Paseo District

[Spartan]

I love being repeated. It means I might be right for a change.

[Larry OKC]

With all due respect

Then why have OKCitians fled the "Urban" ("warehousing for humans") for the Suburbs ("cattle ranch for humans")? Seems most prefer the breathing room instead of being crammed together, on top & bottom of each other. Isolation or connectivity? Have seen many an instance in Urban settings where people don't interact or know their neighbor any more than those in the burbs.

To each their own

[flintysooner]

My observation and experience is that social interaction and community is more easily achieved in practice in the less crowded, more rural areas. There the pace is often slow enough to meet friends at the local diner for coffee and conversation or to visit at the feed store or maybe just wave at neighbors while driving or maybe help with some chore or another.

On the other hand the pace of life seems to me to be more exaggerated in the larger, more densely populated places. In fact there seems to me to be an anonymous isolation that exists in the midst of multitudes that I have not observed elsewhere.

The Paseo does not seem that way at all to me but more resembles what I associate with smaller communities. Definitely does not feel like warehousing.

[krisb]

My observation and experience is that social interaction and community is more easily achieved in practice in the less crowded, more rural areas. There the pace is often slow enough to meet friends at the local diner for coffee and conversation or to visit at the feed store or maybe just wave at neighbors while driving or maybe help with some chore or another.

On the other hand the pace of life seems to me to be more exaggerated in the larger, more densely populated places. In fact there seems to me to be an anonymous isolation that exists in the midst of multitudes that I have not observed elsewhere.

The Paseo does not seem that way at all to me but more resembles what I associate with smaller communities. Definitely does not feel like warehousing.

You're making the comparison between urban and rural...not urban vs. suburban. Most would agree that rural life maintains a certain about of community-building and charm, not to mention the enjoyment of living the simple life in connection with the land. Suburbia, however, offers none of the charm of country living and none of the density/diversity/street life of the urban experience. Most of the neighborhoods mentioned on this list are urban...but not in the sense of "the projects." We're talking walkable neighborhoods built on a human scale with a mix of uses. In other words...the blueprint for great civic design since modern civilization began.

[flintysooner]

You're making the comparison between urban and rural...not urban vs. suburban. Most would agree that rural life maintains a certain about of community-building and charm, not to mention the enjoyment of living the simple life in connection with the land. Suburbia, however, offers none of the charm of country living and none of the density/diversity/street life of the urban experience. Most of the neighborhoods mentioned on this list are urban...but not in the sense of "the projects." We're talking walkable neighborhoods built on a human scale with a mix of uses. In other words...the blueprint for great civic design since modern civilization began.

Ah. I said the Boston neighborhood images looked to me like warehousing for humans. Spartan replied that if that were the case then suburbia must be cattle ranch for humans. Knowing something about ranches I responded that I didn't see what was bad about ranches.

Spartan, joined by Architect2010, said it was because of desolation, isolation, and lack of civil society. Architect2010 then suggested it is also a waste of land and valuable resources.

Both expressed preference for human warehousing. I found nothing persuasive in either's discussion about why my opinion might be in error and did notice the condescension.

EBAH stated that the image of Back Bay failed to do justice in presenting the actual neighborhood area. That actually may be true. I've never been to Boston and have no other knowledge of the area except the image.

In particular though the image shows the same apartment building repeated over and over and over. It is really as depressing to me as many of the suburban and apartment developments I see. The trees make it a little better than Soviet style I suppose but it is just not for me an image of an inviting neighborhood. It does seem to me like warehouses.

It isn't like Paseo from what I know.

But it's merely my opinion of that one image.

[dmoor82]

WOW! Boston is a model of Urban excellence at it's best!if you are planning to create or build on a city you should want it to be The most sustainable it can be Example:Boston!The Back Bay is One of The most historical neighborhoods in America,it has a multitude of of ammenities that OKC could only dream of!

[flintysooner]

WOW! Boston is a model of Urban excellence at it's best!if you are planning to create or build on a city you should want it to be The most sustainable it can be Example:Boston!The Back Bay is One of The most historical neighborhoods in America,it has a multitude of of ammenities that OKC could only dream of!

