Plaza District

[Urbanized]

According to cafeboef - and he is an actual authority on the matter - that is a correct assessment, but he is saying that also suits the Plaza folks just fine, as they are not wanting ABC-3 in the neighborhood.

My point was that if they were open to or seeking ABC-3 places they would be unintentionally rendered illegal by the location of the church. I think that is a law that needs to be addressed. It was done so previously to mitigate the unintended effect ACM@UCO had in Bricktown, but lawmakers only addressed the "school" part of the law, and not the "church" part. Even then they gave the school yes/no power.

Under the current law a storefront church could move into a place like Midtown or Bricktown and effectively derail all efforts to bring a true bar or a nightclub into those areas.

[warreng88]

Alright, so I take it this means the Plaza district will never get any true bars? Anything going into that area will have to be ABC-2 meaning it must be primarily a restaurant?

That is correct. The only full bar in the area is Scorecards Sports Bar which is right around the corner from Bad Granny's and the only reason it is allowed to be there is because it was Grandfathered in.

[bchris02]

I never knew there was such strict regulation on opening bars/nightclubs in OKC. That would explain why most trendy nightlife destinations here are primarily restaurants. Does Midtown and uptown have the same restrictions?

[warreng88]

I never knew there was such strict regulation on opening bars/nightclubs in OKC. That would explain why most trendy nightlife destinations here are primarily restaurants. Does Midtown and uptown have the same restrictions?

I don't think it is all over OKC, I know that particular regulation is in place in the Plaza District. Obviously BT doesn't have it because there are restaurant/bars and just bars in that area.

[Teo9969]

0% chance Saint's derives 50% of it's sales from food. Does that put them at risk of losing their ABC-2?

[bchris02]

0% chance Saint's derives 50% of it's sales from food. Does that put them at risk of losing their ABC-2?

I read somewhere that 3.2 beer is considered a non-alcoholic drink legally. I wonder if they can factor that into their food total. Many people will always order a Bud or a Coors no matter what.

[Urbanized]

That is correct. The only full bar in the area is Scorecards Sports Bar which is right around the corner from Bad Granny's and the only reason it is allowed to be there is because it was Grandfathered in.

I'm pretty sure Scorecards is a beer bar, that is, 3.2 beers only with no mixed beverage licensing. I've only been in once (in the past year though), and I'm 99% sure it is ABC-1.

[catch22]

I read somewhere that 3.2 beer is considered a non-alcoholic drink legally. I wonder if they can factor that into their food total. Many people will always order a Bud or a Coors no matter what.

They don't serve that garbage at Saints.

[Urbanized]

I never knew there was such strict regulation on opening bars/nightclubs in OKC. That would explain why most trendy nightlife destinations here are primarily restaurants. Does Midtown and uptown have the same restrictions?

The 300' (I think) cushion around churches and schools preventing ABC-3 is statewide. It was modified recently to allow schools to permit bars within that radius, if so inclined. This was specifically so that ACM@UCO could give permission to bars to located in Bricktown. However, no such provision was made for churches. If a church was staunchly against bars, they could open a storefront near a bar district and absolutely kill it, provided they could find a willing landlord. Also, even if a church (like the one in the photos) was accepting, there is still no legal mechanism that would allow them to say "it's OK, that bar can locate here," like a school can.

What cafeboef is saying is that there is a specific overlay in Plaza that forbids ABC-3, and that the Plaza district folks are cool with that. I can understand some of the reasons this might be the case, as it controls the tenant mix a little more closely in an area that is closely surrounded by houses, and an area that is still on the rebound. They want to encourage places like Saints and Mule without having a rogue bar or nightclub pop up. That said, a great bar like Grandad's would apparently be impossible in Plaza.

Bricktown has no specific restrictions like this, and I am unaware of whether Midtown does, but doubt it. The church thing (or an non-accepting school) could still be a problem for someone in these areas, though.

[soonerguru]

The 300' (I think) cushion around churches and schools preventing ABC-3 is statewide. It was modified recently to allow schools to permit bars within that radius, if so inclined. This was specifically so that ACM@UCO could give permission to bars to located in Bricktown. However, no such provision was made for churches. If a church was staunchly against bars, they could open a storefront near a bar district and absolutely kill it, provided they could find a willing landlord. Also, even if a church (like the one in the photos) was accepting, there is still no legal mechanism that would allow them to say "it's OK, that bar can locate here," like a school can.

What cafeboef is saying is that there is a specific overlay in Plaza that forbids ABC-3, and that the Plaza district folks are cool with that. I can understand some of the reasons this might be the case, as it controls the tenant mix a little more closely in an area that is closely surrounded by houses, and an area that is still on the rebound. They want to encourage places like Saints and Mule without having a rogue bar or nightclub pop up. That said, a great bar like Grandad's would apparently be impossible in Plaza.

Bricktown has no specific restrictions like this, and I am unaware of whether Midtown does, but doubt it. The church thing (or an non-accepting school) could still be a problem for someone in these areas, though.

We should start banning churches. They should have to be licensed.

[UnFrSaKn]

We should start banning churches. They should have to be licensed.

[CuatrodeMayo]

We should start banning churches. They should have to be licensed.

In many cases, zoning requires churches to go through a Special Use Permit process, which can be almost as rigorous.

[ljbab728]

I'm wondering how the bar service at the theater fits into this. I'm sure it is very legal but it must have some kind of different regulation governing it.

[warreng88]

I'm wondering how the bar service at the theater fits into this. I'm sure it is very legal but it must have some kind of different regulation governing it.

The only time there is a full bar, it is being catered. All the other times it is beer and wine only. That might explain it, but I am not sure.

[Pete]

Classen Ten Penn neighborhood stepping up it's identity:

[betts]

Classen Ten Penn neighborhood stepping up it's identity:

That's great. If I were a first time home buyer, that's where I'd be looking.

[PhiAlpha]

That's great. If I were a first time home buyer, that's where I'd be looking.

Cool!!!!!

[Urbanized]

I knew there would be skinny jeans involved.

[warreng88]

I saw a tweet from the Plaza District that the Guatemalan grocery store on the SW corner of NW 16th and Indiana will be open tomorrow. I will try to swing by and get some pictures and a Mexican coke if I have time.

[5alive]

Haha...if this were 1965...I knew there would be bellbottom jeans involved.

[Pete]

I saw a tweet from the Plaza District that the Guatemalan grocery store on the SW corner of NW 16th and Indiana will be open tomorrow. I will try to swing by and get some pictures and a Mexican coke if I have time.

That is http://www.okctalk.com/restaurants-b...emaltecos.html.

But I think they are changing their name to Chiltepes Latin Cuisine.

[stratosphere]

went there last night, had a great time, Empire pizza is delicious and I love the pink elephant for some reason.

I should add that I did not take a picture of the pink elephant, for some reason, and I wish now that I had.

[Pete]

Just heard there will be a new pub going into the Plaza District.

Hope to provide more details very soon.

1. Saints
2. The Mule
3. Empire
4. New Pub

Plus Scorecard (hole-in-the-wall).


We may finally have a real, concentrated bar district on our hands.

[OKCisOK4me]

I thought Empire was a pizza joint?

[Pete]

I thought Empire was a pizza joint?

Well, it's a restaurant / bar, with very strong bar activity.

The Mule is very similar.