Another H&M Store Opening! Could OKC be next?

[Larry OKC]

Thanks for the info...so sort of a 'town square" type thing ... from the pics looks a bit like the one in Back to the Future films...LOL

or even a Lower Bricktown (with the theater, canal/water feature plaza, restaurants...)?

[Pete]

Yeah, most are built to look like some sort of town -- a Disney version anyway.

They also are usually heavy on entertainment; live music, street performers... Often integrate a farmer's market or similar.

OKC really doesn't have anything like this, although I think something similar was once proposed for north of QS Mall. I think the 63rd & Western area is prefect and I'm sure that's what CHK has in mind.

[Spartan]

There have been a dozen lifestyle centers proposed across the metro. Many of them built up a ton of public excitement and then disappointed, such as Tuscana. Others managed to rip off the public while there was excitement by getting a TIF and then building utter crap, such as UNP in Norman. That one is practically a scandal.

OKC developers don't do lifestyle centers. Now one is proposed in Moore, so we will see how that turns out. I hope it happens, but I just don't see Moore being the place that lures UO, H&M, et al. That lifestyle center will have to be smallish and focus on more middle-of-the-road tenants.

[Pete]

Lower Bricktown was supposed to be lifestyle center as well, and Hogan referenced The Grove as inspiration.

To do these things right, you have to go all-in.

Rick Caruso -- The Grove developer -- has done a few more of these things since and a couple haven't done very well because they weren't big enough to create critical mass. You can't just have a few of the elements... You have to go big and create space that is elaborate and unique with plenty of big retail and nice restaurants. Then you have to program all the entertainment and add other attractions.

Otherwise, you just end up with another lame strip center with a little nicer architecture.

[bluedogok]

Actually, many of the lifestyle centers I've seen are fairly tacky, with a Starbucks, Home Depot or Lowes, a few nail salons and some scattered, fairly uninteresting retail. The Domain in Austin is an exception

The Domain has its tacky-ness...but then they may come from having to go to work there everyday. Nothing like having an office in a shopping mall........

[BG918]

I have been to the H&M in Las Vegas. I believe the closest to OKC is St. Louis. OKC will not see one for years if ever. I don't even think Denver has one. If anything I see us getting an UO, an American Apparel and possibly a Armani Exchange. I have personally emailed UP and AX about putting a location in OKC. Offered some possible locations etc.

Denver is currently building one....downtown!

http://www.denverpost.com/business/ci_17840042

[okcustu]

I have been to the H&M in Las Vegas. I believe the closest to OKC is St. Louis. OKC will not see one for years if ever. I don't even think Denver has one. If anything I see us getting an UO, an American Apparel and possibly a Armani Exchange. I have personally emailed UP and AX about putting a location in OKC. Offered some possible locations etc.

Denver just opened, or is about to open their first, so I'd agree

[soonerguru]

I do think OKC is ready for an up-scale lifestyle center and I think the CHK development is where it is most likely to happen.

If they could just get things worked out with the City of Nichols Hills, this could not only happen soon but I also think it would be extremely successful.

Unfortunately, the "master plan" for Cheseapeake City is a sprawling mess that follows the pattern of strip malls, not a lifestyle center. Parking lots, and a hip-looking strip mall. Not really any room for a lifestyle center.

[Pete]

I moved a bunch of posts about NH Plaza to a new thread by that title in the Suburban Development forum:

http://www.okctalk.com/showthread.php?t=26757

[Lord Helmet]

Denver just opened, or is about to open their first, so I'd agree

Yep. It took the spot downtown where Niketown was.

[Steve]

http://newsok.com/questions-and-answ...rticle/3591724

[betts]

How about Restoration Hardware? That's the only chain left that I really, really wish were here. Jonathan Adler's stores are fun, as are West Elm's too. CB2 would be nice, but I won't die if we don't get one. But I've bought more stuff from Restoration Hardware than almost any other mail order store. Sigh. Maybe the one in Tulsa isn't doing well. Or maybe Aubrey's being super secretive about what is going next to Anthropologie.

[onthestrip]

Yep. It took the spot downtown where Niketown was.

Is there no longer a Niketown in Denver or did they move?

[BG918]

Is there no longer a Niketown in Denver or did they move?

No more Niketown. I saw where they are now going to open another H&M in Denver at Cherry Creek Mall (about 2 miles from downtown). Saks closed earlier this year and it likely will go there.

