Bedlam 2012

[SoonerDave]

Very interesting discussion here...

Having been at the game, I'll toss in a few thoughts.

* OU needs D-Linemen. Desperately. This is easily the weakest defensive front in Stoops' tenure. I don't think most folks realize how much of the rest of the defense hinges on the play of the d-line. It isn't about dominating every play, it's about winning the few critical battles on the few plays that often decide close games between good teams. Right now, OU's defensive line cannot get off blocks, cannot create pressure, cannot penetrate.

* OSU has a really nice offensive system in place. They can churn guys through, and are very close to creating a system where a variety of different athletes can be successful at their QB position. That's how you build a program.

* I can't fathom why OSU didn't blitz more, especially late, unless Bill Young sensed that his defense was getting tired and thought the better strategy was to rush three and stay in coverage most of the time to limit the fatigue factor. That last OU drive - all but 4 seconds of the last, what, 6:18, had to be crushing.

* I think most of the stadium had the sense that OU was going to win that game once OSU had been held to an FG on their OT possession. I think OSU was playing mentally and emotionally "all in" on that last long drive, and when Bell scored, the whole feeling in the stadium changed. Millard nearly scored on the first play from scrimmage, and unless I'm mistaken, they ran Clay through the same hole on the next play where he scored. And the arm tackles on that play alone belie the fact that OSU was, defensively, spent.

* Yeah, Landry threw a horrible pick on that one drive. But if he's not the QB, OSU wins that game. Bell is a horse, but from what I've seen, he's got a cannon of an arm with very little touch right now. How they adjust the offense going into next season will be very, very interesting. OU has a bevy of receivers going into next year, so they can't afford to turn into a run-first team entirely. Fans dissing Jones will be missing his accuracy and, as evidenced the last two weeks, his calm late-game demeanor next season. Without it, OU loses the last two games IMHO. I mean, good grief, the guy drives the team the length of the field in back to back weeks to game-tying/winning TD's...not sure what more you can ask. And I still contend that Bell is not the "heir-apparent" to Jones if they continue to run this offense. Its one thing to come in 3rd and 1 and bulldoze to a first down; it's another to throw an opposite-hash strike to a breaking receiver. We don't know if Bell can do that with the kind of regularity this offense demands.

* Josh Heupel has to get out of his own way when calling the offense. He clearly outthought himself in bringing in the Belldozer twice at inappropriate times when the OU offense was in rhythm, and both times it failed - once on a no-gain pitch sweep, the other on a lost fumble. It's all about rhythm and tempo, and IMHO those were killers. The Dozer is a great tool, used properly (see game-tying touchdown), but abused (see first-and-ten at the OSU 15), it makes you look silly.

* OSU will return something like 17 starters next year from a team that legitimately should have beaten Texas and came within a hair's breadth of beating OU in Norman, so the idea that they could win the conference next year isn't stupid or dense at at all. West Virginia loses a ton this season, OU loses their 2.5-year starting QB, Texas is a mess, and with Tuberville all-but campaigning for the Arkansas job, I don't see Tech challenging next year. KSU will be good again even without Klein at QB just because they're so dad-gum sound fundamentally under Snyder. The point is there isn't a dominant team returning next season, so picking OSU with that much experience returning isn't insane.

Bad, good, or indifferent, the Sooners won; it was no defensive gem, but it was good enough! Now we just need to keep up the momentum and thump TCU to keep Stoops' even-numbered conference title streak alive.

[Spartan]

wow .. you don't know much about football do you

Only played it up until my last year in high school and know enough to keep a discussion on football without resorting to ad hominem attacks. I think you were responding to a post about Bell, so do you care to offer any rationale for why Bell is going to be the Heisman winner next year? :/

(Yes, I quoted this guy's entire post)

This is the first bedlam game I can remember where the best team didn't win and the loser wasn't the gooners. The pokes stock is definitely rising.

