New Central Park for Moore

[HangryHippo]

Yes, by all means, don't pay for a park. Parks are horrible things.

I do not understand all the whining about a 1/4 cent sales tax.

[jedicurt]

While quietly, 90% of the citizens of Moore who never set foot in the Park get to pay for it.

If those citizens choose not to go to the new park, isn't that kinda of their fault? or is there restrictions as to who can use the park that were not made publicly available? If you choose not to use the services and amenities that your tax dollars pay for, how is that anyones fault but your own?

[sharpshooter]

To flintysooner: victimized and powerless? C'mon, don't put words in my mouth and I wont put words in yours. Re-read my post. I praised City leaders for the improvements they've made in the past. A citizen of Moore can disagree with decisions made by the City Council without being branded anti-Moore. I like this community; that's why I choose to live here. I live in Ward 3 and have known my city councilman for many years. (I've bought insurance from him for more than 20 years) And yes......he's a very approachable and likeable person. But that doesn't mean I can't disagree with him with him on occasion.

To onlyone: Again.... re-read my post. I'm not anti-park. I am opposed to raising taxes in one of the worst economic environments in decades. If you think it's just a ¼-cent sales tax increase, you are mis-informed. Re-read the proposals.

To jedicurt: Parks are not critical City services. Police. Fire. Ambulance. Water. Sewer. Roads. These are critical City services and may be worth an increase in taxes if necessary.

You all seem like reasonable people. Someone here can have an opposing view without being branded a "victim" or "powerless". I like parks but, as a non-critical City service, they shouldn't be funded by a tax increase; at least not in the current economic environment.

As my friends and neighbors, I hope you all have a good day.

[soonermike]

Well said sharpshooter. I was in favor of both proposals and voted accordingly, but I think you expressed your opinion against the proposals in a well stated manner without being overly negative. Much better than some of the people who don't live in Moore (or even Oklahoma) and have no skin in the game just coming on here and bashing Moore consistently.

[rcjunkie]

As a citizen of Moore for more than 25 years, I've seen the improvements the City has made to infrastructure, emergency services, and beautification; all are worthy expenditures . Seems like I've watched this City "grow up" since I've been here. Having said that, I didn't support the two propositions for park improvements and the addition of the new central park. It amazes me that something like this would pass in this current economic environment. Can't the City do something like this over a longer period of time without raising taxes? Make it a 10-year project with several phases and pay as you go? Anyway..... it's a done deal now. But..... everyone reading this needs to know that the "temporary" ¼-cent sales tax will never end. Yes.... it will require anoter vote of the good citizens of Moore to extend it; at that time the City leaders will have another "worthy" project to fund. The City, with it's ability for mass mailings to all citizens, will convince the majority of you to vote for the extension. Those opposed wont have a chance. Well....ya can't fight City Hall.

So.... soon we'll have some Park improvements and a new Central Park. There'll be a big ceremony when it's finished and all the City leaders will get their names put on a big plaque mounted on one of the new buildings at Central Park, touting their vision for our community. While quietly, 90% of the citizens of Moore who never set foot in the Park get to pay for it.

If this is indeed true, why didn't the so quoted 90% get out and vote no

[flintysooner]

To flintysooner: victimized and powerless? C'mon, don't put words in my mouth and I wont put words in yours. Re-read my post. I praised City leaders for the improvements they've made in the past. A citizen of Moore can disagree with decisions made by the City Council without being branded anti-Moore.

But it wasn't the City Council that made the decision. There were meetings upon meetings and surveys and the larger parks plan arose from that input. Finally the plans as well as their funding were put on the ballot. And citizens again voted favorably on those same measures.

You make it sound in your original post that this was something that originated at the Council and was forced upon the citizens.

It just doesn't seem to have happened that way to me.

I have no disagreement with those who felt either projects were wrong or who disagreed with the funding mechanisms. I certainly meant no disrespect to you or your position regarding the merits.

It just seemed to me that you were blaming the City leaders.

I try not to get involved in such disputes though so please accept my apology for misrepresenting your feelings.

[Just the facts]

I would be willing to agree that 90% of Moore residents will go to this park less than 1 time per year (statistically equal to 'never use it'). But just because you don't plan to use it is not a reason to vote against it.

[jedicurt]

To jedicurt: Parks are not critical City services. Police. Fire. Ambulance. Water. Sewer. Roads. These are critical City services and may be worth an increase in taxes if necessary.

I also would like to know more about your position on parks being non-critical.

And hope i didn't come off as just being argumentative. I used to not use the parks in norman or the bus service or anything else until just recently. and the conclusion that led me to start was the idea of "Well i'm paying for it, might as well use it"

[sharpshooter]

I find your position that parks are non-critical interesting. Would love to hear more about that position.

I assume you would consider public safety critical? Anything else?

As I stated in an earlier post: Parks are not critical City services. Police. Fire. Ambulance. Water. Sewer. Roads. These are critical City services. I use the term "critical" because I believe these are "City provided" services that we all must have. Possibly could have added trash service and civil defense sirens to the list. Try and imagine doing without any of these services. Parks are a nice thing to have but not critical; they are optional. Parks improve the quality of life in Moore just like a good library. But critical? No.

