Occupy OKC Prostest the I40 crosstown opening

[TaoMaas]

TaoMaas, is it just me or are you pissed off at this officer? I'm starting to think you have a not so pleasant history with him.

No, I just think he crossed a line that would have gotten a regular person arrested. He handled it all wrong. The officer next to him had the right attitude. He was treating the protester as a joke...which he was.

[OKCisOK4me]

No, I just think he crossed a line that would have gotten a regular person arrested. He handled it all wrong. The officer next to him had the right attitude. He was treating the protester as a joke...which he was.

This is the way I look at it:

Why did the whole situation happen? Because Harry Potter wanted to provoke. It worked for him. Had there been no OHP officers there, Harry Potter would have found an Oklahoma County deputy or an Oklahoma City police officer to get what he wanted.

It was his sole purpose. Had there been no officers, what would they have done? Who would they have harassed? Do you agree that, had there been no officers there, there would be no video of this today and we would not be arguing the point?

The fine point is, there would have not have been a "line to cross" had this jackhole not put his phone in anyone's face...

[TaoMaas]

Do you agree that, had there been no officers there, there would be no video of this today and we would not be arguing the point?

Oh, I definitely agree! He was trying to provoke the officer and they were trying to get footage of it. No question about it. That still doesn't make it lawful to put your hands on another person. In fact, any person who is out in public is fair game to be photographed. They may leave, if they want, but they don't have a right to attack the photographer.

The fine point is, there would have not have been a "line to cross" had this jackhole not put his phone in anyone's face...

No...the line of not putting your hands on another person without a legal reason is always there. Like I said earlier, I'm sure this officer would have no problem arresting someone for assault for the same infraction.

[OKCisOK4me]

Oh, I definitely agree! He was trying to provoke the officer and they were trying to get footage of it. No question about it. That still doesn't make it lawful to put your hands on another person. In fact, any person who is out in public is fair game to be photographed. They may leave, if they want, but they don't have a right to attack the photographer.

In that thought, what photographer is going to put his equipment, knowingly, right into his subject's face? There's a difference between a novice/amateur/professional photographer and someone who's blatant goal is to get a reaction from someone.

[OSUMom]

They may leave, if they want, but they don't have a right to attack the photographer.

He couldn't leave. He was working and trying to do a job. And if he had 'attacked the photographer' said photographer would have been down on the ground in one second. I personally think it is an overreaction to call that simple little thing 'attack'.

[Double Edge]

Not quite. You can certainly be charged with assault without laying a finger on someone. It happens all the time. Don't confuse assault with battery. If I am sitting in a restaurant and you come and put both of your hands right in front of my face, I am going to react just as if you are assaulting me physically (battery). I think it is sad that people can tempt the line between assault and civil rights on an officer so easily.

Note: I should note, I am not a lawyer and my definitions of assault and battery may be off. Just how I recall them.

Eh. I'm not an lawyer either but assault is a threat of violence. Battery is unwanted contact, usually violent. So maybe someone putting their hands in your face could be interpreted as a threat of violence by you, even if it was not intended to be by them, which probably isn't going to qualify as criminal assault, but if they were obviously only interested in taking your photo or even just being annoying, that's not going to meet the definition.

You might be able to claim invasion of privacy, if you have attempted to carve out some privacy, like taking a dark corner booth in a restaurant or some such, but not when standing in the middle of a crowd.

Does anyone know why the cops were there? Were they there primarily to keep the peace or were they there primarily to participate in the festivities as PR for the Highway Patrol?

[Thunder]

Does anyone know why the cops were there? Were they there primarily to keep the peace or were they there primarily to participate in the festivities as PR for the Highway Patrol?

Protestors usually arrive at events early, so I'm sure someone panicked by calling for OHP warfare troops.

[Double Edge]

The cop needs a slap on the wrist, probably some anger management evaluation and training. I'm not holding my breath he's going to get any of that but I don't know that much about the OHP or how they police themselves.

If the cops were there to keep the peace and not just be hood ornaments, I think he could have told Jay, Jay, my job is to be observant of the activities and traffic at this event. You are interfering with that duty because you are restricting my vision. Please move along. And then about the third time he stuck the camera in his face, he could have calmly arrested him. But it didn't look to me like those cops had much interest in anything other than Jay and Jay was not in that cop's face that long before the guy lost his cool. At least from what we can see on the video.