That may be true but why is the repetition of the same building any different than so called "cookie cutter" neighborhoods anywhere else?

[Platemaker]

That may be true but why is the repetition of the same building any different than so called "cookie cutter" neighborhoods anywhere else?

Because they are architecturally significant... not disposable architecture.

[flintysooner]

Because they are architecturally significant... not disposable architecture.

What makes them architecturally significant?

[Architect2010]

Architect2010 then suggested it is also a waste of land and valuable resources.

How is it not wasteful? The more land used in a sprawling and unhealthy manner, the more wasteful. I'm sorry, but I was thinking by cattle ranch, we were talking about suburbia as well.

And the reason OKCitians as well as other people have "fled" the urbanity and density of other cities is because WE ARE WASTEFUL. "To each their own", but one of them is obviously the way smarter way to build, sustain, and connect. The other is a free-for all to consume our land and resources while connecting it all with expensive and expansive roads, and the big SUV's needed to travel the distances between. I will never understand why people think that is okay. It's the nature of our species I suppose. To destroy and want want want.

[flintysooner]

How is it not wasteful? The more land used in a sprawling and unhealthy manner, the more wasteful. I'm sorry, but I was thinking by cattle ranch, we were talking about suburbia as well.

And the reason OKCitians as well as other people have "fled" the urbanity and density of other cities is because WE ARE WASTEFUL. "To each their own", but one of them is obviously the way smarter way to build, sustain, and connect. The other is a free-for all to consume our land and resources while connecting it all with expensive and expansive roads, and the big SUV's needed to travel the distances between. I will never understand why people think that is okay. It's the nature of our species I suppose. To destroy and want want want.

You and Spartan apparently are debating something but exactly what it is and for what reason I am clueless.

Have a nice day.

[Spartan]

With all due respect

Then why have OKCitians fled the "Urban" ("warehousing for humans") for the Suburbs ("cattle ranch for humans")? Seems most prefer the breathing room instead of being crammed together, on top & bottom of each other. Isolation or connectivity? Have seen many an instance in Urban settings where people don't interact or know their neighbor any more than those in the burbs.

To each their own

I don't think it's a far stretch to suggest that a sizable portion of Oklahomans are against the things that go into building a civil society..

[bornhere]

The Paseo and the Plaza District are so different in intent that I'm not sure there's a point in comparing them.

[Spartan]

How are they different? They both are using the same urban fundamentals and thriving as urban hoods.

Now, Plaza/Paseo and Quail Springs ARE so different in intent that comparisons are useless.

[bornhere]

The Plaza District has a much larger percentage of retail. I think there's only one actual 'art gallery' there, which is the one owned by Don Narcomey. DNA calls itself a gallery, but also sells jewelry, t-shirts and such.

The Paseo, on the other hand, is primarily galleries and studios. There are some artists on the Paseo who would prefer to do no retail at all. They rented space to use strictly for studio work, not to sell their art on the premises.

[lovokc]

Our family really enjoys the Paseo. On the first Friday (usually date night for me and hubby)and Saturday 99% of the district is open for viewing. Friday night is more of an adult atmosphere. Saturday more for families. They are so wonderful encouraging the children to express themselves in art. We also love to attend to art festivals.

I also do quite a bit of shopping there around the holidays. I am please with the progress the district has made and intend to continue visiting the Paseo Art District.

[betts]

With all due respect

Then why have OKCitians fled the "Urban" ("warehousing for humans") for the Suburbs ("cattle ranch for humans")? Seems most prefer the breathing room instead of being crammed together, on top & bottom of each other. Isolation or connectivity? Have seen many an instance in Urban settings where people don't interact or know their neighbor any more than those in the burbs.