What are you talking about? OU is clearly the better team this year, not only is the record better, but the only two losses are two #1 teams. OSU got shellacked at unranked Arizona. In all four of OSU's losses this year <shocker alert> the defense was doing its best West Virginia impersonation. This is a consistent problem with OSU's rise, is that the offense is consistently the best you'll ever find, but good lord that defense isn't worth crap.

I'm giving you guy's high expectations for next year. But this year, the better team did win, as it always does.

[dankrutka]

Good points, SoonerDave. I'll add on that its not just OU's d-line that is awful, but the entire front 7. The LBers are equally bad. They put so much pressure on the secondary because they get no pressure.

As far as Bell goes, did you follow him the spring or watch the Red-White game? Bell was a very good passer in HS and looked very good throwing the ball in the spring. They should change the O some, but it's not like he'll be a run-first QB. You never fully know until he actually takes over the O, but I'm not overly worried about Bell's ability to throw. He won't be Landry, but hopefully his ability to run some can offset that. I'd like to see an O like what K-State runs with Klein.

[SoonerDave]

heya Kilgore...

This is clearly not a vintage LB group, although I think Simmons has helped a great deal to atone as it were for some of Wort's sins. I've lost track of how many times Wort has just flat been out of position. I remember against WVU there was one TD run where he literally jumped out of his assignment gap for no reason, and the PBP/color guy called him out during the replay. "Why is Tom Wort jumping out of his gap?"

I personally think Simmons is more the body type Stoops wants at LB rather than Venables. Venables snagged the Ryan Reynolds style, a bit smaller, perhaps laterally quicker, but not quite as physically imposing. Stoops likes the Torrance Marshall type, which is also the style most SEC defenses snag, bigger upper body, attacker, etc. Give Mike a couple more years and I think you'll see that change happen. No offense to Wort, he plays hard and with great heart, but in honesty I don't think he gets an offer to OU if M. Stoops is still the DC.

I just don't see OU shifting to a K-State style offense, not with the kind of depth at WR we're developing. Also, we don't have a "body" at TE to run what KSU does. I think something was afoot in the offense earlier this year when they (temporarily) moved Grissom to TE, but then moved him back. My trick knee tells me they wanted to try and add back to the playbook a few of those sets with a TE flexes out, ala Jermaine Gresham, because it just gives defenses headaches, but they couldn't find one with the reliable hands for it. Think they're hoping Tyler McNamara can do that in the next couple of years.

Have only seen Blake Bell in a few situations, and I did not attend the spring game. Just going by observations, and at the moment it just seems to me he's all arm. Hope he can refine that for the kinds of throws he'll need to make if he is, in fact, "the guy" going into next year.

The absolute crime for me as a Sooner fan this year is that even two above average DL types, along with a more consistent LB, could have made all the difference in the world in the two losses OU had this year, which is turning out to be the difference between looking at a conference share versus a national title shot. No team this year is dominant. Of course, similar things could be said of many teams (just need this player or that player). But I've felt for a long time that OU's defensive interior was deteriorating gradually over the last few seasons, going back two or three years. The number and quantity of the Dvoracek's, Harrises, Lofton's, Lehman's, and Calmuses used to be a nearly self-perpetuating chain...until you just stopped hearing about them. Then the OU defense became more or less anonymous.

Granted, you can't just will those players into your program, and apparently Saban at 'Bama is scooping up as many as he can every year, but somewhere you've got to try and get those kinds of game-changers back into play. This kind of defense at OU just isn't going to get the job done, and the sad part is that it casts a negative light on what I think is actually a pretty decent secondary (esp. Colvin at corner and Jefferson/Harris at safeties).

[OKCisOK4me]

Guess people don't realize that the first land grab was in Stillwater......

Guess people don't realize this:

On April 22, 1889, the Unassigned Lands of the Oklahoma Territory were opened for homesteading with the first Land Run. By the end of the day, 240 acres (0.97 km2) had been claimed and designated as Stillwater township and a tent city with a population numbering 300 had sprung up on the prairie.

This county was established and named as the Sixth County by the Oklahoma Organic Act of 1890. It included land settled during the Land Run of 1889. The Organic Act settled a dispute between the towns of Stillwater and Payne over which should be the county seat.

