City Council Salaries

[shawnw]

I was curious about city council salaries and I found the above graphic. While it is not representative of peer cities to OKC, my eyes were very opened about the disparity between these cities, many of which can be considered peers with one another. Also the whole part-time/full-time thing was interesting...

[Pete]

Also, OKC has the "weak mayor" system whereby the City Council has more power and authority than a lot of cities.

Perhaps it's time to pay the council a decent wage so we can get people in who can spend more time on the job.

[zookeeper]

Actually, I usually see it the other way around. In a strong mayor, typically the other councilors' roles are more important. They provide more operational oversight by checking the mayor. Nevertheless, we agree. Salaries need to come up quite a bit.

This is exactly right. Also, many councilors in cities with a strong mayor system also have "commissioner" duties and are actually responsible in managerial roles for executing certain public duties. This requires full-time status and holds very specific people with actual names that people elect (or not) accountable.

[Urban Pioneer]

I'm glad someone started a thread on this. I'm a strong proponent of an increase. Most young and middle aged peoplw cannot afford to serve. We need their voice on council... desperately.

[onthestrip]

A measure to raise city councilors pay was on the ballot a few years ago and was soundly defeated. Im assuming most voters didnt think more than 2 seconds about it to maybe see that a decent wage would allow a regular joe type to be able to run.

Meanwhile, our state lawmakers are some of the highest paid in the region. All for a job that only requires 4 days a week, 4-5 months a year of work.

[shawnw]

Not sure why that image came out so small. What I uploaded was much larger...

[venture]

A measure to raise city councilors pay was on the ballot a few years ago and was soundly defeated. Im assuming most voters didnt think more than 2 seconds about it to maybe see that a decent wage would allow a regular joe type to be able to run.

Meanwhile, our state lawmakers are some of the highest paid in the region. All for a job that only requires 4 days a week, 4-5 months a year of work.

Most just immediately think that elected officials don't need more money and that tax payers shouldn't pay for it. They definitely don't understand how demanding local positions can be when it comes to mayor and council. I have relatives that have been or currently are mayors and councilmen in cities up North. The demand on them is pretty high, even in smaller cities.

[HOT ROD]

I agree the council should get higher salary. Isn't it $24,000 now, with the mayor getting $36,000 or something like that. I also think OKC needs more council wards so that the city is better represented than the 8 ward setup.

Urban Wards = 5 (Downtown, Cap Hill/Southside, Inner Northside, Eastside)
Suburban Wards = 3 (NW, N, W)
Rural Wards = 2 (S, N)
At Large = 2

Council Salary (FT) = $50,000. Extra $15,000 for a Commissioner duty [Recreation, Airport, Public Safety, Transit, Schools, Code, Events, Community/Neighbourhoods, Utilities].

Mayor (FT) = $75,000, Vice Mayor (PT) = $30,000

Such a setup would make the mayor 'stronger' but not as a single person (more as an 'office') and s/he'd work full-time for OKC instead of just PR/face. Council would be stronger also, with commissioner duties appointed by the mayor. City Manager would still be the CEO of city operations but would be accountable to the mayor, who appoints him/her.

Council would be elected based on the ward office, with citywide voting for mayor and at-large. Vice Mayor is nominated by mayor (approved by council) and heads commission meetings as well as assists the mayor (think junior mayor or mayor in training - perfect job for a young person to get experience in city govt/mayorship).

[Dubya61]

I'm not sure that you can get by with just two rural wards, or at least don't think you could lump all of the south-side rural together. There's really a LOT of rural acreage east of Draper and quite a bit west of the airport. Would those both make up the "south" rural ward?

Not trying to stop the discussion or nitpick a good idea. Just curious about your reasoning.

[flintysooner]

City of Oklahoma City | City Council

A City Charter amendment in 1927 established the Council-Manager form of government. In this form of City government, an elected Mayor and City Council set policy and conduct City business. The Mayor and Council appoint a professional City Manager to carry out the day-to-day operations of City government.

Terms of service are for four years. Pay is $12,000 annually. The Mayor is elected every four years. The next Mayoral election is set for 2014. Pay is $24,000 annually.

[shawnw]

It'd be a good first step to double those (even at part time). Then work on the long term plan as far as number of seats and structure and future pay and such.

[shawnw]

"MAPS for Government Pay" campaign anyone?


(no, not really)

[Jersey Boss]

I'm not sure that you can get by with just two rural wards, or at least don't think you could lump all of the south-side rural together. There's really a LOT of rural acreage east of Draper and quite a bit west of the airport. Would those both make up the "south" rural ward?

Not trying to stop the discussion or nitpick a good idea. Just curious about your reasoning.

Should the wards represent people or acreage? I personally do not think large landowners should have more say than apartment dwellers.

[Jeepnokc]

I'm not sure that you can get by with just two rural wards, or at least don't think you could lump all of the south-side rural together. There's really a LOT of rural acreage east of Draper and quite a bit west of the airport. Would those both make up the "south" rural ward?

