SandRidge Center & Commons

[Spartan]

I don't know about that. Good Egg would bring SR dangerously close to something resembling quasi mixed-use. That, as we all know, could be very damaging to their corporate image around the world.

[Pete]

The amenities building will also have a nice restaurant or two and the new tower is likely to have retail along Broadway. Braniff should have more retail/restaurants on the ground floor as well.

Give SandRidge credit... They are breathing tons of life into completely dead blocks right in the middle of our CBD.

[Spartan]

Where are you getting that the new tower will likely have retail along Broadway? If that's true, then good deal.

I'll hold the credit for SR. This was a situation where any change would have been a positive, at least in the short-term, but don't forget that SR did everything they could to prevent private developers from coming in and putting the Braniff AND Kermac buildings to a much higher use. So, as SR matures and grows their presence in our community, hopefully they do a lot of things that earn them kudos from all of us. But the current phase of their headquarters project is not one of them, and I just can't give someone who's already burned us once in a big way "kudos" for something that isn't even on the boards yet.

[metro]

Although i agree with you regarding Sandridge in theory, when you graduate and work in the real world, you'll see how things work in reality.

[Spartan]

Fair enough. But shouldn't we at least have this debate, even if my side always com es up short?

[Lafferty Daniel]

Where are you getting that the new tower will likely have retail along Broadway? If that's true, then good deal.

I'll hold the credit for SR. This was a situation where any change would have been a positive, at least in the short-term, but don't forget that SR did everything they could to prevent private developers from coming in and putting the Braniff AND Kermac buildings to a much higher use. So, as SR matures and grows their presence in our community, hopefully they do a lot of things that earn them kudos from all of us. But the current phase of their headquarters project is not one of them, and I just can't give someone who's already burned us once in a big way "kudos" for something that isn't even on the boards yet.

You act like everyone in OKC hates them because they tore down an ugly building. I guarantee that about 90% of the people who have a problem with them, post on this board. I've lived in OKC my whole life and never heard of anyone having a problem with them until I started reading this board. Like someone else said in another thread, the majority of the population has no idea what buildings you were trying to "save". While you might consider them historic, the majority of the city does not. Stop being butt hurt about it and move on.

And while you might not like the way their landscaping looks, why don't we take a look at some pictures of it from different angles? The only ones I've seen on here were taken directly from the side so that all you would see would be the individual rows of trees. Not the most flattering angle. What does it look like from the front? And why can't everyone just save their opinions for when it is finished? I don't really like the way it looks right now but IT'S A WORK IN PROGRESS. I like the renderings of what it's supposed look like when it's finished, so I'll save my judgement until then.

Like Pete said, while you might not agree with what they're doing with their city block, they are revitalizing an area of downtown that has been dead for a long time. Would you rather have what is going on now? Or have it be a dead, concrete graveyard for another few decades?

[sroberts24]

You act like everyone in OKC hates them because they tore down an ugly building. I guarantee that about 90% of the people who have a problem with them, post on this board. I've lived in OKC my whole life and never heard of anyone having a problem with them until I started reading this board. Like someone else said in another thread, the majority of the population has no idea what buildings you were trying to "save". While you might consider them historic, the majority of the city does not. Stop being butt hurt about it and move on.

And while you might not like the way their landscaping looks, why don't we take a look at some pictures of it from different angles? The only ones I've seen on here were taken directly from the side so that all you would see would be the individual rows of trees. Not the most flattering angle. What does it look like from the front? And why can't everyone just save their opinions for when it is finished? I don't really like the way it looks right now but IT'S A WORK IN PROGRESS. I like the renderings of what it's supposed look like when it's finished, so I'll save my judgement until then.

Like Pete said, while you might not agree with what they're doing with their city block, they are revitalizing an area of downtown that has been dead for a long time. Would you rather have what is going on now? Or have it be a dead, concrete graveyard for another few decades?

Thank you!

