San Antonio | Deep In The Heart.

[josh]

Just wondering, but why is it when you guys talk about Texas booms towns you always seem to neglect San Antonio?

It's the second fastest growing metro in Texas and grew by over 20% from 1990 to 2000 and over 25% from 2000 to 2010. And city wise, is usually in the top 3 nation wide for population growth.

[bchris02]

Just wondering, but why is it when you guys talk about Texas booms towns you always seem to neglect San Antonio?

It's the second fastest growing metro in Texas and grew by over 20% from 1990 to 2000 and over 25% from 2000 to 2010. And city wise, is usually in the top 3 nation wide for population growth.

San Antonio is simply overshadowed by Austin and doesn't get as much love from the media. You are right though. Personally, I think San Antonio has much better infrastructure than Austin and could be a much larger city without growth being choked off.

[lasomeday]

San Antonio is simply overshadowed by Austin and doesn't get as much love from the media. You are right though. Personally, I think San Antonio has much better infrastructure than Austin and could be a much larger city without growth being choked off.

I am surprised that San Antonio hasn't had an NFL team relocate there.

[G.Walker]

Just wondering, but why is it when you guys talk about Texas booms towns you always seem to neglect San Antonio?

It's the second fastest growing metro in Texas and grew by over 20% from 1990 to 2000 and over 25% from 2000 to 2010. And city wise, is usually in the top 3 nation wide for population growth.

If OKC was that close to the Mexico border we would be booming to....lol

[adaniel]

Just wondering, but why is it when you guys talk about Texas booms towns you always seem to neglect San Antonio?

It's the second fastest growing metro in Texas and grew by over 20% from 1990 to 2000 and over 25% from 2000 to 2010. And city wise, is usually in the top 3 nation wide for population growth.

SA is a good example that not all growth is good growth.

When I lived in Dallas the main rap on SA is it has very little industry and generally low pay compared to DFW, Houston, Austin, and even OKC. The economy is driven mainly by military and tourism, although they've had some success in luring industry like Toyota. Most people who move there are retirees, army transfers, or are equity refugees from the coasts.

Don't get me wrong, I love SA. Lots of culture and a "little big town vibe." And its nice that there are a few places left in the US that are not overly commercialized train wrecks. But San Antonio is something of a lifestyle destination, similar to locales like Florida, Arizona, or to a lesser extent Colorado. Unless you have a beach, niche culture, or ideal climate thats something very hard to recreate.

[G.Walker]

^ Exactly...

[bradh]

San Antonio definitely has a better road network than Austin, but yeah, what adaniel said is spot on.

[soonerguru]

San Antonio is simply overshadowed by Austin and doesn't get as much love from the media. You are right though. Personally, I think San Antonio has much better infrastructure than Austin and could be a much larger city without growth being choked off.

San Antonio's sprawl is effing ridiculous.

[bradh]

I know up 281 it's almost one damn continuous city now up to Spring Branch, no?

That used to be country up there.

[zookeeper]

San Antonio definitely has a better road network than Austin, but yeah, what adaniel said is spot on.

You're right about that! And worse yet, Austin has very little they can do about it in the worst spots.

[josh]

SA is a good example that not all growth is good growth.

When I lived in Dallas the main rap on SA is it has very little industry and generally low pay compared to DFW, Houston, Austin, and even OKC. The economy is driven mainly by military and tourism, although they've had some success in luring industry like Toyota. Most people who move there are retirees, army transfers, or are equity refugees from the coasts.

Don't get me wrong, I love SA. Lots of culture and a "little big town vibe." And its nice that there are a few places left in the US that are not overly commercialized train wrecks. But San Antonio is something of a lifestyle destination, similar to locales like Florida, Arizona, or to a lesser extent Colorado. Unless you have a beach, niche culture, or ideal climate thats something very hard to recreate.

I'm sorry, I have to laugh at this (and at those agreeing with this) because aside from be completely incorrect, it's based off a false "perception" from one of the most pretentious city's in this country (Dallas). I guess if you're not part of the standard Dallas mentally/lifestyle, you know, being a $35,000 a year millionaire, you're not worthy.

Anyway, it's inaccurate because the economy isn't driven by the military or tourism. In fact, tourism isn't even one of the top five largest economic industries in San Antonio.

The two largest economic impact industries in San Antonio are the health care industry and the financial industry followed by the military, then manufacturing, then IT. Oil and Gas come after that.

