Three Oklahoma Teens Allegedly Murder Baseball Player Out Of Boredom

[RadicalModerate]

Uhh...I guess i could be the character from dave shapel show who was actually black, and blind, and was in the kkk.

I think the world needs a lot more Dave Chappell (and Chris Rock or Bernie Mac (clones)) and a lot less Titi Boi(s).

[BBatesokc]

Then I apologize for being so terribly wrong in my viewpoint. I'm sorry. I might as well adjust my thinking to there's plenty of evil, thoughtless people out there who would sooner shoot you than look at you, so beware.

Not really sure where that's all coming from. I just think people are too quick to forget how truly evil some people are. Not that we should linger on that fact OR be hyper paranoid.

[boscorama]

Bunty - I think this case is getting so much attention (not becauses its rare) because it was a good looking kid that was shot, he was exchange student, and people being hyper race sensitive after TM murder.

Plus like I've said 10 times now, Oklahomans don't want to hear about an ugly white Guy shooting.a baby, its mother, her other daughter, and her grandmother in their face. But some wanna be gangbangers shorting a good looking Aussie,who had a good looking.girlfriend...now that's news.

O and keeping rappers on a bus for.9 hours arresting all of them for broke. Taillight, thn releasing them less than.an hour later after no drugs were found...who cares ...you aren't welcome here...yeeeeeehaaaaaawwww

Okay, about the guy who killed four family members, Dude, it was a domestic case where a guy goes nuts. The Duncan case is not the same. Get it?

Edited to clarify, I was responding to WT's whining about a different case than the stroller murder. Sigh.

[WilliamTell]

waste of time

[boitoirich]

William, this is embarrassing. Please stop for your own sake.

No one here is suggesting that this is worse because of the race of the criminals; no one is saying the attractiveness of the victim is a factor. Your problem is that this has become an international story and other crimes have not. Has it occurred to you that Trayvon Martin was an international story as well, with the races reversed. I personally find what happened to TM and to the Australian baseball player repulsive -- I could care less the color of the criminal (and George Zimmerman is a criminal, as there is no universe I live in where it's acceptable for me to follow someone's child around for any reason). This is headline news because three teenagers killed a likable foreign national for no reason other than boredom. Where else on Earth do children murder for sport with a firearm?

I've got plenty of friends in every corner of this planet, and so I've heard concern expressed about our gun culture for 2 decades now -- black rappers and white NRA members included. Trayvon Martin resonates globally and was a news story the world over, and so is this case.

[WilliamTell]

-Your problem is that this has become an international story and other crimes have not. Has it occurred to you that Trayvon Martin was an international story as well, with the races reversed.

-I personally find what happened to TM and to the Australian baseball player repulsive -- I could care less the color of the criminal (and George Zimmerman is a criminal, as there is no universe I live in where it's acceptable for me to follow someone's child around for any reason). This is headline news because three teenagers killed a likable foreign national for no reason other than boredom. Where else on Earth do children murder for sport with a firearm?

I've got plenty of friends in every corner of this planet, and so I've heard concern expressed about our gun culture for 2 decades now -- black rappers and white NRA members included. Trayvon Martin resonates globally and was a news story the world over, and so is this case.

-My problem has been, and will continue to be selective outrage - the same thing people were complaining about during GZ trail, why is this one important while chicago murder isnt.

-I agree. Things like this shouldnt be happening in a developed country. My problem is that when it does happen we splinter into fractions about what the color of the person was all the time and effort is wasted; when we should be asking why does everyone have all these weapons laying around and unsecured.

I've tried to figure that out myself. I just dont get where we all say, o race doesnt matter, it isnt about skin color. Then any time a tragedy happens focus turns to how dark a persons skin was and if they are a different religion than 'us'.

I've said it before - but when are morale and law abiding people going to start standing up for other morale and law abiding people. When you start splintering into fractions nothing gets accomplished and the entire conversation (just look at this thread) are wasted.

With that said this thread is pretty much dead, they have the suspects and confession so there really isnt much to talk about.

[BBatesokc]

....With that said this thread is pretty much dead, they have the suspects and confession so there really isnt much to talk about.

Actually, IMO, your statement is a part of the problem. The discussion has to move beyond the the suspects and guilt - not stop with it.

[kevinpate]

well, then, in the interest of moving on ... boredom and low to no moral compass is a recipe for any number of bad outcomes. Here, a firearm was involved. Then again, so was an automobile.

