Whole Foods

[flintysooner]

Whole Foods is a niche marketer and could care less about the WalMart shoppers. WF targets a specific demographics for its customers. Saving money and WF don't go together. Feeding a big family for less is not WF's objective.

HEB is a long established local favorite with twice as many stores in San Antonio. And most of HEB is very competitively priced basic food. If Crest keeps upgrading their stores and adds more locations it can do what HEB does...grab the middle ground.

In that article I noticed HEB had lost market from 67% in 2003 to 53% in 2010. Wal-Mart in same period moved from 14.3% to 20%. So others gained about 7% in the same period. When I was in San Antonio I thought HEB Plus was more like a Super Wal-Mart actually. I am just not fond of the huge stores for groceries though.

[flintysooner]

I'm surprised Reasor's hasn't opened up a store in OKC. The newer ones I've been to in Tulsa remind me of HEB or Safeway. That article indicates they are on the radar.

My friend from Tulsa constantly complains about the lack of choices there. She recently visited the new Crest Fresh Market and said she plans on loading up there when she visits.

[OKC@heart]

HEB's are great and so vastly better than anything walmart has ever tried to put to market. I would love it if HEB considered expanding their reach northward.

[soonerguru]

My friend from Tulsa constantly complains about the lack of choices there. She recently visited the new Crest Fresh Market and said she plans on loading up there when she visits.

That's crazy. Reasor's is a very nice store -- and they have Whole Foods and Petty's on the higher end. Reasor's may not be as competitively priced as Crest but it blows away Homeland.

[flintysooner]

That's crazy. Reasor's is a very nice store -- and they have Whole Foods and Petty's on the higher end. Reasor's may not be as competitively priced as Crest but it blows away Homeland.

Just reporting what she said. Plus she goes to Whole Foods, too.

[betts]

There are HEBs in Nebraska, so they're definitely expanding their range. We have always been in the grocery store doldrums and Whole Foods is the only ray of hope I've seen recently.

[redrunner]

There are HEBs in Nebraska, so they're definitely expanding their range. We have always been in the grocery store doldrums and Whole Foods is the only ray of hope I've seen recently.

You must be confused. Texas based H-E-B only serves Texas and Mexico.

[bluedogok]

You must be confused. Texas based H-E-B only serves Texas and Mexico.

Yep, they were in Lake Charles, Louisiana near the Texas border but closed it in 2003. H-E-B Mexico is pretty much operated as a completely separate entity like Central Market is. The Central Market management is in Dallas and H-E-B is in San Antonio. A friend who has developed some products for them said they developed a product for H-E-B and then had to go "sell it" to Central Market, he said there is very little overlap other than some products that both carry, they haven't even ventured into selling it to H-E-B Mexico.

[betts]

You must be confused. Texas based H-E-B only serves Texas and Mexico.

You are correct and I made an incorrect statement. Hy-Vee is in Nebraska, not H-E-B. I got them confused.

[Swake2]

That's crazy. Reasor's is a very nice store -- and they have Whole Foods and Petty's on the higher end. Reasor's may not be as competitively priced as Crest but it blows away Homeland.

Reasor's can vary a lot. The newer locations are very nice and well stocked. Nearly as good as Whole Foods and much larger. Quite a bit better than Target. The main downside is that they have all natural meats instead of organic. Some of the older ones in less wealthy parts of town are much less nice with a whole different selection of foods.

Food Pyramid is also good, pretty expensive but good. They are the old Albertson's locations but they really upgraded the stores from what Albertson's was, adding Starbucks coffee shops to all the stores, better meats and much better organic and international foods sections.

And yes, then there's Whole Foods and Petty's

[t3h_wookiee]

Food Pyramid is rather nice indeed! The Albertson's in Bartlesville was rather rundown, but since it has become Food Pyramid it has greatly improved. Especially for the vegetarian residents in town! I've actually noticed that the prices when I've gone have been lower than they were before, excepting the meat department (which is much higher quality now though!).

[Vegan]

Don't want to read through 11 pages to see if this was already mentioned, but......was in the Whole Foods in Tulsa a week ago and an employee there said that the one in OKC will not open until NEXT YEAR in December!!!! Something about the foundation turning out to be crap and having to start over...wasn't really paying attention after I heard "December next year".

[Pete]

They are certainly moving very, very slowing at the WF construction site. Don't think it's due to the foundation, as one has yet to be poured!


I think what's happening is that CHK is stepping back and designing a bunch of other features into the surrounding properties and wants to make sure and integrate Whole Foods into the bigger picture.

Since they started on WF, they have started demolishing the Glenbrook Centre West building, have been doing extensive work on the creek that splits this parcel, etc.

Rumor is that a hotel will go up north of Whole Foods and I bet there will be other development as well.

Might mean that the Whole Foods opening is delayed a bit, but it's good news in terms of lots of other things going on in that immediate area. I'm sure CHK will do an outstanding job and that it will be worth the wait.

[ljbab728]

There was an interesting feature on KFOR today by Bobbie Miller which mentioned Whole Foods prominently. It was concerning organic products at grocery stores and the cost versus desirability. I tried to find a link on their website but it wasn't there yet so this is partly by memory. I think they said the price of organic products in most stores was about 40 percent higher than nonorganic. At Whole Foods the price was about 70 percent higher. They also had an expert mentioning that there was absolutely no scientific proof currently that eating organic products was any healthier. So for those of you who want to buy organic, unless you have other reasons (and I know there are other reasons), you may be wasting your money.

