Who has the toughest police department in Oklahoma City metro............

[spursfaninoklahoma]

A friend and I were discussing which suburb in Oklahoma City has the toughest police department. The obvious came up, Moore or Edmond. We both agree Moore by far has the worst, but Edmond is not to far behind on "drivers beware". Both Moore and Edmond are two suburbs you better be alert and flat out don't drive to late at night in either one. I personally have been pulled over more in Edmond and Moore than any other place around. So Okc Talk nation whats your 2 cents on the matter? Any other suburbs need a "driver beware" sign before you enter...............

[BlackmoreRulz]

Arcadia, hands down...got a ticket there one time and forgot to pay it, luckily I noticed it the same day as the court date.....rushed out there and when I pulled up to the courthouse there had to be 300 people standing there trying to get inside.

[zookeeper]

Nichols Hills and Warr Acres are two you have to consider. The Village at one time, but things have changed.

[Roger S]

I live in Moore and I've never been pulled over here.... Never been pulled over in Edmond either.... Maybe you look more suspicious than I do.

[adaniel]

Really? No mention of Norman?

[OKCDrummer77]

I've never driven through it, but I hear the Valley Brook PD has a pretty bad rep.

[RadicalModerate]

I had an Arcadia police officer follow me on old 66 all the way from the center of town nearly to the dam early one morning, before dawn, with his lights on. I didn't see him because my rear view mirror was defective. When I finally pulled over, he was gracious and polite and just gave me a warning for going about four miles over the limit through town. He said that he was beginning to think he'd have to call Edmond for assistance in setting up a roadblock to end this low speed chase.

That never would have happened in Forest Park or Luther.

[OKCisOK4me]

Ok.....besides Moore, Norman, and Edmond...everyone else on here is naming lil small police departments that, YES, are going to pull you over for minor violations to try to earn money off of you for their small cities within cities. All I have to say is, if you know a ton of police officers, just don't name drop.

[Snowman]

Of the west side suburbs; Bethany seemed to always stand out from all the others for quickness to give tickets (least likely to give warnings), variety of violations cited and most irritating while talking to them.

[OKCisOK4me]

Of the west side suburbs; Bethany seemed to always stand out from all the others for quickness to give tickets (least likely to give warnings), variety of violations cited and most irritating while talking to them.

They are the biggest of the littlests. Who else their size has a city hall?

[Snowman]

They are the biggest of the littlests. Who else their size has a city hall?

All of them, they are like a quarter of Edmond's or Norman's population. It seems like if a city has only a few dozen people then they will probably have a city hall.

[TheSocialGadfly]

I realize that this answer is a bit esoteric, but I challenge anyone to find a more anal (and more inept) law enforcement force in the OKC metro than the group that patrols Tinker AFB (or any other air base, for that matter). But luckily, the SF are stuck issuing mostly Playskool tickets that anyone can purchase from Toys "R" Us (DD Form 1408), which are strictly administrative toilet paper. They can write 1805s (with reasonable fines), but they seldom do.

I realize that Tinker isn't really what the original poster had in mind, but that group is in the metro, and it easily takes the cake. Anyone who has driven on base will testify to that.

[kevinpate]

Really? No mention of Norman?

All in all, not so bad. I rarely interact with them as a motorist. In recent years, when I've had motorist contact it's been limited to seat belt citations (plus a warning here or there about my slightly overweight right toe.)

[mkjeeves]

Of the west side suburbs; Bethany seemed to always stand out from all the others for quickness to give tickets (least likely to give warnings), variety of violations cited and most irritating while talking to them.

Ding ding we have a winner. (Could be that I live nearby and deal with them on occasion...always seatbelt issues since I loathe to wear them.)

On the plus side, when I actually lived in Bethany many years ago, they had super fast response time compared to what I have now from OKC living a few blocks away from Bethany.

[adaniel]

All in all, not so bad. I rarely interact with them as a motorist. In recent years, when I've had motorist contact it's been limited to seat belt citations (plus a warning here or there about my slightly overweight right toe.)

