Neighborhoods Near NW44th and Portland

[Urbanized]

Yeah without question each ward should have project corridors.

[mkjeeves]

A master plan that embraces the tent-pole urbanism JTF and others keep talking around seems appropriate to me. 10th seems like a no-brainer for a tendril with some spacing of such new tents maybe out up to 7 miles or so. Upgrade the corridor in general, plan for some logical placing of nodes that make sense in the long term, condemn some blighted property for the nodes and add whatever new infrastructure, then let it rip.

I don't have a problem with doing that equally around the different wards but it would behoove us to think about the big long term picture, even if we can't do it all at the same time.

[Urbanized]

I have no problem with this, as what it really does is make the unsustainable, sustainable. Those areas are currently unsustainable by design, and the prevailing wisdom for decades has been - once things become less-than-perfect - to simply move on to the next new area at the fringe and let the older areas rot. Areas that already have services which we will instead have to add on to for the next round of neighborhoods in the new "nice" part of town. If instead we find ways to surgically reinvest in these older, established areas and encourage density we can reverse that trend.

But another leg to that stool MUST be finding ways to curb unchecked development at the fringe without stifling real, HONEST growth. Building new homes in a pasture 20 miles from the center of the city isn't real growth unless everyone moving in to that neighborhood is from outside of the OKC metro, and we all know that they are not. Besides, there is enough undeveloped land within the footprint of our developed infrastructure to provide decades' worth of new development without adding to the taxpayer burden by requiring new services be established at the fringe. THAT is where we create unsustainable growth.

We have to make the EXISTING, inner portions of OKC (both urban and suburban) more livable and desirable to encourage this.

[Pete]

^

There have already been a ton of PUD's approved north of the Kilpatrick Turnpike off MacArthur, Rockwell and Council and even further west / northwest.

There isn't even a thought as to coming up with a criteria of declining such applications. And as far as I know, there isn't even a discussion.

If just the approved PUD's get built-out, sprawl is going to get much worse before it gets better.

[Urbanized]

Yep, more of the same-old-same-old. These are city-defining, generational decisions we are making in allowing that type of development unchecked, but the problem is that there is no real decision-making going on. The "decision" was codified years ago, and now we just rubber stamp. At the very least we should find ways to level the playing field, price-wise, between greenfield development at the fringe and new development in established parts of the city.

There is lots of feuding on here about urban vs. suburban and who subsidizes whom, but I will respectfully submit that both sides usually get it wrong. The REAL subsidization in the city is that ALL OF US chip in to pay for new services demanded by the exurban lifestyle of a few. If you live in an area where City services are already well established, I'm totally good with it and want your little corner of OKC to be the best it can be.

[Pete]

Wasn't Russel Claus' predecessor pretty much run out of office for just bring up the issue of curtailing sprawl?

The biggest problem is that too many private business benefit (home builders, commercial developers, construction companies, road builders, etc.) and it's very difficult to even slow down the train, let alone stop it and turn it around.

Can you imagine the outrage is this was attempted? Many people have bought expensive property under the assumption they can easily get their AA property rezoned to R-* and C-*. There is simply nothing that allows the planning department or City Council to even consider denying such applications.

Honestly, I haven't even heard this idea for OKC (some sort of parameters) discussed anywhere but here. I don't even know how it would be begin because the mere mention seems to be political suicide.

[Spartan]

Perhaps because if one fails to revitalize an area, either a slow decline or a rapid decline to decay, rot and eventual abandonment is the assured result.
One could always choose to leave a ring of building corpses around a renewed urban core and a shiny outer ring of sprawl, but eventually, that will be an awful big boneyard.

That's a point where you really HAVE to triage bc you can't take on every street and every neighborhood and if someone says you can, run far far away.

[okclee]

^

Perhaps for the next MAPS one key corridor in each ward could be identified for improvements with seed money for an on-going citizens group.

A mentioned something like this a few years ago.
Next MAPS campaign could be called "MAPS 4 ME".

Each ward could use a proportioned amount of money however they thought would best improve their nearby community.

[Spartan]

A mentioned something like this a few years ago.
Next MAPS campaign could be called "MAPS 4 ME".

Each ward could use a proportioned amount of money however they thought would best improve their nearby community.

MAPS is for everyone and always has been.

