Preftakes Block

[PWitty]

Sorry Rover, it was an overreaction, but I am very serious about this historic preservation issue and I am throwing all of my weight behind it because obviously nobody else will. OKC has a demolition addiction. I am tired of two steps forward, one step backward, all the

Not at all, you should see Steve Lackmeyer's recent blog post on the matter.

Yeah, here's the link for that blog post.

Steve's Blog Entry

If Tulsa's park ends up like those conceptual shots, it would be much more impressive than what OKC has planned.

[Spartan]

Here's the kicker: The firm that did Tulsa's designs, with roughly the same public cost (and such a strong, compelling vision that they received huge private and philanthropic contributions), applied to work on our park and was rejected. We instead gave the contract to a firm that Jim Couch likes from his own past experience. They did reliable, mediocre work for us before, so they will probably keep doing reliable, mediocre work for us.

[bchris02]

The Tulsa way is to take OKC's idea and do it bigger and better. Most of the time they are successful. That wouldn't always be the case if OKC didn't always accept such a mediocre, bare minimum development standard.

[PhiAlpha]

Sorry Rover, it was an overreaction, but I am very serious about this historic preservation issue and I am throwing all of my weight behind it because obviously nobody else will. OKC has a demolition addiction. I am tired of two steps forward, one step backward, all the time.


Not at all, you should see Steve Lackmeyer's recent blog post on the matter.

Didn't see that, yes it looks like their design has surpassed ours.

[ljbab728]

We have so many more buildings on the chopping block, already lost or about to be lost. Look at the Film Exchange Bldg, being razed just because an out of town consultant from SF wants it out of their mcmasterplan.

Of course there are a few building up for being demolished but it is still hardly an "astonishing rate". I'm not arguing in favor of any building being demolished but it happens constantly in every major city in the US.

[ljbab728]

The Tulsa way is to take OKC's idea and do it bigger and better. Most of the time they are successful.

That would be a true statement except it isn't.

[AP]

That would be a true statement except it isn't.

+1

[PhiAlpha]

That would be a true statement except it isn't.

Well they did see how we got the Thunder and promptly 1-upped us with the Shock, so there's that...

[Spartan]

Of course there are a few building up for being demolished but it is still hardly an "astonishing rate". I'm not arguing in favor of any building being demolished but it happens constantly in every major city in the US.

What is a few vs several? This is splitting hairs.

[sgt. pepper]

the tulsa way is to take okc's idea and do it bigger and better. Most of the time they are successful. That wouldn't always be the case if okc didn't always accept such a mediocre, bare minimum development standard.

"like"

[Spartan]

This is more complicated than Ye Ole Tulsa v. OKC. Our city has pulled so far ahead of Tulsa it isn't a debate anymore, and we have 5 times the downtown development they do. We have new developments announced every week and a half on average, whereas it takes them a few months to get a new development. I think they are just finishing up a wave and their developers are waiting to see how new projects are absorbed into the market.

All that said...the perspectus for any city wanting to compete with OKC is to take any of these projects and actually spend time and effort on it. They'll all spend the same or a little more money, but what it comes down to are the two things that are in short supply in OKC: attention span and caring.

[Jim Kyle]

What is a few vs several? This is splitting hairs.

Well, I could say that there's a number of thousand-meter supertowers going up in the CBD and it would be true, since "zero" is a number. Would that also be splitting hairs? Sometimes connotation is everything, as any politician or journalist knows...

[BDP]

Of course there are a few building up for being demolished but it is still hardly an "astonishing rate". I'm not arguing in favor of any building being demolished but it happens constantly in every major city in the US.

When you look at all the under developed land in the core, any demolition is pretty astonishing at this point. And when you consider not just how much, but what we like to demolish, then it just becomes bizarre.

[Rover]

Would preservationists prefer a total moratorium on demolishing any structures in downtown? Elsewhere?

Which city has the best policy/set of laws, etc. for building preservation that we can lobby to poach from or incorporate into our own? Is it just a set of laws or is it the judgement of the overseers that makes the difference?

[Pete]

When you look at all the under developed land in the core, any demolition is pretty astonishing at this point. And when you consider not just how much, but what we like to demolish, then it just becomes bizarre.

Yes, there is empty space but very little completely empty space.

More often than not, there is some lone, stray, neglected building in the middle of a large area that is to be redeveloped. And that's when a building tends to come down.


SandRidge was an exception and I think those demolitions should never have been approved.

[Spartan]

Yes, there is empty space but very little completely empty space.

More often than not, there is some lone, stray, neglected building in the middle of a large area that is to be redeveloped. And that's when a building tends to come down.


SandRidge was an exception and I think those demolitions should never have been approved.

The Preftakes block isn't a lone, stray, neglected building. It is our last best remnants of historic Main Street though the neglected part I agree with.

The Film Exchange is more locally significant than anything in the new park except for Union Station.

[Pete]

Yes, but nothing has been demolished on the Preftakes block, apart from a non-historic structure next to the bus station.

We are all assuming demolitions here but there has not been any official plan revealed.

[bchris02]

If the long-rumored tower ever comes to frution, then I wouldn't see any problems with demolitions. If its just to add surface parking, then absolutely not.

I think there is no definitive answer for when demolition is appropriate. You have to ask WHAT is being demolished. Just because something is old doesn't necessarily mean its worth preserving. Next, you have to ask what is it being replaced with. The Sandridge thing was a travesty, but they basically held the city hostage saying they would move their HQ if they didn't allow it.

[5alive]

Freudian slip or not, I got quite a chuckle several pages back when he was called Preflakes lol

[ljbab728]

What is a few vs several? This is splitting hairs.

Spartan, you know I was referring to your "astonshing rate" statement. You make good many good points but go overboard with your descriptive language which doesn't apply to what is happening.

[Spartan]

It's astonishing to me that we keep tearing down buildings. For corporate towers, parking garages, parking lots, it all makes no difference.

[lasomeday]

It's astonishing to me that we keep tearing down buildings. For corporate towers, parking garages, parking lots, it all makes no difference.

and sidewalks....

[ljbab728]

It's astonishing to me that we keep tearing down buildings. For corporate towers, parking garages, parking lots, it all makes no difference.

Being astonished and saying an astonishing rate are totally different. Cities all over the country tear down building for the same things, for better or worse.

[HotStuff80]

I wish that OKC would have retained at least one of the older theaters downtown... in my day there, there were several. Of all, I liked the State and Harbor (across the street from each other).

[UnFrSaKn]

Nothing new

10:49
Comment From Guest
Steve, what do you think Preftakes is up to?

10:51
Steve Lackmeyer: Conversion of One North Hudson (formerly the Hotel Black) into housing or a hotel, conversion of the bus station into a restaurant and/or music venue, and likely demolition of other structures to make way for a new office tower.