[LockeDown42]

you act like everyone in okc hates them because they tore down an ugly building. I guarantee that about 90% of the people who have a problem with them, post on this board. I've lived in okc my whole life and never heard of anyone having a problem with them until i started reading this board. Like someone else said in another thread, the majority of the population has no idea what buildings you were trying to "save". While you might consider them historic, the majority of the city does not. Stop being butt hurt about it and move on.

And while you might not like the way their landscaping looks, why don't we take a look at some pictures of it from different angles? The only ones i've seen on here were taken directly from the side so that all you would see would be the individual rows of trees. Not the most flattering angle. What does it look like from the front? And why can't everyone just save their opinions for when it is finished? I don't really like the way it looks right now but it's a work in progress. I like the renderings of what it's supposed look like when it's finished, so i'll save my judgement until then.

Like pete said, while you might not agree with what they're doing with their city block, they are revitalizing an area of downtown that has been dead for a long time. Would you rather have what is going on now? Or have it be a dead, concrete graveyard for another few decades?

Amen!

[Pete]

I wish I would have taken video about a year and a half ago when I walked around what is now the SandRidge complex.

I posted about it at the time because I couldn't get over that that entire area -- about 1/4 of all of our CBD -- was completely desolate. That entire block with the SR Tower was totally deserted; I mean not one light on in that entire sector. Then, you had the old Globe Life building and Dowell Center directly south, also completely empty for many years. To the north you had the old library, long shuttered and those AT&T buildings that give every impression of being lifeless. To the east is that grassy vacant lot, a drive-in bank (almost completely unused) and a parking garage with nothing at ground level.

I had walked over after parking in Deep Deuce and being energized by what was happening there... And became incredibly depressed. The realities of our central core were obviously still pretty dire when you have several blocks that look like something out of a post-apocalyptic movie. If I had been down there at night I would have been looking over my shoulder for zombies.

Worse yet was the realization that all those structures -- including the tower -- needed an incredible amount of work.

I'm frustrated by my inability to portray how incredibly bad that area was and felt.


I don't need to contrast that situation with where we are now and where we will be in just another year or two. Bad initial PR aside, what SandRidge is doing for downtown rivals the contributions of Devon -- and that's saying something.

[Just the facts]

Bad initial PR aside, what SandRidge is doing for downtown rivals the contributions of Devon -- and that's saying something.

By my count: Sidewalk interaction - Devon 0, Sandridge 2 (with more to come).

[wschnitt]

By my count: Sidewalk interaction - Devon 0, Sandridge 2 (with more to come).

I must agree. It is completely possible that 75% of the devon employees could go to work without setting a foot outside downtown and then by the same methods they by which they came in

[Just the facts]

I am going to adjust my JTF rating scale to factor in the number of retail/restaurant/professional service spaces that open directly to the sidewalk.

[mcca7596]

The block wouldn't have been dead for decades if The Braniff and Kermac had been converted into housing. And how do we know that an influx of residents wouldn't have encouraged Dowell to move forward with renovations on his building?

[Just the facts]

It might have very well been dead after Kerr McGee moved out but KM had more employees there then Sandridge does. The difference is that Sandridge is creating interacton with the sidewalk which will bring people to the area during the day and night who do not work at Sandridge. As Wschnitt pointed out at Devon, the vast majority of employees will arrive by car and park in a connected parking garage, walk into the building, stay there all day (even for lunch), and leave by car. At least the Sandridge employees will have to cross the street which might lead to a news/lotto/sundry kiosk at the corner.

And Yes, I know Devon restaurants will be open to the public but you won't see those restaurants from the sidewalk so they don't create a sense of place for the area. It's like the difference between sidewalk cafes and the food court at the mall.

[Pete]

The block wouldn't have been dead for decades if The Braniff and Kermac had been converted into housing. And how do we know that an influx of residents wouldn't have encouraged Dowell to move forward with renovations on his building?

Given the long and difficult road for the old library which is in infinitely better condition, we can't be sure that would have happened any time soon, if at all.

In fact, the only decent-sized housing projects that have been the product of historic renovation are the Montgomery and Park Harvey and both had received previous renovations and were in relatively good shape.

There are dozens of well-located older buildings around downtown that have been left untouched throughout this building boom because no one has been able to make them work financially.