Maybe they are changing. Honestly, me personally and everyone I know have had a bad experience with them. Very unprofessional and heavy-handed. And I am not some "rage against the machine" type that hates cops.

Oh, and I would second Valley Brook and Bethany. I really do not understand how either of these towns are existing right now.

[Spartan]

I've never driven through it, but I hear the Valley Brook PD has a pretty bad rep.

Not for pulling over drivers..

[Urbanized]

I got pulled over once in Nichols Hills simply for driving aimlessly in a pickup. My (now ex) wife and I lived on the edge of NH for most of the nineties & early part of the aughts. We were considering moving deeper into the neighborhood and into a bigger place, so decided to drive through the same streets we often biked and walked, looking for for-sale signs.

Cruising around in the truck I had at the time (a brand new F-150 super crew Lariat 4x4, NOT a beater), not five minutes into the drive we picked up a black-and-white tail. Within another minute or two we were pulled over. The "can we help you..?" greeting was pretty thick with intimidation. I played somewhere between oblivious and sarcastic, said we were looking for a house and asked if they could direct us to any.

I know WHY we looked suspicious to them (a pickup driving aimlessly in a wealthy neighborhood COULD be casing an area, looking for a quick opportunity to grab goods and throw them into the back), but the stop and the way it was handled was frustrating.

[MustangGT]

I've never driven through it, but I hear the Valley Brook PD has a pretty bad rep.

Within the LEO community Valley Brook and Forest Park are considered the worst dregs in the region.

[MrZ]

I had to run into Edmond one night around 1AM to drop a payment off for my office after being out of town all day. I was doing the speed limit and had a Edmond cop pull me over. There were two officers and one of them approached the car and said I had a tail light out. They asked for my ID and insurance and I handed them over knowing I had nothing to worry about. They came back and I could tell something was up right away. One of the officers had his holster unhooked and hand on his weapon and the other one told me to get out of the car. I got out and they proceeded to handcuff me and told me that I had a warrant out for my arrest. They put me in the back of the police car (a tight fit at 6'3") and one officer looked through my car with his flashlight while the other was on the computer and phone talking to OKC police. I sat in the back of that police car for close to an hour while they attempted to find this warrant. I finally heard the call come over the radio that there was no warrant to be found. The cops let me out and told me that I was lucky that they didn't find the warrant. I drove off and they followed me for a few minutes and then turned around and left me alone. I pulled over in the next parking lot to check and sure enough there was no bad tail light. I was not a happy camper that night.

[zookeeper]

I had to run into Edmond one night around 1AM to drop a payment off for my office after being out of town all day. I was doing the speed limit and had a Edmond cop pull me over. There were two officers and one of them approached the car and said I had a tail light out. They asked for my ID and insurance and I handed them over knowing I had nothing to worry about. They came back and I could tell something was up right away. One of the officers had his holster unhooked and hand on his weapon and the other one told me to get out of the car. I got out and they proceeded to handcuff me and told me that I had a warrant out for my arrest. They put me in the back of the police car (a tight fit at 6'3") and one officer looked through my car with his flashlight while the other was on the computer and phone talking to OKC police. I sat in the back of that police car for close to an hour while they attempted to find this warrant. I finally heard the call come over the radio that there was no warrant to be found. The cops let me out and told me that I was lucky that they didn't find the warrant. I drove off and they followed me for a few minutes and then turned around and left me alone. I pulled over in the next parking lot to check and sure enough there was no bad tail light. I was not a happy camper that night.

Where do I begin? First, I hope you did not give consent to the search of your vehicle. You said he searched your car with a flashlight. That's legal as long as he's outside of your car and looking in. The second he opens a door and begins to actively search inside for anything that cannot be seen from the outside (that might have given him probable cause) he has violated the law and you should be saying, clearly and directly, that you do not consent to a search.

