What is a liveable annual income? (Opinion Thread)

[mmonroe]

What would you say would be a liveable annual income?

[SoonerDave]

What would you say would be a liveable annual income?

I don't think there's a simple answer to that question. There are widely varying and largely subjective standards on what constitutes a mode of living that is minimally acceptable or appropriate. Further complicating the notion is the equallly widely varying costs-of-living around the country, too.

[PennyQuilts]

I personally think amount of debt is just as important - or more. There are some expenses that are common for most people - cable, internet, phones, utilities, sports and classes for their kids but from there, things can sharply diverge. Moreover, families have a lot of discretion on how much they want to eat out - and where. Some have kids in day care while others either stay home with them or get Grandma to help. Some people take inexpensive vacations and others go to Europe and Disneyworld every year.

A couple with young kids that make an upper middle class salary but have a big mortgage, a couple car payments and insurance, short term credit debt, private elementary schools for their kids, student loan debt, support their church, an expensive hobby, etc. are probably going to be living paycheck to paycheck and losing ground by the month.

Contrast that with someone with kids in public school, own a modest home, have late model cars that are paid for, and who garden and bird watch for hobbies. All things being equal, they just don't need that much and even making half of what the first example makes they are probably more financially comfortable.

[Spartan]

...and some people don't have kids. Don't forget about that possibility that factors in.

[Easy180]

In Oklahoma...30-35k

[Chadanth]

25% more than whatever you're making right now.

[BBatesokc]

What would you say would be a liveable annual income?

Too many variables for a real answer.

1.) How do 'you' define 'livable' and how does that compare to how everyone else does?
Some would say a roof over your head, food in the cupboard, a job and a way to get there is all you need. Others would argue those things plus $125/month smartphones, $150/month cable, $120 tennis shoes etc. are 'necessities.'

2.) 'Livable' where? City, suburbs, country, BFE.......?

3.) At what age? (believe me, that can make a huge difference)

4.) Livable wage after or before you've reached certain milestones (kids, home, retirement, etc.)?

I know people that are perfectly content to live in a studio apartment and ride their bike or the bus everywhere they go. I know people that (mostly based on their culture) are perfectly fine living with family and sharing all expenses. Then I know people that would consider it completely unacceptable to be living in anything less than a $400,000 home with a brand new car every year. And, of course there are people that fall all over the map in between.

For my wife and I, we are very low maintenance. We don't make 'a lot' but we do pretty good. We are very thrifty and find we are just as happy when we have extra to spend and when times are tight. If need be, I take on an extra job to help ourselves or family. I personally think it comes down to simply being happy with whatever hand in life you are currently being dealt and a mindset to overcome.

[Zuplar]

I get there are a lot of factors, but to me livable is something where you can say you have some nice things, maybe not everything is 100% what you want, but still better off than most. I'd put that number at $60k. With that I'd expect to be able to take care of 2 children and send them to college.

[PennyQuilts]

Depends on your expenses. No kids or Kids already raised/educated, no mortgage, car payments or other debt means nearly anything you have is discretionary income. Not fun but you could live well below the poverty line and still be warm and well fed. Put that paid off home in a nice neighborhood and even with a piddling income, you can "feel" middle class.

[OKCTalker]

Maslow's hierarchy of needs - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The five are (in order): Physiological, safety, love/belonging, esteem and self-actualization.

[Just the facts]

If you live where you need a car to function as a part of society you need $10,000 per year (on average) right off the top. If you need 2 cars that goes to $20,000 (on average).

[Garin]

Cell phone not a necessity, New car or car in general not a necessity, Health insurance not a necessity, cable not a necessity , internet not a necessity, mortgages not a necessity, fast food not a necessity, clubbing not a necessity , booze not a necessity, credit cards not a necessity, entertainment budget not a necessity, and the list goes on and on of non essential items. That being said a single person or a a married couple would not require a lot of income to create a livable life.

[sacolton]

Start everyone off with $50,000/year ...

Add $5,000 for every child (under 18).

[td25er]

Cell phone not a necessity, New car or car in general not a necessity, Health insurance not a necessity, cable not a necessity , internet not a necessity, mortgages not a necessity, fast food not a necessity, clubbing not a necessity , booze not a necessity, credit cards not a necessity, entertainment budget not a necessity, and the list goes on and on of non essential items. That being said a single person or a a married couple would not require a lot of income to create a livable life.

Good luck with emergencies...

[hoya]

Depends what you mean by liveable. If you mean the ability to survive, then you don't need much. I think about what my dad grew up with (which was not a lot) and realize that I could get by with much less. But if you mean liveable as in playing an active role in modern society, doing the things that the average American does on a regular basis, then you need substantially more.

You could eat beans and rice, and canned spinach every day for a tiny amount of money. Is that what we're talking about?

[gopokes88]

If you can find a way to live 10% below what you make and still be happy, you'll be good to go.

[gjl]

According to this article ranking Oklahoma cities, http://www.okctalk.com/norman/36943-...tml#post753759 if you live in Bethany, $42147 can have you living pretty good.

