Poor Persons and Casinos

[Dennis Heaton]

So do we need to add Little Caesers, McDonalds, Taco Bell etc to this bill to fully round out all of the places that poor people don't need to go to?

trousers...There's certainly nothing to be ashamed about to live within one's means (budget). That used to be a positive quality/characteristic that one could be proud of...even in the toughest of times.

[PennyQuilts]

So do we need to add Little Caesers, McDonalds, Taco Bell etc to this bill to fully round out all of the places that poor people don't need to go to?

I think the "younger generation" has gotten so used to doing the fast food thing that they don't see it as a treat the way many of my generation did/do. So, in part, it is a generational thing. If they spent foodstamp money for expensive popcorn at the movies I would feel the same way - it is in the exact same category. To me, that is the type of thing you buy when you have discretionary income. Moreover, IMO, although I have no problem helping someone get back on their feet, if someone is so poor they can't feed themselves, they should have enough respect for the rest of us to be careful with the money we gave them. I don't think fast food is a good bargain for scarce public resources and would discourage it on that basis as well as because it is typically crappy food. But my short answer is - I think it is ridiculous for people on welfare to order from Taco Bell and the like.

[trousers]

I agree with you on that point Dennis. I've done my share of living off of ramen.
I guess I just get irritated when we start get the stupid ass bills that do nothing but waste taxpayer money as they work their way through the process. Bills whose only purpose is to serve as grandstanding by some hack legislator.

[PennyQuilts]

So regulating businesses is ok if it keeps the poor people out? Some people like big government a lot.

Hmm. So you think people getting foodstamps should be able to spend it on anything they please? Because it sounds like you think it is "big government" to provide foodstamps with any strings attached. That's a pretty fringe attitude. We already don't allow them to use it for liquor or cigarettes. How would telling them they can't spend it at fast food joints (such healthy food!) be any different or require more government regulation?

[trousers]

Uhhh. Pretty sure this thread was actually about casinos. You are the one that wouldn't let Kevin's hypothetical pizza go lol.
If you remember the bill is about not letting welfare recipients go into casinos. You have somehow extrapolated that into me wanting a food stamp free for all.

And not to continue the derailing here but you can't spend food stamps at fast food restaurants.

[PennyQuilts]

Uhhh. Pretty sure this thread was actually about casinos. You are the one that wouldn't let Kevin's hypothetical pizza go lol.
If you remember the bill is about not letting welfare recipients go into casinos. You have somehow extrapolated that into me wanting a food stamp free for all.

And not to continue the derailing here but you can't spend food stamps at fast food restaurants.

Hahaha - those were directly responsive to your posts. Kevin brought up eating in the casino, which brought up fast food and you bit. Oh well, we're just having fun here.

[Dennis Heaton]

State Regulations/OKDHS Policy might say Food Stamps shall not be used to purchase beer, liquor or cigarettes...but we know there are "stores" (owners) out there that get around that, when the "customer" is willing to pay the "asking price."

[Dennis Heaton]

And not to continue the derailing here but you can't spend food stamps at fast food restaurants.

PaPa Murphy's is pretty fast! But, I know what you are saying.

BTW, I got sick and tired of the "ramen." I switched to Hurst's 15 Bean Soup.

[trousers]

State Regulations/OKDHS Policy might say Food Stamps shall not be used to purchase beer, liquor or cigarettes...but we know there are "stores" (owners) out there that get around that, when the "customer" is willing to pay the "asking price."

Yeah. Usually isn't too long until those stores get their SNAP machines pulled too. OKDHS OIG has a group of inspectors that actually go undercover for the stings.

[MustangGT]

Eliminate 99% of the locations that accept the leaches EBT cards and problem solved. Leaches will not patronize business that do not take the state cards. And yes I consider those on welfare as leaches.

[trousers]

Never mind

[Dennis Heaton]

MustangGT...Not everyone on welfare is a "leach." Just the ones that would rather spend their benefits at the casinos instead of on their children. There are way too many custodial parents out there that haven't seen Child Support in years. I am sure most of them don't take Food Stamp assistance for granted and are not the ones spending their weekends at the casinos.

[Midtowner]

Not sure why you're still discussing this. The state can't tell the tribes who they can and cannot do business with.

[PennyQuilts]

MustangGT...Not everyone on welfare is a "leach." Just the ones that would rather spend their benefits at the casinos instead of on their children. There are way too many custodial parents out there that haven't seen Child Support in years. I am sure most of them don't take Food Stamp assistance for granted and are not the ones spending their weekends at the casinos.

