Should restaurants have separate sections for people with small children?

[Moondog]

Would you prefer to dine without the sounds of a crying baby or the screams of a 4-year-old ? How would you like to sit in a booth at a restaurant without having to worry about someone's precious little 2-year-old crawling over from the other booth and putting his finger in your ear? (This really happened to us last week.)

As for me, I'm getting sick and tired of going out, spending good money on a nice meal and having to put up with these people and their ill-behaved children and crying babies. On many occasions, I've had to ask the waitstaff to relocate my party and I because the noise was so bad. And when the waiter or waitress has to move someone, it usually means they have to give up their table to another waiter and miss out on a tip, and that's not right.

It's not that I'm anti-children -- I'm not. But if I'm spending my hard earned money on a night out in a restaurant, I shouldn't have to put up with unruly little kids and their do-nothing parents. Not only am I paying for food and service, I'm paying for the atmosphere -- I'm paying for the experience of being someplace else.

The parents of the little kid that crawled over the booth did nothing but tell him to stop. Luckily, they left a minute later. If I'd have done that when I was a kid, I would have gotten a good butt-chewing and maybe a small spanking. But I guess parents don't do the discipline thing anymore.

Anyway, I would love it if restaurants had Children and Non-Children sections. I understand parents need to eat out too and they can't always leave the kids with grandma or the sitter. But it would be nice if they had their own section. Does anyone think this is a good idea?

[Survey]

This is a free country and those people shouldn't be discriminated against because they have children. Sitting them in a different section would be very reminiscent of sitting blacks in a different area than whites. I don't think your proposal would be good.

[quailcreekgal]

I sometimes ask to seated away from children who are loud or not seated in a chair and don't mind waiting for a table if necessary.

[Moondog]

This is more akin to smoking and non-smoking sections. For instance, if I want to smoke, I sit where the other smokers sit, as not to bother the other patrons who don't smoke. And vice versa: If I don't want to smell smoke, I go where the non-smokers are, so that I wont complain about the smokers. So, this is the same: If I don't want to put up with crying babies, I go where the others like me go -- to the non-children section.

We're not talking about race here. Your comparing this to racial segregation is pretty over the top.

[Stinger]

Most nice restaurants have just the thing....

[MadMonk]

I think its a rediculous idea. Being around unruly kids (or adults!) in a restaraunt is just a fact of public life. I've been on both sides of this situation and believe me its no fun for either one. My kids weren't really bad, but I didn't want to put up with the inevitable crying and disruption of dining out with with the kids until they became more "settled" and can better understand why its important to be quiet and to behave themselves (about 3yrs old). You ever try to control a cranky two-year old?

That said, I think that parents should be considerate of others and do their best to keep the little ones under control and be the best judge of whether or not the kids can handle behaving correctly in public and act accordingly. Cranky adults should do the same, but that doesn't always happen. Banning either of them to certain areas of the restaraunt is silly though.

[GrandMaMa]

Most nice restaurants have just the thing....

Just because you don't want to be aggravated by unruly rug rats, yes that's what they are if they can't behave, it doesn't mean you wish to be aggravated by an obnoxious drunk either..besides, smoking is usually tolerated in the bar section and it would be a close race whether I would choose a drunk, a smoker or an unruly rug rat. [I do hope that I offened someone with that description] It's too darn bad that parents cannot be aware of how their children are affecting others, maybe there should be a special "URR" section in the nicer establishments.

[metro]

Some good points discussed. I know it frustrates me on many occassions to local restaurants. I agree, I think the comparison to racial descrimination was a little over the top, it is more akin to the smoking/non-smoking issue, although you could still smell the smoke in the non-smoking sections when they had those! But that is another story.

Although I don't have children, I agree it's easier said than done to get a 2 year old to behave.

On one side of the issue you have parents who discipline the best they can. On the other, you have parents who don't discipline or do it "the wrong way" or flat out just don't care. Obviously you can't separate different types of these parents and kids. I do think it would be wise for restaurants to try and sit as many people with small children in a certain part of a restaurant, and/or be able to warn patrons whose children are being too loud, etc. that other patrons have complained about to the restaurant staff. It's no different than church or a movie theater. If a child gets to a certain point, an usher will probably warn them or have them ushered outside or elsewhere, so they won't disrupt the rest.

[GrandMaMa]

Some good points discussed. I know it frustrates me on many occassions to local restaurants. I agree, I think the comparison to racial descrimination was a little over the top, it is more akin to the smoking/non-smoking issue, although you could still smell the smoke in the non-smoking sections when they had those! But that is another story.

Although I don't have children, I agree it's easier said than done to get a 2 year old to behave.

