SoSA District

[Architect2010]

I biked past this site and I am assuming it is on the South side of 9th.

I am curious as to why this site was chosen maybe I did not bike around enough but I did not really see the highlights of this neighborhood. There were a fair amount of rundown neighboring houses. Is it the proximity to Midtown?

A lot of Midtown is rundown, or empty. For this particular project, yes that little neighborhood is rundown, but it also has seen quite a few modern homes built where there were no houses, or where they were dilapidated. The modern aesthetic of this project is going to play off very nicely with SoSA.

[Spartan]

I agree, it's almost more intriguing than the project itself. The location by the way I think is more influenced by the progress in SoSA and the small cluster of MidtownR projects over on Francis. I think there is a vision that the whole area over toward Classen will be cleaned up and gentrified, albeit more low-density, here soon. SoSA is poised to take over the district.

As for Saint Anthony's, this is a major addition to the community and part of their neighborhood improvement goals. Their next phase of hospital expansion doesn't seem far off.

[betts]

Once the school is built, SoSA will be within walking distance to it. I suspect the neighborhood will really take off with young families. I'd buy land there if I had small children. I'd probably buy land there regardless if I were interested in building another house.

[Spartan]

By the school, you mean once the Emerson School is renovated? Or do you mean the downtown elementary down on Sheridan and Walker?

[betts]

Downtown elementary.

[modehomes]

St Anthony is very progressive these days and they care a tremendous amount about OKC and especially the Midtown area. They are interested in improving their existing facilities, developing new buildings on their campus (downtown and beyond) and improving the quality of life for their employees and residents within the immediate neighborhood through these types of partnerships. The development is on the NW corner of the NW 9th and N Shartel intersection and there will be 6 100% residential units and 1 live/work unit on the corner with street frontage. Choosing the "correct" site in Midtown to develop quality projects is not very important. The entire neighborhood is in a great location and has huge upside. What is important, however, is developing quality "for sale" housing that will act as a catalyst to improve the existing fabric of the neighborhood and hopefully inspire others to do the same. Our goal is to price them appropriately and within reach to the demographic of buyers looking to live in an urban setting and that will appreciate the design, quality and lifestyle our developments represent. The most important thing about the pricing of these units is that they will be priced for Oklahoma City not for Boston, Seattle, Philadelphia and so on...

[BDP]

St Anthony is very progressive these days and they care a tremendous amount about OKC and especially the Midtown area. They are interested in improving their existing facilities, developing new buildings on their campus (downtown and beyond) and improving the quality of life for their employees and residents within the immediate neighborhood through these types of partnerships. The development is on the NW corner of the NW 9th and N Shartel intersection and there will be 6 100% residential units and 1 live/work unit on the corner with street frontage. Choosing the "correct" site in Midtown to develop quality projects is not very important. The entire neighborhood is in a great location and has huge upside. What is important, however, is developing quality "for sale" housing that will act as a catalyst to improve the existing fabric of the neighborhood and hopefully inspire others to do the same. Our goal is to price them appropriately and within reach to the demographic of buyers looking to live in an urban setting and that will appreciate the design, quality and lifestyle our developments represent. The most important thing about the pricing of these units is that they will be priced for Oklahoma City not for Boston, Seattle, Philadelphia and so on...

Sounds good. Do you have any floor plans online that we can take a look at? The ones on the facebook page images are illegible.

Thanks.

[modehomes]

I will update the final floor plans after we finish with permitting.

[MidCenturyModOKC]

I really like this area of OKC because of the architecture alone, the area is obviously very up and coming- definitely not there yet but I think it will be eventually.

There is a need for reasonable (under $200,000) single family housing in this area. Why is that so hard to find? I realize the profit margin must be too low or it would be done, I just wish that you could find new construction in the heart of OKC at an entry level price. These condo projects are great, but for those people who have animals and want yards, they are less than practical.