To each their own

I'm just one person, and not a study, obviously, but I've lived in a lot of different neighborhoods around OKC, including Nichols Hills and Deer Creek. The place I knew the least number of neighbors was Nichols Hills, where we barely spoke to the people living adjacent to us, much less near us. I know at least as many neighbors downtown as I have in any other neighborhood I'ved lived in, and there's far more stopping to chat with people you don't know downtown than anywhere else I've ever lived. Just walking by them on the street (I do have two very cute dogs, but I've walked dogs everywhere I've lived), I've met people from pretty much every living option north of Bricktown, as well as the Centennial. There's a downtown bowling league, Urban Neighbors is a great place to meet people....I feel very much less anonymous here than in most other neighborhoods. The exception was Deer Creek, where we had a new neighborhood and a neighborhood pool. We knew all of our neighbors, but there weren't very many. I got tired of the breathing room, the drive, and several acres to maintain very quickly.

[Spartan]

The Plaza District has a much larger percentage of retail. I think there's only one actual 'art gallery' there, which is the one owned by Don Narcomey. DNA calls itself a gallery, but also sells jewelry, t-shirts and such.

The Paseo, on the other hand, is primarily galleries and studios. There are some artists on the Paseo who would prefer to do no retail at all. They rented space to use strictly for studio work, not to sell their art on the premises.

The Plaza has more regular traffic to support retail, particularly pedestrians on the weekend. Paseo really doesn't, which is why it's a great restaurant/gallery district.

[flintysooner]

I found another image of Back Bay on Wiki that makes me happier because it shows more individuality and uniqueness in the brownstones.

[dedndcrusr]

I found another image of Back Bay on Wiki that makes me happier because it shows more individuality and uniqueness in the brownstones.

And I think you might agree now that back bay's housing is more architecturally significant than the typical suburban neighborhood. Those buildings look amazing.

[dmoor82]

^^And very,very expensive also and if anyone doesnt like The Back Bay from an ariel view,at street level it will blow you away!

[lovokc]

I'm just one person, and not a study, obviously, but I've lived in a lot of different neighborhoods around OKC, including Nichols Hills and Deer Creek. The place I knew the least number of neighbors was Nichols Hills, where we barely spoke to the people living adjacent to us, much less near us. I know at least as many neighbors downtown as I have in any other neighborhood I'ved lived in, and there's far more stopping to chat with people you don't know downtown than anywhere else I've ever lived. Just walking by them on the street (I do have two very cute dogs, but I've walked dogs everywhere I've lived), I've met people from pretty much every living option north of Bricktown, as well as the Centennial. There's a downtown bowling league, Urban Neighbors is a great place to meet people....I feel very much less anonymous here than in most other neighborhoods. The exception was Deer Creek, where we had a new neighborhood and a neighborhood pool. We knew all of our neighbors, but there weren't very many. I got tired of the breathing room, the drive, and several acres to maintain very quickly.

I don't deny what you say about Nichols Hills but I am surprised. I spent a few weeks last summer looking at homes there and I found everyone there so welcoming. I was disappointed my husband decided he wanted something with land.

[Dean-Brown]

I am having a hard time with the negative remarks about people living anywhere other than a city. I am not trying to pick a fight with anyone I am just posting MY Opinion so take it as such please.

You say that living in a suburban area is wasteful but I am buying my Vegetables from people that grow in my area, when available, they are parked on the side of SH152 in Mustang most weekends in the summer. I have septic so I am not contributing to waste treatment and when I can I buy Beef from a local supplier. Yes I have a truck, no its Mileage is not good, I bought it when I was contracting my new house, before that I owned a Prius and I plan to get something better now that we have moved into our new home.

The most wasteful place I have ever seen was Southern California, there was never enough housing people had to commute up to 3 hours 1 way because they could not find affordable housing closer than that.

My point is this, to have a healthy urban environment you have to have a healthy Suburban environment. One will not work without the other. They both feed off the other in population and resources.

The last part of the equation is this not everyone likes to be within an area that is densely populated, it makes them nerves. I have traveled to many cities my favorite so far is London but I don’t want to live there.

[Platemaker]

What makes them architecturally significant?

This seems like a joke of a question... you'd bde hard pressed to find anyone that would disagree that Back Bay was a architectural treasure trove .... grand rows townhouses, Trinity Church, the Boston Public Library, and New Old South Church..... all on a grand design with Paris as a model.

[Platemaker]

I wish I had a picture of it... but it looks like a fountain is being built in the middle of the Paseo in the island at 29th/Paseo. Does anyone know what this will look like when finished?