Not trying to stop the discussion or nitpick a good idea. Just curious about your reasoning.

Would make sense to be more of a SE and a SW rural area as there isn't really a south rural area as OKC south middle area is definitely not rural. So, if just a south, then would have a huge area splitting the ward into two separate areas. Also, the needs of SW rural OKC are going to be different than the needs of SE rural OKC. SE rural isn't going to give a flip about commercial developments around airport any more than I care about commercial development near Choctaw road. I understand it should be based on population but needs to be contiguous population that have the same interests.

[Dubya61]

Should the wards represent people or acreage? I personally do not think large landowners should have more say than apartment dwellers.

You went down the wrong rabbit hole with your response. I'm certainly not advocating council representation based on acreage. I'm just asking why the idea put forth by Hot Rod would have two rural wards: one north and one south. If you were to look at the map of the city, there are probably about four rural sections that don't even share a border unless you were to draw them with a really weird crayon. Could you reasonably expect a councilman to capably represent two non-adjacent areas. For example how well represented would you feel in DC, if Oklahoma and North Dakota were to suddenly share a single senator?

[shawnw]

The mayor, being 1 vote on the council, is essentially an at-large councilman in a sense...

[windowphobe]

The wards are supposed to be equal in population, or as close as is humanly (or, lately, computer-ly) possible. If you want to draw a 12-ward map, start in the far corners of the city and move inward until you've enclosed 51,000 people in each of twelve segments. It will not, I suspect, look that different from the current 8-ward map.

[shawnw]

Many cities do at-large councilors that don't have a specific ward/district, which I think some of the 12 were proposed to be.

[HOT ROD]

I'm not sure that you can get by with just two rural wards, or at least don't think you could lump all of the south-side rural together. There's really a LOT of rural acreage east of Draper and quite a bit west of the airport. Would those both make up the "south" rural ward?

Not trying to stop the discussion or nitpick a good idea. Just curious about your reasoning.

Oh, no worries Dubya. This is good conversation and I didn't take it the wrong way.

My reasoning for the rural being lumped in as you correctly noted was more of trying to account for relative population/impact of an area. Most of said rural is similar in environment, development, and population so I lumped the whole south rural as one and the whole north rural as another. We could do it another way, but I made up for doing this by also including two 'at-large' counselors who could very well come from and/or represent the rural to try to balance the densely populated urban and suburb wards.

But sure, there could be another way to do it - I was just thinking in terms of similar environment, population, development (and potential), and use of the area. But yes, SW and W OKC is definitely industrial while far SE is not, so you definitely raise a good point and I do see your point. How would you draw it out.

And everyone - please lend your suggestions. Who knows, maybe this could help get the ball rolling?

[HOT ROD]

yes, good points everyone. I agree about the rural and I was trying to capture land use and get some population. But yes, I did throw in two at large to try and balance the dense areas a little bit. It may not happen but at least there is a chance with two at-large (and mayor as was mentioned).

Good discussions everyone. If anybody has the time and skill, could someone take a stab at a map? (I know it's asking a lot but we have plenty of time. lol).

Also, thanks for correcting me on the current salaries. I didn't realize they were STILL so low and frankly, Im even more embarrassed and think it should change. I think we'd probably get more participation and 'use' out of the council if the made more and the role was intended to be full time (or mostly FT). And certainly with more zones/wards, we'd probably get better representation of the city.

Good points!

[Dubya61]

Oh, no worries Dubya. This is good conversation and I didn't take it the wrong way.

My reasoning for the rural being lumped in as you correctly noted was more of trying to account for relative population/impact of an area. Most of said rural is similar in environment, development, and population so I lumped the whole south rural as one and the whole north rural as another. We could do it another way, but I made up for doing this by also including two 'at-large' counselors who could very well come from and/or represent the rural to try to balance the densely populated urban and suburb wards.

But sure, there could be another way to do it - I was just thinking in terms of similar environment, population, development (and potential), and use of the area. But yes, SW and W OKC is definitely industrial while far SE is not, so you definitely raise a good point and I do see your point. How would you draw it out.

And everyone - please lend your suggestions. Who knows, maybe this could help get the ball rolling?

I'm absolutely rotten at drawing, but I'd make the two rural wards East and west (and maybe lump the NE rural areas in with the North Suburban ward).
TBH, I'm more about de-annexing the areas that are rural in nature.

[shawnw]

I'm not a big fan of the disproportion in pay between the mayor/councilpeople and the city manager. I know Mr Couch works hard and he should be duly compensated but goodness...

Oklahoma City Council agrees to 2 percent raises | News OK

[HOT ROD]

I couldn't agree more.

[shawnw]

Does OKC need more seats on the city council? | News OK

One of the bullets is relevant to this discussion:

"- Whether having part-time council members — earning $12,000 per year — limits those who can afford to serve."

[betts]

Yes. Who can take a Wednesday morning a month off? People who are self-employed or retired generally.