Dear Dallas

[progressiveboy]

Dallas makes sense for a lot of companies. If you are trying to attract and recruit young, educated professionals, Dallas is going to be far more attractive than OKC.

True. Just like Dallas is far more attractive than cities such as Charlotte, Little Rock and Houston.

[progressiveboy]

Another thing that hinders OKC from attracting high paying jobs is that we lack move-in ready Class A office space. Companies like places that they can just move to instead of going through the hassle of buying land and constructing a new building, saves a lot of time and money to move in a office building ready to go.

This is somewhat true, however I just don't believe that OKC "believes in itself to attract these types of jobs". I have stated many times, what makes a city highly successful in attracting great, high paying jobs are the residents and leadership of a city. MAPS has been a start, however I still hear how many OKC residents gripe and complain about MAPS and it's cost. To me, OKC has always been a "cheap" town.

[Steve]

Forget Dallas - pay attention to what can be learned from Kansas City. I'll be writing soon about how Kansas City influenced some of the most beloved design and planning efforts from the first 40 years of OKC history, and how we ended up with boring expansion when we switched to Dallas.

[Mississippi Blues]

True. Just like Dallas is far more attractive than cities such as Charlotte, Little Rock and Houston.

Houston is debatable & Charlotte could be debated also somewhat depending on the person you're talking to. Maybe if you hadn't used the term "far more attractive" then it wouldn't cause me to jump up. I do agree will the idea of Dallas being high on the list of young professionals though.

[Plutonic Panda]

Like I've said, I love Dallas, there are "that" group of people who think they're better than everyone else, but if you think Dallas, or Midland as has been suggested over in the Mystery tower thread, has a lot of them, you probably haven't been to L.A. or Miami. I can see why it wouldn't be high up on urbanist favs list, but I like it. It's a beautiful city and it has an amazing highway and road network, as does most of Texas, and has an increasingly better light-rail system.

Now Steve, please don't hate me for saying this, I'm not the biggest fan of KC. I haven't really explored the city in depth, so I might be wrong to form an opinion about them, from the photos I've seen, it looks like a cool place with some great projects and developments the would be awesome here in OKC. It just doesn't seem like the place I would want to live. It is a nice city though and I hope it does well. I don't see how OKC has modeled itself off of Dallas though. I think Nashville might be a good model too.

[progressiveboy]

Like I've said, I love Dallas, there are "that" group of people who think they're better than everyone else, but if you think Dallas, or Midland as has been suggested over in the Mystery tower thread, has a lot of them, you probably haven't been to L.A. or Miami. I can see why it wouldn't be high up on urbanist favs list, but I like it. It's a beautiful city and it has an amazing highway and road network, as does most of Texas, and has an increasingly better light-rail system.

Now Steve, please don't hate me for saying this, I'm not the biggest fan of KC. I haven't really explored the city in depth, so I might be wrong to form an opinion about them, from the photos I've seen, it looks like a cool place with some great projects and developments the would be awesome here in OKC. It just doesn't seem like the place I would want to live. It is a nice city though and I hope it does well. I don't see how OKC has modeled itself off of Dallas though. I think Nashville might be a good model too.

I have visited Kansas City on several occasions and the weather is just too cold for my liking. Bone chiling winds in the winter. P&L district was fun, however not any more so than BT. Westport was cool and fun. The plaza area and Ward Parkway are nice with decent shopping however, the buck stops there. Would have no desire to live in Kansas City lots of blight. It reminds me of a big "midwest" town not really a city. Just my opinion though.

[G.Walker]

If we need to look at any city to model ourself after, it should be Austin, just saying.

[bluedogok]

I have visited Kansas City on several occasions and the weather is just too cold for my liking. Bone chiling winds in the winter. P&L district was fun, however not any more so than BT. Westport was cool and fun. The plaza area and Ward Parkway are nice with decent shopping however, the buck stops there. Would have no desire to live in Kansas City lots of blight. It reminds me of a big "midwest" town not really a city. Just my opinion though.

Dallas has a lot of blight as well, nothing now to what it was back when I lived there 20 years ago.

What I think Steve is talking about is more of the origins of OKC, remember in the late 1800's to early 1900's Kansas City was the large city in this region. According to the 1900 census St. Louis was #4 (575,238) in population and Kansas City, Missouri was #22 (163,752) and Kansas City, Kansas was #76 (51,418), Dallas was #88 (42,638). KC was a train hub and architecture capital, Dallas was still pretty much a sleepy little town along the Trinity. It really didn't start becoming a major city until the 60's.

Census.gov - Population of the 100 Largest Urban Places: 1900

[Steve]

Blue Dog OKC is on target - reserve judgment on what I said until you read my column on Tuesday and related posts at OKC Central.

[stlokc]

I have spent lots of time in KC, and some time (not as much, admittedly) in Dallas. KC is more to my liking. Obviously, DFW is growing much faster, it's more dynamic economically and is more prosperous. But even people I know that live there don't think it has much of a sense of "place." Everybody in Dallas is from somewhere else, it's so big and sprawling and just so "new," once you get a few minutes from downtown it's just mile after mile after mile that looks exactly like any other suburban city. KC has a lot more charm, more history, more interesting urban fabric.

[G.Walker]

I don't understand why we compare ourselves to Dallas or try to emulate Dallas. Dallas is close to having 7 million people in there metro area, to our 1.3 million, there is no comparison, Dallas is in a league of their own. OKC will never get that big, not even in the next 100 years.