[mcca7596]

The lack of pesticides alone is to me an obvious and worthwhile benefit of organic foods; regardless, higher prices or not, it's great that Whole Foods is coming into the market and will offer local consumers another grocery choice.

[soonerguru]

There was an interesting feature on KFOR today by Bobbie Miller which mentioned Whole Foods prominently. It was concerning organic products at grocery stores and the cost versus desirability. I tried to find a link on their website but it wasn't there yet so this is partly by memory. I think they said the price of organic products in most stores was about 40 percent higher than nonorganic. At Whole Foods the price was about 70 percent higher. They also had an expert mentioning that there was absolutely no scientific proof currently that eating organic products was any healthier. So for those of you who want to buy organic, unless you have other reasons (and I know there are other reasons), you may be wasting your money.

There is never "absolute" scientific proof for anything. There is, however, plenty of scientific evidence that eating food laden with chemicals and modified genetically is making people less healthy.

I would rather eat food produced on a farm as opposed to something concocted in a lab. Whatever "science" the industrial food companies use I'm sure supports the argument Ms. Miller was discussing on Channel 4. Sounds like a flimsy report overall.

[ljbab728]

There is never "absolute" scientific proof for anything. There is, however, plenty of scientific evidence that eating food laden with chemicals and modified genetically is making people less healthy.

I would rather eat food produced on a farm as opposed to something concocted in a lab. Whatever "science" the industrial food companies use I'm sure supports the argument Ms. Miller was discussing on Channel 4. Sounds like a flimsy report overall.

I'm not sure the word "aboslute" was mentioned but evidently the expert that was interviewed doesn't agree with you about the health issue. I sure you consider a report that doesn't agree with you to be flimsy, though. I suspect that I've lived a few more years than you without eating organic food and I'm sure not going to spend that much more money changing now. As I said if you have other reasons for wanting organics that is reasonable but not for me. It's just a feel good, fashionable trend for people who want to say "look at what I'm doing" that isn't supportable by science.

[betts]

There's some decent data out of Sweden regarding removing antibiotics as growth promoters for feed animals and a return to less resistant bacteria. A combination of that and widespread attempts to educate people about the facts that antibiotics don't cure colds, that adults with sore throats almost never need antibiotics, etc., has led to a significant drop in MRSA (methicillin resistant staph aureus) in that country. But, prohibiting use of antibiotics in feed animals had an effect independent of the mass education attempt.

[ljbab728]

There's some decent data out of Sweden regarding removing antibiotics as growth promoters for feed animals and a return to less resistant bacteria. A combination of that and widespread attempts to educate people about the facts that antibiotics don't cure colds, that adults with sore throats almost never need antibiotics, etc., has led to a significant drop in MRSA (methicillin resistant staph aureus) in that country. But, prohibiting use of antibiotics in feed animals had an effect independent of the mass education attempt.

I'm not totally convinced that there is no benefit at all but sometimes you have to weigh cost versus benefits and the cost is significant. That is, unless you're Howard Hughes, and want to spend your fortune trying to live in a germ free environment. LOL

[mcca7596]

I'm not totally convinced that there is no benefit at all but sometimes you have to weigh cost versus benefits and the cost is significant. That is, unless you're Howard Hughes, and want to spend your fortune trying to live in a germ free environment. LOL

Actually, with organic foods there are more germs... you know... no pesticides? It allows produce to interact naturally with the environment.

[ljbab728]

Actually, with organic foods there are more germs... you know... no pesticides? It allows produce to interact naturally with the environment.

Well, Howard Hughes didn't understand the difference ... you know. LOL

[soonerguru]

I'm not sure the word "aboslute" was mentioned but evidently the expert that was interviewed doesn't agree with you about the health issue. I sure you consider a report that doesn't agree with you to be flimsy, though. I suspect that I've lived a few more years than you without eating organic food and I'm sure not going to spend that much more money changing now. As I said if you have other reasons for wanting organics that is reasonable but not for me. It's just a feel good, fashionable trend for people who want to say "look at what I'm doing" that isn't supportable by science.

I couldn't care less what is fashionable. I'm not rich and I can't afford to throw money around, but I'm not an idiot. I don't trust the industrial food industry, and I would have no reason to, given the track record. You just want to argue and I'm not interested in that, so let's just agree to disagree. For the record, I don't want to feed my family genetically modified crap and food that is created in a test tube. If you're cool with that, bully for you, pal.

[betts]

Actually, with organic foods there are more germs... you know... no pesticides? It allows produce to interact naturally with the environment.

With pesticide use there are fewer pests, but I believe those are insects, not germs. There are always germs, it's just that with animals fed antibiotics, the germs are more likely to be resistant to them.

[ljbab728]

I couldn't care less what is fashionable. I'm not rich and I can't afford to throw money around, but I'm not an idiot. I don't trust the industrial food industry, and I would have no reason to, given the track record. You just want to argue and I'm not interested in that, so let's just agree to disagree. For the record, I don't want to feed my family genetically modified crap and food that is created in a test tube. If you're cool with that, bully for you, pal.

Yes, I'm very cool with that and I'm also cool with the lesser cost. Genetically modified crap is your term, not mine for sure. Just because you're buying something that isn't high dollar organic doesn't mean it's genetically modified and I still want to see proof that even if something is genetically modified it's bad for you. Certainly if that's how you choose to spend your money that's your choice and I have no problem with it.

[metro]

Drove by this morning, they had a couple truck loads of steel beams. Hopefully this means some real progress soon.