[BBatesokc]

In the end the cop won't face any charges and it will be an internal matter. Unless someone is fired they won't release any of the details of internal personnel issues.

[G22]

Why wasn't Jay arrested for committing a crime if he was such a threat to the officer? Everyone knows that Jay was being annoying but that doesn't give the police the legal right to slap someone. An OHP officer choked the paramedic who was en-route to the hospital with a patient, then they had several incidents after that. What is happening when cameras aren't rolling? At least we know how Mary Fallin feels about OHP breaking rules...

[BBatesokc]

News9 and Irvin Box's take on it (for what its worth)..... http://www.news9.com/category/116601...clipid=6616502

I find the protester so annoying that, while I think the trooper acted improperly, I have zero sympathy for the 'victim.'

[MikeOKC]

News9 and Irvin Box's take on it (for what its worth)..... http://www.news9.com/category/116601...clipid=6616502

I find the protester so annoying that, while I think the trooper acted improperly, I have zero sympathy for the 'victim.'

100% agree with you, Brian.

[Tydude]

he was laughing during the interview and he seems fine i think he wants all the money that the big business want so he doesn't had to pay the taxes

[OSUMom]

This idiot is not doing his cause any good at all. Is there even one single person who would watch that interview with him and not wish the trooper and slapped his face instead of just knocking his phone out of his hand? Which after seeing it in slow-mo, looks like the trooper showed very nice control and didn't touch the guy at all when he slapped away the phone.

[dmoor82]

There's something wrong with a society that thinks the clothes I choose matter. If you can't see my dangly bits who cares?

Employers care how people look or carry themselves,and if anyone want's a decent paying job they should dress and shave accordingly!Society is the way it is,and while I may agree with You,it's just the way it is!

[MDot]

Why wasn't Jay arrested for committing a crime if he was such a threat to the officer? Everyone knows that Jay was being annoying but that doesn't give the police the legal right to slap someone. An OHP officer choked the paramedic who was en-route to the hospital with a patient, then they had several incidents after that. What is happening when cameras aren't rolling? At least we know how Mary Fallin feels about OHP breaking rules...

I'm not sure why the reference of Mary Fallin but I can just about gaurantee you didn't vote for her.

I seen that video too; for the record, I may be wrong but if I recall correctly they both were en-route to an accident and the paramedic went ahead of the officer and for some unknown reason he took exception to it and went nuts at the scene of the accident. That dude was just crazy with control issues, this guy slapped a phone out of a prick's hand, no physical harm unlike the other OHP you're alluding to. Don't try and make a connection just because they both were OHP.

Welcome to the forum BTW.

[oneforone]

Why wasn't Jay arrested for committing a crime if he was such a threat to the officer? Everyone knows that Jay was being annoying but that doesn't give the police the legal right to slap someone. An OHP officer choked the paramedic who was en-route to the hospital with a patient, then they had several incidents after that. What is happening when cameras aren't rolling? At least we know how Mary Fallin feels about OHP breaking rules...

The ambulance incident was nothing more than a stupid power play between both the paramedic and the trooper. The trooper could have ignored it and addressed the matter at a later time. After all his dash cam recorded the tag and unit number of the ambulance. The incident could have been addressed behind closed doors with a duty supervisor from OHP and the ambulance operator. The paramedic could have told the trooper. "I have a patient on board follow us to the hospital and we can discuss this there." When your a crew leader or a supervisor you have to the high road when dealing with somebody. It appeared to me the paramedic thought he was above the law because he was working for one of the indian tribes. I have heard of police officers running into issues with tribal police officers because they think they have free reign. They have to be reminded that only exist on indian land. When their off indian land local, state, federal officers override their authority. Just like a Moore PD officer would override an Oklahoma City Officer when a situation occurs in Moore and vice versa.

Protestors usually arrive at events early, so I'm sure someone panicked by calling for OHP warfare troops.

OHP Troopers are not just highway cops they are the state police their jurisdiction is the entire state. Nobody called them. They were likely there for an executive protection detail. OHP troopers are used for state dignitaries in the same way secret service is for federal dignitaries.