[G.Walker]

I've said it before and I'll it again, what I have been tracking for Austin is unbelievable. We need to be looking at Austin, that is more realistic! #EmbraceAustin

[bchris02]

I've said it before and I'll it again, what I have been tracking for Austin is unbelievable. We need to be looking at Austin, that is more realistic! #EmbraceAustin

I would say Charlotte, Nashville, or Indianapolis are more realistic. OKC shouldn't try to emulate Austin. It will never be able to have the kind of 'cool' factor Austin has with the hipster demographic simply because like it or not our metro area is too conservative. Many people who move to Austin do it for the liberalism.

[catch22]

#HashtagOverload #ThisIsNotTwitterOrIG

[kevinpate]

... #EmbraceAustin.

Hugs Austin ... there, there, Austin. It's true OKC metro landed the GE Global Research folk and you did not, but hey, you still have your cool bars.

All better now? Good.

[mburlison]

I spent about 40 years in OKC and still consider it "Hometown" and proud of that. Living now in Plano/Mckinney area and we really love it. In the past 6 years, have only gone down to "Dallas" a handful of times. McKinney, Frisco, Allen & Plano areas are plenty busy - but retain some sense of a 'community' feel to them. I'm lucky in that I work in McKinney - so no long commute - otherwise I'm sure I'd think a little different - but so far the place is a nice place to be.

[progressiveboy]

I spent about 40 years in OKC and still consider it "Hometown" and proud of that. Living now in Plano/Mckinney area and we really love it. In the past 6 years, have only gone down to "Dallas" a handful of times. McKinney, Frisco, Allen & Plano areas are plenty busy - but retain some sense of a 'community' feel to them. I'm lucky in that I work in McKinney - so no long commute - otherwise I'm sure I'd think a little different - but so far the place is a nice place to be.

I am originally from OKC and now live in the Plano/Frisco area off of 121 & Preston. I am glad to see OKC finally gain momentum with their growth! The one thing I have to say though is DFW has far superior roads, much more cleaner and overall nicer development area. OKC, until just in the last 10 years never took pride in their appearance. Perception and appearance are very important in how a city looks.

[bchris02]

I am originally from OKC and now live in the Plano/Frisco area off of 121 & Preston. I am glad to see OKC finally gain momentum with their growth! The one thing I have to say though is DFW has far superior roads, much more cleaner and overall nicer development area. OKC, until just in the last 10 years never took pride in their appearance. Perception and appearance are very important in how a city looks.

Agree with this.

For me, one of the most difficult things to adjust to about OKC moving from Charlotte has been the overall ugly appearance of much of the city. It's been discussed in numerous threads, but you can't blame the natural landscape of OKC for the ugliness. DFW has the same landscape and is far more aesthetically appealing. Even Edmond has gotten it right.

Underneath the ugliness however is an up and coming city that, providing the oil and gas economy doesn't collapse, will be a Charlotte, Nashville, or Indianapolis within 10-15 years.

[Plutonic Panda]

I am originally from OKC and now live in the Plano/Frisco area off of 121 & Preston. I am glad to see OKC finally gain momentum with their growth! The one thing I have to say though is DFW has far superior roads, much more cleaner and overall nicer development area. OKC, until just in the last 10 years never took pride in their appearance. Perception and appearance are very important in how a city looks.

You're not kidding about the roads. That is one thing I wish OKC would do is fix our roads and widen a few of them. I love the 6 lane roads they have in Dallas they flow so smooth for the amount of traffic they carry. Here in OKC it goes from 6 lanes to 4 lane bottle neck even on the highways as well. Dallas has an AMAZING highway network too.

[bchris02]

You're not kidding about the roads. That is one thing I wish OKC would do is fix our roads and widen a few of them. I love the 6 lane roads they have in Dallas they flow so smooth for the amount of traffic they carry. Here in OKC it goes from 6 lanes to 4 lane bottle neck even on the highways as well. Dallas has an AMAZING highway network too.

I would like to see more roads with landscaped medians in OKC. The only road I know of in OKC proper that has attempted it is Classen. NW Expressway already has a median. I would love to see it beautified.

[Just the facts]

If we need to look at any city to model ourself after, it should be Austin, just saying.

If OKC needs a city to model itself after it is OKC circa 1940. We need look nowhere else except our own history.

[Mississippi Blues]

I would like to see more roads with landscaped medians in OKC. The only road I know of in OKC proper that has attempted it is Classen. NW Expressway already has a median. I would love to see it beautified.

Yes! I have no idea why we don't have landscaped / better landscaped medians.

[Bunty]

Yes! I have no idea why we don't have landscaped / better landscaped medians.

Probably it's regarded as an unneeded expense that would rob too much from trying to keep streets in repair. If we have started having intense heat and droughts every summer, much of the landscaping would just die off, if watering is restricted.

[Mississippi Blues]

Probably it's regarded as an unneeded expense that would rob too much from trying to keep streets in repair. If we have started having intense heat and droughts every summer, much of the landscaping would just die off, if watering is restricted.

Fair enough.

[Plutonic Panda]

I would like to see more roads with landscaped medians in OKC. The only road I know of in OKC proper that has attempted it is Classen. NW Expressway already has a median. I would love to see it beautified.

Yes, that would be very nice, also if they would landscape our highways similar to the George Bush turnpike. . . Dallas really knows how to make their highways nice.