Obviously, there was no warrant or you would have been arrested. But here's the thing, they cannot pull you over on a false complaint, a phony traffic violation in your case, and then begin a fishing expedition. Is there more to this story than you shared? Because there are so many violations by the officers in your story that it's just crazy.

They kept you for almost an hour? The rule-of-thumb is based on a SCOTUS ruling that mentioned "15-20 minutes" as being a reasonable amount of time to detain an individual for a traffic stop. All police officers know this. Anything beyond that and they're violating your civil rights. But the catch is, and this is extremely important, that you must ask "Am I free to leave?" "Am I free to go?" Those words legally freeze an officer, they must free you and let you go on your way or they must arrest you or they must be within the 15-20 minute window and pursuing an investigation with probable cause. Beyond that and it's an illegal detention.

If your story, as posted here, happened truly as you wrote, you should have been at EPD headquarters the next morning. A one-hour traffic detention is illegal, the search was illegal, pulling you over lying about your tail light was illegal, one piled on top of another.

There are a lot of good officers in the metro, truly a lot, but there are rogue cops who think they can hide behind the internal code of silence and failing that, the FOP, and are literally walking time bombs. This has unfortunately become worse with the influx of Iraq and Afghanistan veterans choosing law enforcement as a career for all the wrong reasons. I'm not talking all I/A vets, but many that seek employment with LEAs are dealing with issues and the need to control, they end up treating citizens the way they were trained to treat hostile forces. Too often they bring a lot of control issues and a need for power and strength and feel that simple patrol is boring. However, some of the best officers come from the same background and do well, but unfortunately it's more often the former.

Supervisors, generally, won't stand for what you went through. Though even some rogues manage to rise through the ranks, but honestly they're rare. Anybody subjected to what you went through for an hour, should ALWAYS let the top brass know. You will almost always find they are glad to hear and learn of these situations and will take it up with the officers involved. A story like yours in isolation doesn't mean much if there's no proof, but when they begin to add up, the superiors know they've got a bad cop. They'll watch them like a hawk. Again, generally and in most cases.

One other thing, and this really goes for everybody, if you have a smartphone, be smart and download a quick "one tap" recording app (audio) and always have it rolling when you're in a police encounter of any kind. There's several now that can upload to your Dropbox account as you record and keep any recordings safe from erasure, confiscation or whatever could happen.

Thanks for your post, interesting!

[soonerguru]

What about the Chesapeake Rent-a-cops? They like following you around in their bigass SUVs.

[positano]

Zoo - one quick point: the OP said he was advised by the officers there was a warrant for his arrest. If they were in fact advised of that and had a good faith belief, they wouldn't need consent to look in the car, nor would the length of his detention been unreasonable. I think he did the right thing - as long as the officers aren't being abusive, I would be polite, keep my mouth shut, and let it all get cleared up. If it went poorly, I would take it up with the chief - not the cop on the street. Once you start debating the law with an officer on the street, there is a good chance they spot you as a complainer and spend the extra effort to be sure their reports describe things in their favor. Your best bet is for the officer to think you are just Joe Blow, handle the stop, and move on to the next.

[MustangGT]

SCOTUS has NEVER set a Bright Line in the sand for the duration of a traffic stop. What they have said is that once the stop is made officer(s) must make all due diligence to confirm or dispel their suspicions as quickly as possible. As far as saying anything beyond 15-20 minutes is an illegal detention is wrong. Once a driver is arrested a routine custodial inventory of the vehicle will take place prior to impound. This is NOT A SEARCH but an inventory that is allowed by law to determine what valuables are in the vehicl and to protect the driver, wrecker company, officer(s). What happens to the vehicle when the driver is arrested is at the sole discretion of the officer(s) depending upon their policies and procedures. The drivers wishes are rarely if ever considered.

Agree with positano on the proper handling of the situation.

[zookeeper]

I have to respectfully disagree with positano and MustangGT.

We all know the departments around here play fast and loose with the constitution, but the answer to that is not to ask and expect the citizens to become sheeple and say they "handled it right" by just allowing this fishing expedition without a single question.