On one side of the issue you have parents who discipline the best they can. On the other, you have parents who don't discipline or do it "the wrong way" or flat out just don't care. Obviously you can't separate different types of these parents and kids. I do think it would be wise for restaurants to try and sit as many people with small children in a certain part of a restaurant, and/or be able to warn patrons whose children are being too loud, etc. that other patrons have complained about to the restaurant staff. It's no different than church or a movie theater. If a child gets to a certain point, an usher will probably warn them or have them ushered outside or elsewhere, so they won't disrupt the rest.

I, on the other hand, can speak with authority, as I have raised four sons and know the challenges that it entails. If a parent has one ounce of concern for others, they will NOT let their children intrude into others' comfort or space. You have no idea of how many times we asked for to go boxes when our boys were not getting the message that they either needed to act civilized or they will cease to enjoy the benefits that others do that choose to act appropriately. Yes, and double yes, you CAN discipline your children ANYWHERE YOU ARE, whether it be in a grocery store, a restaurant or church. I didn't say scream at them, or hit them or pinch them..(yes, we've all seen that done, it's a nice, quiet punishment which accomplishes nothing). You simpley lay down the rules (if the child is too young to understand, get a baby sitter) and if they break the rules, you leave, with or without your food. You can't threaten a child and then not follow through, they will never respect you, and why should they? You have to follow through with your word, or none of it works. Is any of this making sense to anyone? This type of discipline follows through and encourges SELF DISCLIPLINE which is what is lacking in young people today. Beating it into them doesn't work. Threatening and not following through, doesn't work. Quietly laying down the rules and following through DOES WORK! No one should have to put up with an unruly child nor more than they should have to put up with an unruly drunk or someone that is blowing smoke over your table as you attempt to enjoy the fruits of your labor. We need to stop making excuses and exceptions for those who don't respect the rights of others. I say, "TO GO BOXES" for all of the jerks, no matter what their age and they can smoke their ciggs on the way out the door.

[GrandMaMa]

I think its a rediculous idea. Being around unruly kids (or adults!) in a restaraunt is just a fact of public life. I've been on both sides of this situation and believe me its no fun for either one. My kids weren't really bad, but I didn't want to put up with the inevitable crying and disruption of dining out with with the kids until they became more "settled" and can better understand why its important to be quiet and to behave themselves (about 3yrs old). You ever try to control a cranky two-year old?

That said, I think that parents should be considerate of others and do their best to keep the little ones under control and be the best judge of whether or not the kids can handle behaving correctly in public and act accordingly. Cranky adults should do the same, but that doesn't always happen. Banning either of them to certain areas of the restaraunt is silly though.

I don't know about banning anyone from any section, but I do believe that the establishment has an obligation to see to it that any obstacles that would prevent a quiet, enjoyable dinner, are removed or reprimanded. There are positive ways of doing that. I personally, as a member of the establishment, would offer to go boxes for the whole family, maybe even with a discount, if all efforts had gone unheeded. If any of you, as an adult, went into a nice eating establishment either ungroomed and behaving offensively, would you not expect someone to do something about it? Of course you would! What puts kids in a category all of their own? I have heard the excuse, "Well, if we don't take them out when they are young, how will they ever learn how to act?" That's a poor excuse for a reason to annoy others..Chances are, they act that way at home, why should they act any differently out in public. If they know the rules, then rules are rules...and one of the most important rules that you can teach your child is to be conscious of others and not to go out of your way to make life uncomfortable for them..in other words, RESPECT..for others and for themselves. When they learn that, it's not a big deal taking them anywhere. They will finally learn that they are not the center of attention and that there are things around them that they can enjoy and they can participate in letting others enjoy their evening as well.

[bandnerd]

My parents never took my sister out until we were old enough to know how to behave. We were never problems in public. I'm not exaggerating or trying to make myself sound superior, but I agree with the premise: if your children are very young, get a babysitter. If you can't afford a babysitter, then maybe you don't need to spend your money on dinner out. When the children are older and can behave, then take them out once in awhile.

Taking very small children to music conerts or shows isn't really the best idea, either, because frankly, it's got to be hard on their little ears. I cringe when I see small children with no ear protection at football games with people screaming.

That said, nothing ruins a nice date out, like dinner and a movie, like screaming children. If they are acting like that, then TAKE THEM HOME.

[bandnerd]

The double post strikes again...how come I could make two posts in different threads with no problem before? Silly school filter...

[floater]

My sister just held her wedding reception, where we confronted this issue. Beforehand, some friends and family suggested it would be nice to have a dinner and not worry about kids screaming and misbehaving (my choice). But we had so many friends and cousins with new families (from out of the state, no less) we couldn't ask them not to bring them.

So we put the families together at tables at the back of the hall (MWC's Reed Center) near the exits. They didn't mind, and it worked like a charm. Depending on the size and type, restaurants having separate sections might work. A place like Toby Keith's might not have to, but one like Applewood's (which straddles between fine and family), it may be more appropriate. Of course, you can always ask not to be seated near a family, if you don't mind waiting.