Too many children are living in poverty in single parent homes. As a society and as individuals, we don't want to judge and I get that - but there are times when I wonder how culpable we are when we, as a society, don't take a stronger position helping young people make better decisions. How often do we, as parents or grandparents say nothing when our young daughters shack up with some jerk who is likely never going to amount to anything? As often as not, we actually encourage them in the relationship and hope for the best. How often do we, as friends, not tell our dear ones that the person they are with is not good for them?

We can't control what our young people/loved ones do but I think most of us have gone to the extreme of not being honest with them. There is a fundamental difference between being honest and being judgmental. I am not sure how much it would help in an individual situation but if, as a culture, we were more honest with each other instead of enabling poor decisions, it could start turning things around. I think a lot of us want to support our loved ones and not upset them. Speaking only for myself, I have been on the receiving end of excellent advice from people I knew loved me with a message I didn't want to hear. Awkward conversations, certainly, but I don't recall ever blaming them for speaking hard truths from a position of love.

[Dennis Heaton]

Not sure why you're still discussing this. The state can't tell the tribes who they can and cannot do business with.

Midtowner...I'll be sure to clear all future inputs with you before posting. LOL!!!

[RadicalModerate]

At first I thought that the typo "leach" was an accidental, unconnected, reference to the draining away of stuff like minerals by the action of water or some other liquid. And then I realized that it sort of fit perfectly within the context of the discussion. If you think about it for a minute.

Since it wasn't capitalized, it couldn't have been a reference to that noted British scientist or zoologist or whatever. (or could it?(!))

[Dennis Heaton]

Since it wasn't capitalized, it couldn't have been a reference to that noted British scientist or zoologist or whatever. (or could it?(!))

Why am I suddenly searching YouTube for "Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous?"

[kevinpate]

There has been many a time in my younger years when even a Big Mac was out of the question. Eating out was always a special treat, often saved up for.

Ok PQ, I'll go along. Nothing in my example suggested one way or the other if wanting to share a pizza at Sue's work after her shift was a common event or a special event that was saved up for at 1.00 tucked a way a month. So, let's add your criteria. Even with a possible employee discount, let's say Sue and her hub could only manage this pizza meal once every 7-9 months. Should it be a misd. offense solely to eat a pizza at Rick's? Again, neither is gambling, merely eating a pizza at a food court located in a casino.

[kevinpate]

FWIW, I don't think the bill has a chance of standing as an enacted law. It's simply the notion that so long as our current legislature doesn't like X, it can be criminalized, along with any other incidental conduct, just to be sure the big bad X can be attacked. I might some day learn to love the party of small government, assuming one ever comes into being again.

[positano]

I can't imagine the "last thing on Earth" scenario that would cause me to actually read this bill, but for those that have, I don't suppose the author has thought through the complexities of jurisdiction in Indian Country? Who is it exactly that they believe will enforce this law, much less prosecute it?

[Just the facts]

Here is the deal - once you give someone money telling them what they can do with that money is impossible. That is something that should be thought of BEFORE giving them money. If someone on OKCTalk gave me $100 and I earned $100 at work and then I went and spent $100 on lap dances and $100 of food for my kids - which $100 went to which activity? It's like pouring your water and my water into the same glass. Once it is mixed you can't tell me what to do with your water.

Maybe instead of giving people a SNAP card with cash on it they get coupons for specific food items, for example, they get a milk coupon instead of $4.00. Since everyone's dining habits are different the recipient could select the type of food coupons they have from a pre-selected list of choices. Even if the recipient sells the coupon to a third party, at least we know that public dollars are going to buy milk eventually, as someone has to use the food voucher before it expires.

[Dennis Heaton]

Just the facts...May I copy that and send it to Rep. Todd Russ?

[Dennis Heaton]

Maybe instead of giving people a SNAP card with cash on it they get coupons for specific food items, for example, they get a milk coupon instead of $4.00. Since everyone's dining habits are different the recipient could select the type of food coupons they have from a pre-selected list of choices. Even if the recipient sells the coupon to a third party, at least we know that public dollars are going to buy milk eventually, as someone has to use the food voucher before it expires.

Kinda-sorta like the WIC program?

[Just the facts]

Just the facts...May I copy that and send it to Rep. Todd Russ?

Send it to whomever you want.

[trousers]

Kinda-sorta like the WIC program?

That's pretty much what it sounds like. I'm not against this.
It might just be simpler to add new restrictions to the existing electronic system to restrict certain foods, no soda for example.