[mcca7596]

It might have very well been dead after Kerr McGee moved out but KM had more employees there then Sandridge does. The difference is that Sandridge is creating interacton with the sidewalk which will bring people to the area during the day and night who do not work at Sandridge.

Wouldn't there be more people on the streets and even more people in the area though if those two buildings were housing as opposed to just more restaurants that Sandridge is adding?

[Pete]

As we are discussing this, SandRidge just filed a $750,000 building permit to erect the steel canopy between the tower and Braniff building.

[Just the facts]

Wouldn't there be more people on the streets and even more people in the area though if those two buildings were housing as opposed to just more restaurants that Sandridge is adding?

Yes there would be. Believe me, I am not happy about tearing down structures to replace them with corporate plazas - trees or no trees. Sandridge has said the corporate plaza is temporary so at this point all I can hope is that that is true.

[Pete]

Just to clarify, that large plaza at the corner of Robinson & RSK is permanent. None of their renderings or discussions have ever indicated otherwise. The proposed new tower would be east of the existing SR Tower on the site now occupied by a small parking garage.

Not only has SandRidge never indicated they would ever build anything west of SR Tower, they wouldn't be spending millions on this area if they had any other plans.

[Spartan]

You act like everyone in OKC hates them because they tore down an ugly building. I guarantee that about 90% of the people who have a problem with them, post on this board. I've lived in OKC my whole life and never heard of anyone having a problem with them until I started reading this board. Like someone else said in another thread, the majority of the population has no idea what buildings you were trying to "save". While you might consider them historic, the majority of the city does not. Stop being butt hurt about it and move on.

And while you might not like the way their landscaping looks, why don't we take a look at some pictures of it from different angles? The only ones I've seen on here were taken directly from the side so that all you would see would be the individual rows of trees. Not the most flattering angle. What does it look like from the front? And why can't everyone just save their opinions for when it is finished? I don't really like the way it looks right now but IT'S A WORK IN PROGRESS. I like the renderings of what it's supposed look like when it's finished, so I'll save my judgement until then.

Like Pete said, while you might not agree with what they're doing with their city block, they are revitalizing an area of downtown that has been dead for a long time. Would you rather have what is going on now? Or have it be a dead, concrete graveyard for another few decades?

Hey, could you tap your caps lock button for me one more time?

OK, since you work for SR, please post some photos of their landscaping from different angles, if you think it makes that much of a difference. But I think it's pretty telling when SR employees are getting on here and telling us that every photo taken is "not the most flattering angle" to quote yourself. Show us something that is flattering.

I also have a bit of news for you. Sometimes (gasp) finished construction does not always match the renderings. In fact, this happens a lot in OKC, because we have very lax building standards and frequently see a developer switch and bait in this town. It's usually a given that you can tell a LOT more about a finished product from how construction is beginning to shape up than from renderings.

I'm not going to argue the point on the Kermac and India Temple buildings with someone who doesn't understand that historic can be easily defined and proven, and I would also point out there were redevelopers who wanted to turn those buildings into apartments, which would have had a higher economic and revitalizing yield than..coniferous trees.

[BoulderSooner]

By my count: Sidewalk interaction - Devon 0, Sandridge 2 (with more to come).

NEBU opens to the sidewalk ... on the west side of the building

[Spartan]

The Devon garage, which will eventually have store fronts, and the auditorium.

[Pete]

Also have to give Devon credit for redeveloping the Colcord as there will soon be a new restaurant (Flint) with outside tables and a new entrance directly from the street rather than through the hotel lobby.

[Spartan]

Also, number of historic buildings Devon has torn down (so far): 0

Number of parking garages Devon has eliminated or significantly built onto: You get the point

[Urbanized]

Also have to give Devon credit for redeveloping the Colcord as there will soon be a new restaurant (Flint) with outside tables and a new entrance directly from the street rather than through the hotel lobby.

Yeah, really excited about this one. For the past 25 years or so I have squinted my eyes and imagined sidewalk dining under the Colcord canopy. Looking across the street on the re-worked gardens will make it that much better. I can't wait.