole.

This gets a glitzy headline and sets off lots of tribal fingerpointing and a lot of people fell for it hook, line and sinker.