1. I never said to take it up with the cop on the street, unless you call the citizen asking if he's free to go, or not consenting to a search, as doing something wrong. I know most people allow their rights to be trampled on in any encounter with police. Especially, and I'll just say it, in certain departments like MWC/DC (and some others) that have little respect for the rule of law when it comes to the rights of citizens.

2. I never said a search wasn't legal after an arrest. The poster was not under arrest.

3. Yes, the investigation during a traffic stop, into an outstanding warrant or anything else not connected to the traffic stop should be conducted within 20 minutes. I'm not saying it doesn't happen all the time, but it should not go by without the question, "Am I Free To Go??" I understand that a lot of unprofessional officers in unprofessional departments will let a citizen actually knowing their rights, and asserting them, to somehow rile an officer up. That's the officers problem, not the educated citizens.

Saying he handled it right by being a quiet pawn during the encounter that took one hour to resolve is not right. You might think the law offers that kind of inconvenience to a citizen, and be alright with it because around here many don't know what's legal or illegal, right or wrong. You can't possibly believe that the stop, as described by the poster, was handled properly and legally. Again, it sounded like the EPD officers searched the car without consent and before any arrest. They detained him on a false traffic stop in the first place. The fishing expedition took way too long. He stayed quiet on the search and the length of time he was detained, so he "handled it properly." I agree many officers might think like that, but that's what's wrong.

If you're a cop, Mustang, you didn't swear an oath to be comfortable and never be challenged by educated citizens. If you get riled when a citizen knows his rights, you're in the wrong job.

[positano]

I have to respectfully disagree with positano and MustangGT.

We all know the departments around here play fast and loose with the constitution, but the answer to that is not to ask and expect the citizens to become sheeple and say they "handled it right" by just allowing this fishing expedition without a single question.

1. I never said to take it up with the cop on the street, unless you call the citizen asking if he's free to go, or not consenting to a search, as doing something wrong. I know most people allow their rights to be trampled on in any encounter with police. Especially, and I'll just say it, in certain departments like MWC/DC (and some others) that have little respect for the rule of law when it comes to the rights of citizens.

2. I never said a search wasn't legal after an arrest. The poster was not under arrest.

3. Yes, the investigation during a traffic stop, into an outstanding warrant or anything else not connected to the traffic stop should be conducted within 20 minutes. I'm not saying it doesn't happen all the time, but it should not go by without the question, "Am I Free To Go??" I understand that a lot of unprofessional officers in unprofessional departments will let a citizen actually knowing their rights, and asserting them, to somehow rile an officer up. That's the officers problem, not the educated citizens.

Saying he handled it right by being a quiet pawn during the encounter that took one hour to resolve is not right. You might think the law offers that kind of inconvenience to a citizen, and be alright with it because around here many don't know what's legal or illegal, right or wrong. You can't possibly believe that the stop, as described by the poster, was handled properly and legally. Again, it sounded like the EPD officers searched the car without consent and before any arrest. They detained him on a false traffic stop in the first place. The fishing expedition took way too long. He stayed quiet on the search and the length of time he was detained, so he "handled it properly." I agree many officers might think like that, but that's what's wrong.

If you're a cop, Mustang, you didn't swear an oath to be comfortable and never be challenged by educated citizens. If you get riled when a citizen knows his rights, you're in the wrong job.

We'll have to agree to disagree, but i've got twenty years in the courtroom with cases from that exact scenario. And Mustang's analysis was sound (and more eloquent than mine). We can debate the next 3 pages about the difference between an inventory and a search, or custody and arrest, but that's a different thread.

I'm not arguing what is right or wrong - just what's practical. Go ahead and ask a cop as often as you feel like "Am I free to go?". I'll be home sooner.

I'm not at all trying to pick a fight Zoo, or suggest folks need to be complacent in having their rights trampled, I would just recommend picking battles and venues very carefully.