[ljbab728]

Speaking of Mary Fallin, she was also at this event. Does anyone think this incident might be looked at differently if she was the one he was getting so close to with his cell phone camera and it got knocked out of his hand? In other words, would that be considered a perceived threat against her when someone might think it was not a threat to the trooper?

[G22]

I'm not sure why the reference of Mary Fallin but I can just about gaurantee you didn't vote for her.

I seen that video too; for the record, I may be wrong but if I recall correctly they both were en-route to an accident and the paramedic went ahead of the officer and for some unknown reason he took exception to it and went nuts at the scene of the accident. That dude was just crazy with control issues, this guy slapped a phone out of a prick's hand, no physical harm unlike the other OHP you're alluding to. Don't try and make a connection just because they both were OHP.

Welcome to the forum BTW.

Thanks!
I think you got most of your facts wrong about the OHP / paramedic incident. I referenced Mary Fallin because I thought that OHP reports to the Governor just like the OKC police department reports to the mayor? Mary Fallin has done a great job for the state so far but I do think that OHP is too aggressive in many situations and she should encourage them to protect and serve instead of intimidate and bully. I know that OHP has some great officers but some of their members have major anger management issues.

[MDot]

Thanks!
I think you got most of your facts wrong about the OHP / paramedic incident. I referenced Mary Fallin because I thought that OHP reports to the Governor just like the OKC police department reports to the mayor? Mary Fallin has done a great job for the state so far but I do think that OHP is too aggressive in many situations and she should encourage them to protect and serve instead of intimidate and bully. I know that OHP has some great officers but some of their members have major anger management issues.

I never stated any facts, I was stating my memory which like most others can fail me at times such as this. I also might be stating someone else's "fact" which in turn was false which is my bad for believing something other than the official verified report. Point taken on the overly aggressive OHP and that there are dirty officers just like in sports there are dirty players and sometimes dirty officials. I also agree that some of them have anger management issues although the ones I've personally come into verbal contact with are very friendly and very calm, but that's only a few so I can't speak for every officer in Oklahoma.

[Snowman]

Speaking of Mary Fallin, she was also at this event. Does anyone think this incident might be looked at differently if she was the one he was getting so close to with his cell phone camera and it got knocked out of his hand? In other words, would that be considered a perceived threat against her when someone might think it was not a threat to the trooper?

That is an unlikely situation to occur, he would probably be crossing into a restricted area and removed.

[ljbab728]

That is an unlikely situation to occur, he would probably be crossing into a restricted area and removed.

I didn't say it was likely. I just asked if it would be perceived differently?

[TaoMaas]

If the cops were there to keep the peace and not just be hood ornaments, I think he could have told Jay, Jay, my job is to be observant of the activities and traffic at this event. You are interfering with that duty because you are restricting my vision. Please move along. And then about the third time he stuck the camera in his face, he could have calmly arrested him.

I agree...I think this is what the officer should have done...if anything.

[Of Sound Mind]

While I think the trooper overreacted, I will say that he was correct in one thing... if you get too close, you are a threat. One thing that we are taught in self defense courses is that the closer a potential threat is to you, the less time you have to adequately defend yourself. Given that, this person was WAY too close for any person, especially an LEO, to feel comfortable with any potential threats.

The punk was itching for a reaction and he got one. The trooper should have had a little more self control and this looks bad for the OHP... but as I said previously, I completely understand his reaction. I'm generally not a violent person, but I do protect my personal space... if that punk had done that to me, I would have reacted the same way (or worse)... and been happy to deal with whatever consequences, countercharging his assault and battery allegations against me with assault and threat allegations against him (whether successful or not).

I work downtown and I've had to deal with several of the Occupy protestors. If there goal is to generate discussion and interest in their cause, they've successfully done that... but not in support of their cause but in disgust and frustration with their behavior and actions.

[kevinpate]

... Given that, this person was WAY too close for any person, especially an LEO, to feel comfortable with any potential threats. ...

However, he was also about as close at times to two other officers. It looked to me he had stepped in even closer to the trooper who was also filming. Neither of whom gave over their professionalism. So in this instance, 2 outta 3 LEO's would appear to disagree.

I wanna buy the filming trooper a cup of coffee. Calm, collected and absolutely mocking all at the same time. Well played all in all. The aggravated trooper could learn from him.