To rcjunkie: The 90% figure I came up with was just a guess of course. BTW = 36% (prop 1) and 42% (prop 2) of the voters did vote NO on Tuesday's propositions respectively. Another guess on my part is I blame part of these results on an ill-informed electorate. Ask yourself this: If a represenative from the City Of Moore came to you a year ago and said we want to make some park improvements and build a new park and showed you the plans and then said I'll need a check from you for $1000. Would that make any difference on your decision to support the proposals? Maybe it wouldn't make any difference and that's fine if you believe they are worth that to you. The $1000 is a conservative estimate on what it will cost me over the next five years. The proposals are presented to the public with a spoon full of sugar; it helps the medicine go down.

To flintysooner: Apology accepted but not necessary. We're just neighbors discussing current events across the table at a coffee shop. Again, I like the ideas in the proposals. I do think they could be done incrementally over a longer period of time without raising taxes.

[flintysooner]

Yessir and one of the things I love about Moore is that most all of us really do think of ourselves as neighbors. Whether we agree or not.

[Easy180]

A lot of commotion over an extra 10 bucks a month

[Spartan]

As I stated in an earlier post: Parks are not critical City services. Police. Fire. Ambulance. Water. Sewer. Roads. These are critical City services. I use the term "critical" because I believe these are "City provided" services that we all must have. Possibly could have added trash service and civil defense sirens to the list. Try and imagine doing without any of these services. Parks are a nice thing to have but not critical; they are optional. Parks improve the quality of life in Moore just like a good library. But critical? No.

So trash service and sirens are also optional maybe kinda sorta?? Gee okay. Remind me what Moore is best known for (I graduated WHS 'Class of 2008 so I can say that)

The point is that you're right, those are your basic services. They are essential, but won't create a place people actually want to live. Nobody moves to Edmond because they have really nice sewage and fire trucks, but rather because Edmond is an attractive city with excellent amenities, a great downtown area, and beautiful neighborhoods.

Moore is swimming in more cash than any other Oklahoma city and can afford to create a place where people want to live, but it chooses not to. That is sad. That is also why the rest of the metro has and always will kind of look down on Moore as the white trash "Home of Toby Keith."

[Just the facts]

Loud and proud baby.

[Jesseda]

Loud and proud baby.

wish they could put HOME OF JESSE JANE on that tower maybe we would get more Looks

[sharpshooter]

Toby sends someone to Moore to pick up his Steak Sandwich's from Del Rancho. For that he gets his name on a water tank. Cool.

[rcjunkie]

Toby sends someone to Moore to pick up his Steak Sandwich's from Del Rancho. For that he gets his name on a water tank. Cool.

It's because he lived there for several years and graduated from Moore High. He now lives in Norman, which by the way has a Del Rancho ( not the anyone would admit to eating at Del Rancho).

[catch22]

what's wrong with Del Rancho?

[HangryHippo]

what's wrong with Del Rancho?

Not a thing. I love the steak sandwich supreme!

[Roger S]

... which by the way has a Del Rancho ( not the anyone would admit to eating at Del Rancho).

I'll have to prove you wrong. I admit that I eat at Del Rancho. Not very often but I do eat there.

[CaptDave]

( not the anyone would admit to eating at Del Rancho).

Hey!! Del Rancho is an occasional guilty pleasure. What's wrong with a steak sandwich supreme every couple of months??

[Roger S]

Hey!! Del Rancho is an occasional guilty pleasure. What's wrong with a steak sandwich supreme every couple of months??

Exactly! And add cheese on mine as long as I'm splurging.

[RadicalModerate]

Maybe everyone could be pacified if they put a smiley face with one of those scrunched-up, black "cowboy" hats under the text. (p.s. i like toby keith's music. his namesake restaurants? . . . meh. del rancho is better. IMHO.)

[rcjunkie]

Hey!! Del Rancho is an occasional guilty pleasure. What's wrong with a steak sandwich supreme every couple of months??

Nothing if your ok with a little meat with your breading.

[Roger S]

Nothing if your ok with a little meat with your breading.

You must be living wrong... The ones I get from the Moore location have a good breading to meat ratio.

[sharpshooter]

It's because he lived there for several years and graduated from Moore High. He now lives in Norman, which by the way has a Del Rancho ( not the anyone would admit to eating at Del Rancho).

Yep. He sure did live here at one time; no doubt about that. And yes..... he graduated from Moore High School. But so have thousands of others. I know he lives in Norman. I've rode my motorcycle by his house on many occasions while heading to Lake Dirtybird. I guess the point I'm trying to make is this: Has he done anything for Moore since making it to the big leagues? Maybe he has and I don't know about it. Maybe someone can set me straight on that. Has he done anything to make Moore a better place since leaving? Donated any time or put forth any effort to benefit his so-called hometown? Maybe he's mentioned Moore in one of his songs or maybe he speaks about Moore in a way that sheds some positive light on our community?

I mentioned Del Rancho in my earlier post because I read an article in a magazine a few years ago and the only mention Toby makes of Moore is about getting his steak sandwiches from the Moore Del Rancho. It's absurd that the City wants to put his name on one of our water tanks IMO. But then, I think Jesseda already made that point when she mentioned putting Jesse Jane's name on one of our water towers.

I've got nothing against Mr. Toby Covel. Just don't think he warrants getting his name on one of our water tanks.