Streetcar

[Just the facts]

I thought good urbanism would follow when the streetcar was built?

It does if there is a place to build good urbanism and where land was available it did. Channelside is great area with retail, cruise terminal, aquarium, and several condo towers, but far too much of the route fronts industrial ship repair, drydocks, and ...wait for it... parking garages.

[Just the facts]

I thought good urbanism would follow when the streetcar was built?

It does if there is a place to build good urbanism and where land was available it did. Channelside is a great area with retail, cruise terminal, aquarium, and several condo towers, but far too much of the route fronts industrial ship repair, drydocks, and ...wait for it... parking garages.

[ljbab728]

An update by Bill Crum.

Oklahoma City streetcar discussion covers motor mounts, possible route changes | NewsOK.com

[Plutonic Panda]

Oklahoma City Streetcar System Is Full Steam Ahead - News9.com - Oklahoma City, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports |

[Omega Man]

FYI Atlanta Street Car Atlanta Streetcar to remain free for 2015 | www.ajc.com

Craig Jones, chairman of the Atlanta Downtown Improvement District board, said that since 2010, the project has attracted around $560 million in redevelopment witin a five-minute walk of the streetcar. He expects another $280 million in investment to be completed by the end of this year.

[Pete]

Merchants worry less about streetcar wire
By: Brian Brus The Journal Record April 28, 20150


Jeff Bezdek is a member of the Citizens Advisory Board Modern Streetcar Subcommittee in Oklahoma City. (Photo by Brent Fuchs)

OKLAHOMA CITY – Business operators along the proposed route of a downtown streetcar said they’re coming around to see that the potential positive factors of a wired system outweigh the negative.

The improvement of vehicle battery technology has introduced a little tension in the development process, said Jeff Bezdek, a member of the Citizens Advisory Board Modern Streetcar Subcommittee, but those conflicts will likely be resolved according to practical engineering needs and not stakeholder fears or personalities.

“The challenge is that Oklahoma City hasn’t had any real rail transit system since 1947,” Bezdek said. “Because we’re starting with something brand new, people are having to use their imaginations to envision what a streetcar will look like. There are a number of folks who are overly concerned about this issue, when the aesthetic challenge that it presents may not be as dramatic as they imagine.”

About two years ago, the committee concluded that a $128.8 million streetcar system approved by voters as part of the MAPS 3 sales tax issue would best serve the city by running in a loop along NW 11th Street, N. Broadway Avenue, Sheridan Avenue to Joe Carter Drive, Reno Avenue and N. Hudson Avenue. The design allows for several expansion options and is expected to serve as a transition between corridors that spread across central Oklahoma City.

Bezdek is quick to remind people that the original multimodal concept voters supported leaned heavily toward vehicles that would need to tap into power lines installed overhead or in the street.

Lately, improvements in battery storage are allowing the committee to consider wireless options within the budget. Batteries are strong enough to propel streetcars along certain corridors, but MAPS 3 funding still only allows for about one-third of the 4.5-mile route to be installed without catenary lines. Bezdek said a few business operators in Automobile Alley and Bricktown said they are wondering who is best positioned to benefit from those upgrades, which would be less of a change to the districts’ historic profile.

David Todd, the city’s MAPS project manager, agreed with Bezdek that many choices will be dictated by practicality. The streetcar must run wirelessly under the railroad track bordering Bricktown, for example, and uphill travel requires more energy than a battery alone can provide. The additional power needed for an air-conditioning system during summer also lowers the effective budget cap.

Subcommittee member Jane Jenkins said the group is trying to mitigate stakeholder concerns as much as possible. She said they expect that technology will continue to improve as the streetcar infrastructure ages and needs repairs, providing opportunities to get rid of more obvious wiring over time.

Subcommittee Chairman Nathaniel Harding said the streetcar program is still under budget, and bids have been sought from track manufacturers. The streetcar is expected to begin running in 2017.

Harding said he thinks that ultimately businesspeople in the area will understand that some wiring is necessary and appearances won’t be disturbed as much as they fear. The conflict will resolve itself soon enough, he said.

“Our business community has a good track record of coming to a good decision once they explore the options and trade-offs,” he said.

That’s been the case with Brittney Matlock, co-founder of Plenty Mercantile on Broadway.

“I don’t have any particular concerns,” she said. “Anything wireless would be ideal, but if we have to work with wires I still think we would greatly benefit from it. We just want a streetcar. Before we signed a lease on this space, we didn’t have that many neighbors and the Devon tower wasn’t even done yet. This area is really developing, and I think a streetcar would be an awesome addition.”

And Adam Rott, manager at Broadway Wine, said adjusting to streetcar culture will be less of a problem than what people expect.

“I expect it will alleviate some of the automobile congestion and drive more foot traffic,” he said. “It’s a really good thing. I’ve lived overseas with lines overhead for streetcars, and it’s really not that big of a deal.”