[betts]

I don't know how much lots in SoSA tend to cost, because that can be a huge factor in what can be built at reasonable prices. I think, though, if people want under $200,000 homes in that neighborhood, they need to buy the lot themselves and find a builder who will build in their price range. Land available is probably too piecemeal to tempt a developer who can keep costs low by building multiple single family homes of similar construction.

[MidCenturyModOKC]

I don't know how much lots in SoSA tend to cost, because that can be a huge factor in what can be built at reasonable prices. I think, though, if people want under $200,000 homes in that neighborhood, they need to buy the lot themselves and find a builder who will build in their price range. Land available is probably too piecemeal to tempt a developer who can keep costs low by building multiple single family homes of similar construction.

Regarding the lots in SoSa - I believe you can still find some deals- $25,000 or less to me is a great deal for an infill lot. That is what builders in Edmond and Yukon and Moore are paying for those tiny lots in subdivisions with no trees, no view, and cookie cutter homes as far as the eye can see! At $25,000 per lot you could realistically build something in the $175-200,000 range and come out ahead.

I think you have a very valid point though. I would preface my previous comment with the LAST thing I would ever want to see is a standard set of floor plans thrown up in the beautiful diversified neighborhoods of NW OKC! I just do feel like there is a void in developer/builder interest in single family projects under the $200,000 mark. My background is in construction but because of the overwhelming bank issues of today's economy I took a corporate job in management - maybe they have all done the same.

I will say however that in order to make money you DO NOT have to build 500,000+ homes and you do not have to throw up 60 each year. There is a respectful way of building that really positively impacts the neighborhood your in and the customer who ends up purchasing the homes you have built with thought and care. I am not saying this doesn't exist in OKC - but I have not heard of too many builders who have that mindset.

Maybe I am wrong and they are all out of business. Maybe I am dumb in thinking that single family is the way that downtown/midtown/NW OKC should grow - I just feel like OKC is so spread out and there are still so many land options and vacant lots that when a buyer is coming to look at properties they are comparing these condo projects to getting yards for a lot less money - if they like that at all then they are going to lean the single family direction.

I will say that housing options of all kinds - condos, leased apartments, single family - in all price ranges under 200,000 - over 500,000 will be the only plan that offers truly long term growth for midtown and for downtown OKC. The housing has to be as diverse as the people who are considering making the move!

[betts]

I would like to see mostly single family housing in SoSA as well. As I said, I think that people who want to live there, however, should probably take the plunge, buy a lot and find a builder, rather than waiting for a developer to have the same vision and price points. I've almost always found it's the best way to get what you want at the price you want, as long as you have the willpower to hold off on extras.

[MidCenturyModOKC]

Does anyone know if there is a name for the area where the single family homes are built just north of Bricktown. There are a few SoSa style modern homes just a few blocks north of the Brownstones/Condo developments near Broadway Ext...I am curious about single family home lots over there and how the prices/options compare to SoSa.

[metro]

Flatiron, more expensive, and I believe only 1 new modern home, which is home to the Spy.

[metro]

Regarding the lots in SoSa - I believe you can still find some deals- $25,000 or less to me is a great deal for an infill lot. That is what builders in Edmond and Yukon and Moore are paying for those tiny lots in subdivisions with no trees, no view, and cookie cutter homes as far as the eye can see! At $25,000 per lot you could realistically build something in the $175-200,000 range and come out ahead.

I think you have a very valid point though. I would preface my previous comment with the LAST thing I would ever want to see is a standard set of floor plans thrown up in the beautiful diversified neighborhoods of NW OKC! I just do feel like there is a void in developer/builder interest in single family projects under the $200,000 mark. My background is in construction but because of the overwhelming bank issues of today's economy I took a corporate job in management - maybe they have all done the same.

I will say however that in order to make money you DO NOT have to build 500,000+ homes and you do not have to throw up 60 each year. There is a respectful way of building that really positively impacts the neighborhood your in and the customer who ends up purchasing the homes you have built with thought and care. I am not saying this doesn't exist in OKC - but I have not heard of too many builders who have that mindset.