[Rambo]

If people have a problem with children at restaurants, maybe tey need to simply get a life and see that they're not the only ones living and breathing in this world.

[GrandMaMa]

My parents never took my sister out until we were old enough to know how to behave. We were never problems in public. I'm not exaggerating or trying to make myself sound superior, but I agree with the premise: if your children are very young, get a babysitter. If you can't afford a babysitter, then maybe you don't need to spend your money on dinner out. When the children are older and can behave, then take them out once in awhile.

Taking very small children to music conerts or shows isn't really the best idea, either, because frankly, it's got to be hard on their little ears. I cringe when I see small children with no ear protection at football games with people screaming.

That said, nothing ruins a nice date out, like dinner and a movie, like screaming children. If they are acting like that, then TAKE THEM HOME.

AMEN, AMEN AND AMEN!!!!!!!

[Rambo]

This all brings up a good point here. Why should minors be discriminated in bars? It isn't like alcohol is evil or anything. Same thing with smoking. If I, as a 17 year old, want to smoke, I think it should be my right. Guess this is a topic for another thread.

[GrandMaMa]

If people have a problem with children at restaurants, maybe tey need to simply get a life and see that they're not the only ones living and breathing in this world.

I don't think that there is anyone posting on this thread that has stated that they have a problem with children in nice eating establishments, have you? No, the topic is one of their behavior and how much offensive behavior others have to endure while dining...now, isn't that the real issue? How much offensive behavior would you put up with if you were someplace, out for a nice evening and an adult became offensive to your or your date or your wife, or for that matter, your well bahaved children? You wouldn't put up with it, would you? Then why would you put up with the same behavior that could/ruin your meal? Is there an age at which you feel that an adult just simply has to endure ill manners or what? You are way off on this one, Mr. Rambo. Do you have children? If you do, do you feel like you have the right to allow your children to interfere with others' dinner? Do you feel that it is the children's fault or the parents responsibility? Ahem, that's a no brainer, isn't it?

[GrandMaMa]

This all brings up a good point here. Why should minors be discriminated in bars? It isn't like alcohol is evil or anything. Same thing with smoking. If I, as a 17 year old, want to smoke, I think it should be my right. Guess this is a topic for another thread.

Yes it is, and if you're lucky, there just MIGHT be someone that will believe that you are serious about your inane comments and cares to contribute.

[stargazer]

THANK YOU! It's about time someone else had this same idea. I'm tired of sitting behind some kid yelling at the top of his lungs too. I go to a restaurant to relax and have a nice dinner, not to listen to some screaming brat. They need their own room or area! How can anyone enjoy their meal with all that noise going on?

[quailcreekgal]

If people have a problem with children at restaurants, maybe tey need to simply get a life and see that they're not the only ones living and breathing in this world.

And neither are the people with children - keep kids reasonably quiet in a public place or keep them at home.

[OklaCity_75]

The biggest part of this problem is parents who do not keep their kids on a schedule.

My sister has had my youngest neice on the schedule of up by 7, a nap from 12 to 2 in bed by 8 until she started school this year. She has alway been one of the most well behaved kids I have ever known. The only time she gets cranky is when its bedtime. You give her a place to stretch out and a blanket to keep her warm and she is out for the night.

I see way too many parents dragging their fussy kids around at hours that are just way too late for a kid to be out.

They are screaming their heads off because its 9:45 and they should have been in bed already.

I think if your a parent with young kids you should plan your evenings to where your home by 8 or 9 at the latetest.

[MadMonk]

I think if your a parent with young kids you should plan your evenings to where your home by 8 or 9 at the latetest.

I agree. The kids can keep going, but their demeanor suffers greatly later in the evening. Its all about working around their capabilities. Some parents seem to think their kids can stay out all night and not expect them to be cranky. It just doesn't work that way.

[tnajk]

Uh.... no. Parents that cannot control thier children should not ruin it for everyone. We have 4 small children and eat out frequently! We did so from day one and they were never allowed or given the chance to misbehave- so they don't! They never get down from the table and run around and if by chance we have an unruly one, that child is taken to the car until he can be straightened out. (Usually it's just a few minutes, and this happens very RARELY) Nearly every time we eat out, we have some stranger approach us and comment on how well behaved our children are. It's a matter of parenting.

[wolf2006]

I agree with tnajk, it all comes down to how well a parent can control their child. I don't know how much good a special section could do. In most restaurants even if a screaming child is on the other side of the building you can still hear them. If parents make the choice to not control their children, the restaurants should simply ask them to leave under the right to refuse service law.

[mranderson]

SOme kids are fine. However, the place that should be sat aside for the loud ones?

HOME!