OSU was founded in 1890 under the Morrill Act.

So technically, dirt burglars aka sooners existed before Stillwater and Oklahoma A&M were even in existence. Nice try though.

[ou48A]

Its so nice to be living in the Sooner state

[Stew]

Its so nice to be living in the Sooner state

Sooner born and sooner bred and when I die I'll be just another gooner who's never stepped foot on gooner campus.

[ou48A]

Good points, SoonerDave. I'll add on that its not just OU's d-line that is awful, but the entire front 7. The LBers are equally bad. They put so much pressure on the secondary because they get no pressure.

As far as Bell goes, did you follow him the spring or watch the Red-White game? Bell was a very good passer in HS and looked very good throwing the ball in the spring. They should change the O some, but it's not like he'll be a run-first QB. You never fully know until he actually takes over the O, but I'm not overly worried about Bell's ability to throw. He won't be Landry, but hopefully his ability to run some can offset that. I'd like to see an O like what K-State runs with Klein.

I would agree with your assessment but OU won’t need to lean on Bells feet like KSU does with Klein.
Bell is a pretty good passer but he still needs to have the game slow down.

Bell will have a very good group of receivers to work with and a better OL.

[ou48A]

Sooner born and sooner bred and when I die I'll be just another gooner who's never stepped foot on gooner campus.

It’s so sad that you don’t know what the good life is all about.

[OKCisOK4me]

Hey, 48, ya gotta see the sarcasm. Nm...

[dankrutka]

SoonerDave, I'll assume you're referncing Frank Shannon. He's done alright, but still not much of an improvement over Wort and Nelson.

It would be a huge waste to NOT run the ball with Bell next year. Dual threat QBs put a ton of pressure on defenses. I'll be very disappointed if Bell is just used as a pocket passer. You have to also remember that this might be the beginning of a big change for OU offensively. All the up and coming QBs are dual threat - Bell, Thompson, and Knight. If OU changes it's offense it will be for more than just Bell.

[SoonerDave]

SoonerDave, I'll assume you're referncing Frank Shannon. He's done alright, but still not much of an improvement over Wort and Nelson.

Arrgh, yes, I meant Shannon, been calling him Simmons all season. Blast. I think *SHANNON* has been better, esp. in passing situations, than Wort. Agree, however, that this is hardly a marquee LB corps.

It would be a huge waste to NOT run the ball with Bell next year. Dual threat QBs put a ton of pressure on defenses. I'll be very disappointed if Bell is just used as a pocket passer. You have to also remember that this might be the beginning of a big change for OU offensively. All the up and coming QBs are dual threat - Bell, Thompson, and Knight. If OU changes it's offense it will be for more than just Bell.

I understand where you're coming from, and agree that we've got dual threat guys in the wings, but we've also got one of the deepest WR corps ever, and I don't see the offense changing *that* drastically where those guys suddenly aren't used or are used significantly less. I'd love to see something in the vein of the '08 offense with a QB run threat on the edge mixed in, but that obviously requires all the attendant talent.

Have to believe we're going to hit the JUCO ranks hard to get some immediate DL help. Way it stands right now, OU may be worse off talent-wise along the DL next year than this year, and that has to be a concern.

[OSUMom]

Guess people don't realize this:

On April 22, 1889, the Unassigned Lands of the Oklahoma Territory were opened for homesteading with the first Land Run. By the end of the day, 240 acres (0.97 km2) had been claimed and designated as Stillwater township and a tent city with a population numbering 300 had sprung up on the prairie.

This county was established and named as the Sixth County by the Oklahoma Organic Act of 1890. It included land settled during the Land Run of 1889. The Organic Act settled a dispute between the towns of Stillwater and Payne over which should be the county seat.

OSU was founded in 1890 under the Morrill Act.

So technically, dirt burglars aka sooners existed before Stillwater and Oklahoma A&M were even in existence. Nice try though.