Could have been a pipe, knife, bat or scissors with the tool racks using bikes, scooters, skateboards, classic air jordans or wally world sale sneakers.

a firearm is a tool. can it be misused? sure. so can a gallon of gas and a BIC, a bottle of drano, a bottle of ammonia and a can of clorox, a hammer, a shovel, a screwdriver, a nailgun, a sander, etc., etc.

At some point you simply have to decide to lay the responsibility of the walking talking tools, and not whatever inanimate tool that is misused.

[boscorama]

-My problem has been, and will continue to be selective outrage - the same thing people were complaining about during GZ trail, why is this one important while chicago murder isnt.

-I agree. Things like this shouldnt be happening in a developed country. My problem is that when it does happen we splinter into fractions about what the color of the person was all the time and effort is wasted; when we should be asking why does everyone have all these weapons laying around and unsecured.



With that said this thread is pretty much dead, they have the suspects and confession so there really isnt much to talk about.

"Selective outrage" is normal, natural. People react in their own ways to everything. Nobody can select reactions for other people. Get over it.

[Zack232]

well, then, in the interest of moving on ... boredom and low to no moral compass is a recipe for any number of bad outcomes. Here, a firearm was involved. Then again, so was an automobile.

Could have been a pipe, knife, bat or scissors with the tool racks using bikes, scooters, skateboards, classic air jordans or wally world sale sneakers.

a firearm is a tool. can it be misused? sure. so can a gallon of gas and a BIC, a bottle of drano, a bottle of ammonia and a can of clorox, a hammer, a shovel, a screwdriver, a nailgun, a sander, etc., etc.

At some point you simply have to decide to lay the responsibility of the walking talking tools, and not whatever inanimate tool that is misused.

If we were to follow that logic, why don't we legalize automatic firearms, bombs, grenades; because after all, it's not the tool, it's the person. So it doesn't matter that a gun is significantly more dangerous than a bat, the person was going to murder someone anyways. A firearm is not a tool comparable to a gallon of gas, a hammer, a screwdriver or shovel. You said that a firearm was a tool, and that it was misused. However, it wasn't misused. A firearm has only one purpose, and it is to kill. I think it accomplished the task.

[Just the facts]

After recent incidents here in Jacksonville I think we really need to start taking a hard look at people who are mentally ill and find something to do with them. Our most horrific crimes are be perpetrated by the mentally ill. The most recent mass shootings that has everyone wanting to ban guns were all committed by people who were known to be mentally ill. I'm sure drug use is also a common thread in most crimes.

[kevinpate]

... A firearm has only one purpose, and it is to kill. ...

You're entitled to your opinion, irrespective of how unsupportable and lacking in fact it appears to be.

[Mel]

All these "friends" showing up at his memorial is nice. I wish one of them had told him when and where is not good for a solo jog.

[boscorama]

waste of time

Yep.

[boscorama]

All these "friends" showing up at his memorial is nice. I wish one of them had told him when and where is not good for a solo jog.

The students in Ada were perhaps not familiar with Duncan. Doesn't matter when Evil steps in.

[Mel]

The students in Ada were perhaps not familiar with Duncan. Doesn't matter when Evil steps in.

True, being in groups help scare evil off though. I'm just Monday morning quarterbacking.

[Zack232]

You're entitled to your opinion, irrespective of how unsupportable and lacking in fact it appears to be.

The premise of my argument was that a bat, a screw driver, and a gallon of gas are not created for the sole purpose of shooting a projectile at lethal speeds, because they're not weapons, and classifying them as "tools" alongside firearms is lazy and a misrepresentation of how drastically more dangerous a firearm is. If you believe that statement is "unsupportable" and "lacking in fact" I'm very curious of what you use firearms and gallons of gas for.

[WilliamTell]

I use my gun to open my beer, door stop, paper weight, and fashion accessory.

Murrica.

[ljbab728]

I use my gun to open my beer, door stop, paper weight, and fashion accessory.

Murrica.

Does that have any meaning?

[WilliamTell]

Post 137 and 142

[ljbab728]

Post 137 and 142

OK, I guess.

[kevinpate]

The premise of my argument was that a bat, a screw driver, and a gallon of gas are not created for the sole purpose of shooting a projectile at lethal speeds, because they're not weapons, and classifying them as "tools" alongside firearms is lazy and a misrepresentation of how drastically more dangerous a firearm is. If you believe that statement is "unsupportable" and "lacking in fact" I'm very curious of what you use firearms and gallons of gas for.