Maybe I am wrong and they are all out of business. Maybe I am dumb in thinking that single family is the way that downtown/midtown/NW OKC should grow - I just feel like OKC is so spread out and there are still so many land options and vacant lots that when a buyer is coming to look at properties they are comparing these condo projects to getting yards for a lot less money - if they like that at all then they are going to lean the single family direction.

I will say that housing options of all kinds - condos, leased apartments, single family - in all price ranges under 200,000 - over 500,000 will be the only plan that offers truly long term growth for midtown and for downtown OKC. The housing has to be as diverse as the people who are considering making the move!

Most are well under $10K, however some are upwards of $25K. There i are at least two squatter property owners living in a dream wanting $200K plus for a lot. They will NEVER get it. This is OKC, not Boston.

[MidCenturyModOKC]

Most are well under $10K, however some are upwards of $25K. There i are at least two squatter property owners living in a dream wanting $200K plus for a lot. They will NEVER get it. This is OKC, not Boston.

THANKS for the info metro! You are so right - If your info is correct SoSa seems priced appropriately for what it is "up and coming" in mid/downtown OKC! Flatiron would eventually be a fantastic location for single family homes but they are not going to go for those price points and not without a group of homeowners pulling for the area to improve into that!

The best part about SoSa in my opinion is the pioneering spirit that is already there! You see a truly architectural gem placed right next door to a dilapidated bungalow. Driving throughout this are you can FEEL change happening! On a personal note- the county jail is very close and so I am a bit worried about crime, but I live in a very nice part of NW OKC now and was recently broken into and they stole everything I had - so although it might be more convenient, it does not mean it doesn't happen EVERYWHERE!

[metro]

Usually LESS crime right by the jail and the police station, it's just a PERCEPTION issue.

[dankrutka]

Yeah. A jail nearby shouldn't mean more crime. They make criminals stay INSIDE the jail.

[mcca7596]

There is a new home being proposed on the urban design commission's agenda: http://okc.gov/planning/planning_library/index.html

[dwellsokc]

There is a new home being proposed on the urban design commission's agenda: http://okc.gov/planning/planning_library/index.html

...a very strange, retro style that breaks from the contemporary trend. Too bad...

[metro]

I agree the style is a little strange, it's not bad, and looks MUCH better than a lot of the crap being allowed downtown and inner city. And a bigger bonus, it's infill of a vacant lot in a up and coming area, AND it looks like it's being built on a zero lot line with retail store frontage. This will be good for pedestrian traffic. We still have HUNDREDS of vacant lots that need filling in downtown. I'm with Kerry, let's not settle for subpar, but at some point we need to be realistic and accept infill with compromised standards (yet still slightly better than the past, but encouraging even better standards when possible). Once we have some mass density, then the nicer projects will come anyways.

[ljbab728]

Yeah. A jail nearby shouldn't mean more crime. They make criminals stay INSIDE the jail.

You're right and the criminals outside of the jail tend to want to stay as far away from it as possible.

[MidCenturyModOKC]

Does anyone know what the residential setbacks are in OKC? Do they vary by addition? I am more concerned about the sides as opposed to front and back setbacks.

I am from Missouri and have only built homes there. I am kind of confused by the challenge of finding building restrictions in NW OKC, why do they hide these? I am looking at some SoSa lots and seeing how large the home footprint could be.

[dwellsokc]

Does anyone know what the residential setbacks are in OKC? Do they vary by addition? I am more concerned about the sides as opposed to front and back setbacks.

Setbacks are dependent on zoning. Technically you can build to all property lines in SoSA, but the "Cottage District" overlay zoning requires general conformance to the front yard setbacks on your side of the block...

Different suburban zones have different setback requirements. The OKC Planning Department will be happy to educate you.

[MidCenturyModOKC]

Thank you dwellsokc! I have found the OKC Planning Dept less than happy to educate, but I am sure that was just one bad experience. I am surprised that more of that information is not available on their website! That made acquisition of land and preliminary planning much easier!