Another thing, as of 2012, both San Antonio and Oklahoma City have very similar pay. So, similar pay for both places however, San Antonio has a lower cost of living.

[josh]

After looking at a map, that is depressing. I remember when FM 1604 was pretty much the end of the earth for people there.

And that seems to be the time period you still seem to perceive San Antonio with.

Btw, this isn't the 80s anymore Adaniel, it's called Loop 1604, not FM 1604.

[josh]

Green Country sent me a PM informing me that I was incorrect in my claim that San Antonio was the second fastest growing metro in Texas, it was in fact the third fastest growing. I tried to reply to the PM but his or her folder is full and therefore would not accept my reply.

Here is that reply:
_______________________________________

You are correct. I was mistaken. I did my own calculations and it seems I messed up when calculating Houston's percentage between 2000-2010, because I got a lower number than the one your showing and the one I just did myself to confirm. I said, I was incorrect. However, my point remains. San Antonio is on par or better than Dallas and Houston in those recent figures, yet, it is never mentioned when Texas boom towns are talked about.

[hoya]

And that seems to be the time period you still seem to perceive San Antonio with.

Btw, this isn't the 80s anymore Adaniel, it's called Loop 1604, not FM 1604.

Sounds like you'd have more fun on SanAntonioTalk.com.

[adaniel]

Sounds like you'd have more fun on SanAntonioTalk.com.

This.

Didn't think I was that harsh in my assessment of SA. Its actually one of my favorite cities. Poster asked why San Antonio isn't mentioned more on here, I gave them an answer. I know several people from that area, including a girl I semi-dated, and what I typed was largely their opinions, not mine. And then there's this: Left Behind: Why People Leave San Antonio | The Rivard Report

Still like and respect what San Antonio is doing. With that in mind, I am too excited about what's going on in OKC to get into an argument about whats going on in a city that in many ways is completely different than ours.

[PWitty]

I'm sorry, I have to laugh at this (and at those agreeing with this) because aside from be completely incorrect, it's based off a false "perception" from one of the most pretentious city's in this country (Dallas). I guess if you're not part of the standard Dallas mentally/lifestyle, you know, being a $35,000 a year millionaire, you're not worthy.

Anyway, it's inaccurate because the economy isn't driven by the military or tourism. In fact, tourism isn't even one of the top five largest economic industries in San Antonio.

The two largest economic impact industries in San Antonio are the health care industry and the financial industry followed by the military, then manufacturing, then IT. Oil and Gas come after that.

Another thing, as of 2012, both San Antonio and Oklahoma City have very similar pay. So, similar pay for both places however, San Antonio has a lower cost of living.

You could use any reasoning you want, but the truth is that in most people's minds Houston, Dallas, and Austin are always going to come first when they think of Texas. Because of that San Antonio is never going to get the kind of attention it probably deserves.

[josh]

You could use any reasoning you want, but the truth is that in most people's minds Houston, Dallas, and Austin are always going to come first when they think of Texas. Because of that San Antonio is never going to get the kind of attention it probably deserves.

I highly doubt that. Maybe on this forum but not in general or every day life across this country or the globe.

[josh]

This.

Didn't think I was that harsh in my assessment of SA. Its actually one of my favorite cities. Poster asked why San Antonio isn't mentioned more on here, I gave them an answer. I know several people from that area, including a girl I semi-dated, and what I typed was largely their opinions, not mine. And then there's this: Left Behind: Why People Leave San Antonio | The Rivard Report

Still like and respect what San Antonio is doing. With that in mind, I am too excited about what's going on in OKC to get into an argument about whats going on in a city that in many ways is completely different than ours.

And I responded to your inaccurate answer.

Btw, what does a blog about people leaving San Antonio because of jobs have to do with anything pertaining to the question I asked. You could make the same blog post about every city or metro in this country, including Oklahoma City. Unless, no one ever leaves Oklahoma City for job reasons...

My question was about San Antonio having the same (or better) growth as the other boom towns but never mentioning. I guess sub-textually, I was using the question as a way to inform this board of what San Antonio has done and continues to do.

I feel like there's a bit of ignorance when it comes to San Antonio on this forum.

[Bellaboo]

It could be that the perception of SA compared to Dallas, Houston and Austin is due to their lack of a prominant downtown core. Kind of like Ft Worth is overshadowed by Dallas's skyscrapers, whether unjustly or not.