Your original premise was flawed, and your modified premise is as well. I"ll presume you recognize you did already change your premise.
You began with: A firearm has only one purpose, and that is to kill

You have now moved to a firearm being: created for the sole purpose of shooting a projectile at lethal speeds

This modified position, though still flawed, shows the ability to reevaluate. You may eventually reach reality:
A firearm is a tool. Like any tool, it has a variety of uses, proper and improper.
A firearm permits a user to send a projectile at the user's intended target.
The speed of the projectile varies depending on several factors.
The projectile is capable of causing a variety of consequences, varying from minor to lethal to extremely catastrophic.
The level of consequence is dependent upon the skill, knowledge and intent of the user.
The same tool that can put a tight grouping in a range target, demonstrating skill in use, can help put food on a table and scare off a predator. It can likewise disable a fleeing suspect or advancing attacker, or injure an innocent bystander, or end the life of a dangerous threat, or end the life an innocent person.
The same tool which permits a user to put on a marksmanship display can trigger an explosion if the user fires a projectile into certain substances.

As to your curiosity about a gallon of gas, while I do not misuse gasoline, some outside the norm uses, which occur too frequently, include burning of evidence and/or a body, living or deceased, in a stolen vehicle, rapid destruction of a structure, occupied or empty, suicide and torture. Folks who possess a working moral compass tend to only use it to power their vehicles or common tools like lawnmowers and trimmers. At times they get adventurous and burn out a stump or quick start a bonfire, but by and large they exercise care if how they use it.

It is not the tool that creates the danger.

[Teo9969]

Your original premise was flawed, and your modified premise is as well. I"ll presume you recognize you did already change your premise.
You began with: A firearm has only one purpose, and that is to kill

You have now moved to a firearm being: created for the sole purpose of shooting a projectile at lethal speeds

This modified position, though still flawed, shows the ability to reevaluate. You may eventually reach reality:
A firearm is a tool. Like any tool, it has a variety of uses, proper and improper.
A firearm permits a user to send a projectile at the user's intended target.
The speed of the projectile varies depending on several factors.
The projectile is capable of causing a variety of consequences, varying from minor to lethal to extremely catastrophic.
The level of consequence is dependent upon the skill, knowledge and intent of the user.
The same tool that can put a tight grouping in a range target, demonstrating skill in use, can help put food on a table and scare off a predator. It can likewise disable a fleeing suspect or advancing attacker, or injure an innocent bystander, or end the life of a dangerous threat, or end the life an innocent person.
The same tool which permits a user to put on a marksmanship display can trigger an explosion if the user fires a projectile into certain substances.

As to your curiosity about a gallon of gas, while I do not misuse gasoline, some outside the norm uses, which occur too frequently, include burning of evidence and/or a body, living or deceased, in a stolen vehicle, rapid destruction of a structure, occupied or empty, suicide and torture. Folks who possess a working moral compass tend to only use it to power their vehicles or common tools like lawnmowers and trimmers. At times they get adventurous and burn out a stump or quick start a bonfire, but by and large they exercise care if how they use it.

It is not the tool that creates the danger.

You are correct that the tool (in this case a gun) does not create the danger. However, it does enhance the environment and potent of danger.

[Midtowner]

It is not the tool that creates the danger.

If the tool was created for the purpose of killing people, I'd say a gun would be much more effective than a bat, a gallon of gasoline or a screwdriver. Quite a bit more effort is required for those to kill a person. I can't, offhand, think of a single instance of a drive by baseball-batting or drive by screwdriver shanking. A gun is different. It's literally point and shoot.

The inherent danger insofar as its capacity to end life is more vastly greater than any of those things. This increases the lethality of that tool when it inevitably falls into the wrong hands.

[BBatesokc]

If the tool was created for the purpose of killing people, I'd say a gun would be much more effective than a bat, a gallon of gasoline or a screwdriver. Quite a bit more effort is required for those to kill a person. I can't, offhand, think of a single instance of a drive by baseball-batting or drive by screwdriver shanking. A gun is different. It's literally point and shoot.

The inherent danger insofar as its capacity to end life is more vastly greater than any of those things. This increases the lethality of that tool when it inevitably falls into the wrong hands.

But, IMO, makes the tool no more responsible for the end result. I blame index fingers!