[CuatrodeMayo]

Off-wire battery operation is causing hiccups here in Seattle: Where's the First Hill streetcar? Timeline uncertain

[Urban Pioneer]

I am really glad that Seattle is the "guinea pig" for this. The company is on the hook to make this work and we will probably benefit from it.

[HOT ROD]

Yep, OKC loves Seattle

[betts]

Yep, OKC loves Seattle

Where ARE those elephants though?

[HOT ROD]

They're supposed to be coming still.

You'll have to figure out what else you'd all like - too late on the Seahawks though. hehe

[kevinpate]

They're supposed to be coming still.

You'll have to figure out what else you'd all like - too late on the Seahawks though. hehe

Apparently a vote was held, and rain was the top vote getter

[Bellaboo]

Where ARE those elephants though?

Due to inclement weather in the West, they've been diverted to San Diego. They should be on their way to OKC in a few weeks.

[Spartan]

So let me get this straight...

So far the project is well within budget so we can afford to spend more on perks like the hybrid battery operated streetcars that can run wireless. Could we perhaps just do more track instead and stick to proven technology that isn't causing issues in Seattle? It doesn't take a whole lot extra to reach Capitol Hill, if you just keep going down Robinson past I-40 and the river. If you can truly get people from north to south, you've got a viable system that responds to the usual flow of traffic in OKC (north to south).

[Paseofreak]

My understanding is that the batteries are required so the cars can disconnect from the catenary and be self powered to pass beneath low clearance underpasses. A requirement for our route, not a perk.

[Just the facts]

Can some one explain why the wire can't go under the overpass. I have seen lots systems out there with very little clearance.

[Spartan]

My understanding is that the batteries are required so the cars can disconnect from the catenary and be self powered to pass beneath low clearance underpasses. A requirement for our route, not a perk.

Oh right, I forgot about those underpasses. Thanks for the clarification/reminder.

[Urban Pioneer]

Let's clarify a few things-

1. Semi-wireless is a requirement for the bridge underpasses.
2. Hybrid streetcar savings can be/could be somewhat cost neutral as a premiums is paid on each vehicle versus the removal of wire infrastructure.
3. The BNSF underpass would require reconstruction to lower the road grade to allow both cars and streets beneath it. That would have been cost prohibitive and required BNSF's approval potentially adding months or years to the project.
4. Yes, streetcar can accommodate "low" clearances but presents major liability if the bridge is of "shared use". Imagine box truck or semi getting wedged under the bridge in contact with the wire.
5. The reason the bridge would require reconstruction is due to where the footings are in relationship to the street grade.
6. The project is currently projected to be within budget. Only actual bidding will determine if we are indeed within budget.

[ljbab728]

From today's advisory committee meeting as per Bill Crum.

First MAPS 3 senior center reaches milestone | Oklahoman.com

An advisory committee on Wednesday endorsed consultants’ preliminary plans for the 4.6-mile MAPS 3 streetcar route. The tracks will run through the central business district in a loop connecting Midtown and Bricktown.

Next steps include confirming the capabilities of the preferred streetcars to run sufficient distances without overhead wires, getting ready to order the steel rails that will be laid in downtown streets, and coordinating construction plans with utilities and the city.

Consultants say current cost estimates have the streetcar within the $128.8 million budget. Plans are for the first phase including the 4.6-mile “mainline” and a maintenance barn to begin operations with five streetcars by mid-2018.

[David]

I wonder what that means for when construction might start if they're planning on having an operating system in three years.

[Urban Pioneer]

Construction will start spring to mid of next year as the general contractor is selected. Completion is estimated for mid 2018. We are negotiating with INEKON right now to purchase 5 streetcars. The rail should be ordered very shortly as it is a long lead item. Pre-bid meetings should be occurring this year to pre-qualify contractors.

Keep in mind that Santa Fe Station and the rail sections related to it on EK Gaylord will be completed very, very quickly. The construction scope once these projects start will be significant.

[AP]

What happened to the 2017 timeline?

[Urban Pioneer]

Wired versus wireless hell happened and many other things best discussed over strong drinks.

I would rather leave the past in the past and simply move forward. And not only with streetcar, but a comprehensive regional Bus and Rail system.

[Teo9969]

Wired versus wireless hell happened and many other things best discussed over strong drinks.

I would rather leave the past in the past and simply move forward. And not only with streetcar, but a comprehensive regional Bus and Rail system.

If this were a Facebook post it would be "vaguebooking"…it's a little bit disconcerting :-/ . . . is the movement/push for regional bus and Rail system hitting a major impasse?

[Urban Pioneer]

No. Actually not at all. It's just if I line itemed all the people who have unnecessarily delayed this project and their related motivations for doing so, that really wouldn't help us move forward with these bigger endeavors. Best to move on in good spirits.