[josh]

It could be that the perception of SA compared to Dallas, Houston and Austin is due to their lack of a prominant downtown core. Kind of like Ft Worth is overshadowed by Dallas's skyscrapers, whether unjustly or not.

By prominent downtown core, do you mean specifically the skyline?

Because aside from that one trivial aspect, downtown San Antonio is probably the most active downtown in Texas. From workers to tourists to locals. They're all downtown, from sunrise to sunset and longer.

Also, this may not be known here, but in the last two years, nearly 2,000 housing units have been added to the urban core and nearly 1,000 units are under construction or proposed now.

There is also a yet to be proposed 800 unit mixed-use development (multiple towers) planned for the Pearl area. The developers have talked about it but have yet to officially "propose" it.

Then there's the over 1 billion dollars in public investment currently going on in downtown, right now.

These four projects are planned or under construction:

VIA Modern Streetcar ($280 million)
Hemisfair Park redevelopment (180 million)
San Pedro Creek redevelopment (200 million)
San Antonio Convention Center expansion (350 million)

The VIA streetcar will be up and running by 2017.

The Hemisfair redevelopment will add 20-acres of park land to downtown as well as turn a seldom used area into a mxed-use neighborhood.

The San Pedro Creek redevelopment will basically give downtown San Antonio two "Riverwalks", this one on the west side of downtown. The actual Riverwalk was expanded two miles to the north, this extension is called the Museum Reach.

I could also include the Tobin Center for the Performing Arts, which is currently under construction with a fall 2014 opening planned. That cost $210 million.

Also, it was announced yesterday that H&M, PF Chang's, Yardhouse, Margaritaville and more are adding locations to downtown. Are part of the redevelopment of the Joske's building, which will also see a mixed-use tower component.

[PWitty]

I highly doubt that. Maybe on this forum but not in general or every day life across this country or the globe.

In my experience, that is just not true. I'm from Kansas City, and when I graduated from KU last May nobody was talking about moving to San Antonio. Everyone I know who ended up in Texas ended up in Houston, then Dallas, then Austin in that order.

As for people's opinions around the country and globe, do you honestly think people from Europe or Asia think about San Antonio over Dallas or Houston when US cities come up?

Another thing that I think hurts San Antonio, is that it has the perception of being a very Hispanic oriented city. It has a lot of Mexican heritage, and over 63% of its population is Hispanic. Some people prefer a city that is a little more diverse.

Edit: I don't mean any of these points as insults towards San Antonio. I'm just trying to say that SA does indeed have a lot of competition, just in it's own state, for publicity. That's why it doesn't get as much attention as some other cities, like Portland for example, who are the only major city in their state.

[shawnw]

San Antonio Convention Center expansion (350 million)

wow... their expanded convention center cost 40% more than our brand new one... hmmmm...

[josh]

wow... their expanded convention center cost 40% more than our brand new one... hmmmm...

Well, the expansion itself will be nearly twice the size as the entire proposed new OKC convention center.

[shawnw]

That sounded like a knock on their expansion, but really it was a knock on our cost estimate for a new convention center...

[josh]

In my experience, that is just not true. I'm from Kansas City, and when I graduated from KU last May nobody was talking about moving to San Antonio. Everyone I know who ended up in Texas ended up in Houston, then Dallas, then Austin in that order.

So your reasoning is grounded in anecdotal evidence. Makes sense.

As I said before, San Antonio had the second highest percentage for brain gain in 2012. It was actual a couple of decimals from being number one.

Between 2008 and 2011, San Antonio also ranked 2nd in the nation for brain gain.

As for people's opinions around the country and globe, do you honestly think people from Europe or Asia think about San Antonio over Dallas or Houston when US cities come up?

That's not at all what I said.

Another thing that I think hurts San Antonio, is that it has the perception of being a very Hispanic oriented city. It has a lot of Mexican heritage, and over 63% of its population is Hispanic. Some people prefer a city that is a little more diverse.

Ah, so it comes out, the cause of the bias I seem to get from you? I guess Atlanta being nearly 60% black and New Orleans being over 60% black and Minneapolis being over 60% white are hurting those cities? Or is a majority population only a problem if the majority is olive skin? You let me know, because I don't think "the perception of being a very White or very black city hurts them" would have come out of your keyboards. So, why the exception for Hispanic majority?

What's your opinion of Miami? 64% Hispanic population. Is your opinion the same, it hurts them?