I thought he was referring to what the term 'sooner' meant in the land runs. Not the land runs themselves. Could be wrong though.

[Martin]

So technically, dirt burglars aka sooners existed before Stillwater and Oklahoma A&M were even in existence. Nice try though.

hmmm... isn't a 'dirt burglar' anybody who tried to settle the unassigned lands before they were opened for settlement? now... i can't seem to remember... what was the name of the 'dirt burglar' who got this whole settlement of oklahoma thing started? i seem to remember some crazy old coot who got himself escorted out of the region a couple times by the military... i wonder if he ended up with a county named after him or or something. -M

[CuatrodeMayo]

Guess people don't realize that the first land grab was in Stillwater......

I think he is referring to the Boomers ( Boomers (Oklahoma settlers) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ) led by their leader David Payne ( David L. Payne - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ) for whom the county is named after.

[OSUMom]

I think he is referring to the Boomers ( Boomers (Oklahoma settlers) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ) led by their leader David Payne ( David L. Payne - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ) for whom the county is named after.

Boomers - the people that lobbied to have the lands opened up for settlement.
Sooners - the people that snuck into the land run area early and staked out claims ahead of time.

Since thieving was mentioned I thought he was referring to the latter.

[dankrutka]

I understand where you're coming from, and agree that we've got dual threat guys in the wings, but we've also got one of the deepest WR corps ever, and I don't see the offense changing *that* drastically where those guys suddenly aren't used or are used significantly less.

Is it really a drastic change? Bell runs the ball 3-6 times a game right now. I'm talking about upping that number to around 10. You can still pass it 40 times and run it some also.

[ou48A]

We have seen what other teams have done to OU this year with the QB run game.
All Bell or the others need is to keep the defense honest with their feet. 5 to 10 designed or QB scramble plays a game is about all it would take in most games.

OU is loaded with young QB prospects.
I am far more concerned about developing a better defensive front.

[Bellaboo]

hmmm... isn't a 'dirt burglar' anybody who tried to settle the unassigned lands before they were opened for settlement? now... i can't seem to remember... what was the name of the 'dirt burglar' who got this whole settlement of oklahoma thing started? i seem to remember some crazy old coot who got himself escorted out of the region a couple times by the military... i wonder if he ended up with a county named after him or or something. -M

Yes, such as 'Payne' County, 10 years before any such land run in 1889 for the unassigned lands ........in the Stillwater area.

Boomers , 10 years prior to Sooners.

[Bellaboo]

I think he is referring to the Boomers ( Boomers (Oklahoma settlers) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ) led by their leader David Payne ( David L. Payne - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ) for whom the county is named after.

OKCisOK4me........you need to read up on the 'Boomer' dirt burglars you've been referring to...nice try though.

BTW, ever heard of Boomer Lake ?

[SoonerDave]

We have seen what other teams have done to OU this year with the QB run game.
All Bell or the others need is to keep the defense honest with their feet. 5 to 10 designed or QB scramble plays a game is about all it would take in most games.

OU is loaded with young QB prospects.
I am far more concerned about developing a better defensive front.

This. I don't know how many Sooner fans are aware of the fact that OU may well be less talented along the defensive front next season than this season. A defense that can take some of that "score every possession" pressure on the offense would surely help everyone.

[Bellaboo]

This. I don't know how many Sooner fans are aware of the fact that OU may well be less talented along the defensive front next season than this season. A defense that can take some of that "score every possession" pressure on the offense would surely help everyone.

Sounds like they need to go raid the JC ranks.

[ou48A]

Sounds like they need to go raid the JC ranks.

OU is hitting the JC ranks hard for DT’s
OU will probably sign one of the nation’s top high school DT prospects who some say should play well from day one? We will see?
In addition there are a couple of young players already on campus who should benefit a great deal by another off season of strength and conditioning.

[ou48A]

For OU the majority of the remaining 2013 scholarships need to be linemen.

Thus far, OU has (6) commitments from every in state player they have offered in the 2013 class.
The in state recruiting crop for 2014 is said to be extremely good. OU should get most of these in state players.