[Pete]

According to the interview Steve posted, H&M has indeed shown some interest.

It also referenced the 'benevolence' of Aubrey McClendon, which I took to meet that CHK is providing financial incentives to land retailers like WF and Anthropologie.

[Steve]

According to the interview Steve posted, H&M has indeed shown some interest.

It also referenced the 'benevolence' of Aubrey McClendon, which I took to meet that CHK is providing financial incentives to land retailers like WF and Anthropologie.

Ding, ding, ding

[redrunner]

Ring-a-ling-a-ling!

[Larry OKC]

According to the interview Steve posted, H&M has indeed shown some interest.

It also referenced the 'benevolence' of Aubrey McClendon, which I took to meet that CHK is providing financial incentives to land retailers like WF and Anthropologie.

But doesn't that at least reinforce the perception that OKC doesn't have the demographics these companies desire without being subsidized in this manner? Even if wildly successful (as the Outlet appears to be), doesn't it set the precedent for the next business that sees it and expects the same?

[ljbab728]

But doesn't that at least reinforce the perception that OKC doesn't have the demographics these companies desire without being subsidized in this manner? Even if wildly successful (as the Outlet appears to be), doesn't it set the precedent for the next business that sees it and expects the same?

I see it more as setting a precedence for other retailers to see that the ones opening here now can be successful which will, in itself, make us more attractive with or without incentives.

[Larry OKC]

I'm not saying your wrong, but you don't think they aren't going to insist on the same treatment the other guys got?

I can't think of a single store or restaurant that I want so badly that I would pay them millions of dollars (or whatever the "incentives" amount to), just so I could patronize them. Now if the money comes from an individual or even a company (as in Chesapeakes case) that is one thing, but certainly not taxpayer dollars. The only justicification for that is when it turns into a guaranteed ROI (such as the Outlet mall, where the money is going to the developers and not the stores in it). With Bass Pro a bad example.

[lasomeday]

Lar, I think the Outlet Mall will prove to be a good investment! If only they could have an outlet/lifestyle center where Bass Pro is. That would have been a spark that would have caused a massive fire for Bricktown development. Residential, hotels, and restaurants would be everywhere! It would be like my favorite development Country Club Plaza in KC on steroids! What 20 something college grad would not want to live there!

Sorry I got a little off track. I believe the Outlet Mall incentives will prove to be paid back to the city as it attracts more development and sales tax.

[bluedogok]

Every market has an entity that will provide some sort of incentive to lure new retailers, I know The Domain here in Austin has a rather large incentive package behind it by the City of Austin. We have to fill out an employment form every quarter to be submitted to the city to make sure the incentives keep coming for Simon/Endeavor.

[Pete]

Also in Steve's interview, it said that there is now tons of interest from other grocers. That only happened after the WF announcement.

Sunflower Market will be open in a few weeks and I seriously doubt they got any incentives.

[ljbab728]

Also in Steve's interview, it said that there is now tons of interest from other grocers. That only happened after the WF announcement.

Sunflower Market will be open in a few weeks and I seriously doubt they got any incentives.

That was my point, Pete. Even if we have to offer incentives to some businesses. If others see that they are successful and think they can make money, they will come without incentives.

[Larry OKC]

I am not in total disagreement. For example if it took incentives to get Wal-mart to locate in a particular location, as we have seen numerous times, all sorts of development springs up where ever Wal-mart goes. And probably without incentives to do it. Or as with the case with Sunflowers following Whole Foods, it may be a case of if WF think it is a good place, then it must be. Not uncommon for the various fast-food places to wait until a McDonald's goes in. Or a Walgreens/CVC battling corners. But what I am saying if it becomes public knowledge that the only reason Whole Foods came here was because of the incentives (when the demographics WF looks at have said that we can't support it without the incentive). In other words, would Whole Foods have come without the incentives or did their demographics say it wouldn't work? Then that leads to a false assumption by the others that see Whole Foods going in and thinking "see, they think it will work, so it must be good". A couple of things, Whole Foods hasn't even opened yet so to say other's are seeing that "they are successful" doesn't make any sense. Sunflower isn't opening up in a Chesapeake owned property are they? If they were then they would probably expect the same incentive that the other retailers got, wouldn't they? If those incentives were to come from the City (as the ULI folks said would be required to get any of those big name retailers DT), wouldn't others expect those same incentives? Why haven't we seen the explosion of retail in Bricktown? The incentive's given to Bass Pro were to lead to all of that, weren't they?