[Urbanized]

The entire IDEA of characterizing something as "MAPS 4 ME" is incredibly divisive.

[okclee]

The entire IDEA of characterizing something as "MAPS 4 ME" is incredibly divisive.

Some would say MAPS 3 was incredibly divisive.

[Urbanized]

Interesting. How so?

[ljbab728]

Ok, then why revitalize? That's even more involved.

OMG, Spartan. I can't believe you would say that. It's involved so there is no point in trying?

[Spartan]

You have to manage your resources, including capital improvement funding, as effectively as possible.

[LandRunOkie]

These are city-defining, generational decisions we are making in allowing that type of development unchecked, but the problem is that there is no real decision-making going on. The "decision" was codified years ago, and now we just rubber stamp..

Wasn't Russel Claus' predecessor pretty much run out of office for just bring up the issue of curtailing sprawl?

The biggest problem is that too many private business benefit (home builders, commercial developers, construction companies, road builders, etc.) and it's very difficult to even slow down the train, let alone stop it and turn it around.

The biggest problem is that there is really a war on individualism and intellectualism and young people's values in general in this city and state that young people find menacing. This link illustrates the trend we all are aware of about the brain drain in this state - and it hasn't stopped. Actively producing and retaining college graduates will be the best thing for the future of the city. Without this attempts at revitalization and a renewed civic sphere are hollow rhetoric. The lack of a public 4 year university within the urban core is really the biggest hurdle to overcome.

[ljbab728]

The lack of a public 4 year university within the urban core is really the biggest hurdle to overcome.

No, it's not needed and isn't a hurdle for anything.

[MWCGuy]

There are cute neighborhoods but generally WNW Oklahoma City is full of charming, "traditional ranch" neighborhoods and is still going downhill fast. NW 10 Portland to Council has become the city's top crime zone. It's bad. And PCO and PCW have become dangerous schools. And yes Putnam City used to be a nice, but the problem is we replaced it (by building Deer Creek) before it's time was due.

You can find otherwise cheap neighborhoods in NE Houston, NW St Louis, N Kansas City, E Dallas, NE Cleveland, Central Jersey/Staten Island.

One area primary killed the Putman City School District........Lyrewood Lane. Lyrewood is why you don't build apartment complexes too close together and any larger than 300 units. When complexes are 300 and smaller the place stays occuppied and wel kept. Anything more than that or too many in one area and you have Lyrewood Lane or I-240. Both are crap areas I would not be in after dark without a well supplied Marine platoon and air support on standby.

[Spartan]

You must scare easily then

[mkjeeves]

The district has 19,000 students, 27 schools scattered over 25-30 square miles. My guess is residents living off Lyrewood Ln would be a small percentage of three of those schools. No doubt, some of those Lyrewood Ln. residents and students are good people.

https://www.putnamcityschools.org/Schools.aspx

[ljbab728]

The district has 19,000 students, 27 schools scattered over 25-30 square miles. My guess is residents living off Lyrewood Ln would be a small percentage of three of those schools. No doubt, some of those Lyrewood Ln. residents and students are good people.

https://www.putnamcityschools.org/Schools.aspx

I agree. If the Putnam City schools have gone down, that is hardly the reason.

[Urbanized]

Deer Creek is the reason.

[Rover]

Low property taxes and lack of funding is why.

[Urbanized]

In part due to the fact that the next generation of parents has moved to Deer Creek. Or Piedmont. Or the fringes of Edmond. Or wherever. Eventually PC (which in the '80s was the premeire suburban school district) will be much like OKC has been over the past few decades, mostly full of people who vote down school bond issues because they don't have kids and don't want to pay for someone else's kids to have nice schools.

[Spartan]

Lyre wood Lane is horrific. It is also small. Putnam City is comparatively huge.

[bluedogok]

In part due to the fact that the next generation of parents has moved to Deer Creek. Or Piedmont. Or the fringes of Edmond. Or wherever. Eventually PC (which in the '80s was the premeire suburban school district) will be much like OKC has been over the past few decades, mostly full of people who vote down school bond issues because they don't have kids and don't want to pay for someone else's kids to have nice schools.

Mustang and Yukon have contributed to that as well, those that would locate in the PC West area, including many alumni of PCW have moved to all of those areas. Many of my former classmates and my sisters have moved to other areas all over OKC and outside of the PC or OKC districts.