Just like the other cities of the Oklahoma City Metropolitan area on our list so far, Bethany had a lot going on for it. For starters, it ranked highly in terms of total amenities—an impressive 1,855, according to Yelp. Bethany also had a low cost of living, at least among our top 15, and in combination with its higher than average median household income of $42,147 (where Oklahoma’s was $38,790), it seems as though residents can certainly afford to enjoy all of the amenities in the city. These factors gave Bethany a high score for its overall quality of life ranking.

[PennyQuilts]

If you live where you need a car to function as a part of society you need $10,000 per year (on average) right off the top. If you need 2 cars that goes to $20,000 (on average).

Ten thousand per car? Twenty thousand for two? Why? We have a fully insured '97 minivan, work primarily from home and the cost of insurance and the tag is under $300.00 a year. I have no idea where you are getting your stats but they're way, way, way off. We have two other paid off other cars (2005 and 2006) and all three are insured and tagged. Easily less than $4,000.00 a year including gasoline.

[Garin]

Good luck with emergencies...

Hospitals will set up a payment plan or just write you off completely , And what did people do before cell phones?

[Mr. Cotter]

Ten thousand per car? Twenty thousand for two? Why? We have a fully insured '97 minivan, work primarily from home and the cost of insurance and the tag is under $300.00 a year. I have no idea where you are getting your stats but they're way, way, way off. We have two other paid off other cars (2005 and 2006) and all three are insured and tagged. Easily less than $4,000.00 a year including gasoline.

It's an average. I spend way less than that too, even if you include depreciation and amortized initial cost/finance of a now paid off 12 and 13 year old car. Your $4000 figure assumes you got the cars for free initially.

AAA puts this out every year, and has for decades: http://exchange.aaa.com/wp-content/u...Costs-2013.pdf

[ctchandler]

PQ,
I think he means car payments as well as full insurance. Do you really carry collision on your 97? Most people I know would have dropped it. I didn't have collision on my 2001 van, it was only worth about $3,000. I pay $800 per year for full insurance, no tickets or collisions since I was 21 (I'm 70) and if I weren't retired, my round trip to work would cost me at least $7.00 per day, $1,540 per year in fuel, and then there is maintenance and repairs. And I didn't mention non work use of the vehicle. With a $400-$500 car payment, $4,800-$6,000 per year it's not hard to get to $10,000.
C. T.

Ten thousand per car? Twenty thousand for two? Why? We have a fully insured '97 minivan, work primarily from home and the cost of insurance and the tag is under $300.00 a year. I have no idea where you are getting your stats but they're way, way, way off. We have two other paid off other cars (2005 and 2006) and all three are insured and tagged. Easily less than $4,000.00 a year including gasoline.

[BBatesokc]

Hospitals will set up a payment plan or just write you off completely , And what did people do before cell phones?

In my world...... hospitals will sue you to get their money and 'writing you off' means the rest of us pay the bill.

As for cell phones........ I would say that, yes, they are as close to a necessity these days as it gets. Do you need one to 'survive' day-to-day? No. But its a tool that comes pretty close to a requirement.

What did people do before lots of different things (antibiotics, 911, electricity, etc.) Doesn't make for much of an argument IMO.

[PennyQuilts]

PQ,
I think he means car payments as well as full insurance. Do you really carry collision on your 97? Most people I know would have dropped it. I didn't have collision on my 2001 van, it was only worth about $3,000. I pay $800 per year for full insurance, no tickets or collisions since I was 21 (I'm 70) and if I weren't retired, my round trip to work would cost me at least $7.00 per day, $1,540 per year in fuel, and then there is maintenance and repairs. And I didn't mention non work use of the vehicle. With a $400-$500 car payment, $4,800-$6,000 per year it's not hard to get to $10,000.
C. T.

Yes, we actually do have all of them fully covered - it isn't that much at this stage. I probably wouldn't pay for it but my husband is insistent. We do all our insurance - house, car, etc with the same company and that seems to help. Honestly, I can't imagine going back to having a car payment like that - which is one of the reasons we stick to later model cars. I think when you are used to it, 400 - 500 a month seems normal. When you go any length of time without it, it seem crazy. We paid off that car in 2000 and I will never, ever shackle myself like that, again. For car insurance, we pay about 600 a year for my 2006, and 400 to 450 a year on the 2005. The 1997 is pretty much a pittance. There was a time when I used a lot of gasoline but no more.

[BBatesokc]

If you live where you need a car to function as a part of society you need $10,000 per year (on average) right off the top. If you need 2 cars that goes to $20,000 (on average).

As someone who owns 4-5 cars at any given time, I strongly disagree. I spend nowhere near $40-$50K a year on my cars. And right now I have a nice Prius, Volvo SUV, Infinity SUV and a Ford sitting in my driveway.

[ylouder]

Others have said it, but if you have a paid off home and a paid.off mechanically sound car you can live on very little.