Proposed Fire Dept budget cuts

[Kerry]

LordGerald almighty, where have you been hiding? Let's look again at hours worked. Average Joe works 52 weeks, 40 hours a week. That equals 2080 hours a year. Firefighters are on one of three shifts. So they will work 1/3 of the time. That equals 2912 hours a year. So your snippy little quip is nothing more than a falsehood. Man, if your going to be a prick at least try to get the facts right.

I lost track of what this thread is about but I do want to correct this statement. Fire Fighters get paid for 2,912 hours and you are on duty during that time, but I wouldn't call most of that 2,912 hours 'work'. Correct me if I am wrong, but don't you have beds, a basketball court, video game systems, a workout room, and other recreational material. I have none of those things at work - and for good reason - I am usually always busy at work.

I know the firefighter job is hard so don't get me wrong. I also know you aren't fighting a fire for 24 straight hours everyday and not every call is a potential life-ending call. Pizza delivery guys 'work' more hours and die more often in the line of duty.

Out of curosity, how many alarms does the OKC fire department respond to in an average day? Is there anywhere to see a break down of call type?

[Mikemarsh51]

Kerry, how nice of you to pick a fight. First, Our contract states that we are paid an hourly wage. That wage is calulated by 2080 hours. I have no idea where you get that we are paid hour for hour. It is clearly worded that we are salaried employees. That the hours are discussed to give an indication of what the salary and benefits are worth. Funny thing is if you are late you have your wages reduced by the amount you are late. As far as I know, salaried employees are not docked minute for minute. Speak to any HR person and they will tell you salaried employees are not docked time like that. Secondly, The city understands it is better to have healthy employess and require us to exercise 1.5 hours per shift. This reduces stress and builds a healthy employee. The Fire department responds to an average of 218 calls per day. 297-3314 ask for the Fire Chief, he will tell you any thing you want to know.

Let me ask you this, let's say you went to work at 7 am and worked until 5 pm. You then were required to sit in the receptionist chair until the following 7 am. You didnt have to do anything just be there. How would you expect to be compensated? Are you saying you didnt work so you would do that for free? Are you saying well I was in the chair and I was trained to handled any thing that might have come up, I did go out in the parking lot and pick up a little old man who fell down. Bandaged him up, found his next of kin and got him sheltered. Was that work?

I am not saying we work every single minute while on duty. But I am at work for 24 hours per shift. 3 shifts equals 1/3 third of the time. 2080 is less than 1/4 of the time. Oh and by the way, I have had many days when I never saw a bed, let alone get in it.

[eef]

I have friends who work for the fire department. Before they thought it might be a good idea to keep it on the downlow I used to hear about how much free time they had. They work out, spend time online, cook fancy dinners for each other, play basketball. They all have second and third jobs in their free time and they live in super nice houses. They think they have the greatest job in the world. I'm having trouble seeing what all the griping is about unless firemen are losing their jobs. If that happens, then they're like the rest of the po folk out there who lost their jobs in this downturn.

[Kerry]

Mike - I wasn't picking a fight and I understand you need to be compensated for ‘just sitting there’ - it is more than just being on-call. My only point is that you are not actively engaged in fire-fighting duties all 24 hours of every shift and not every call is one you might not come home from (rare traffic accidents withstanding).

[rcjunkie]

rcjunkie, please refer to your previous posting, #84. Have you and Midtowner kissed, and made up? Does this mean you no longer consider him a jerk?

No making up on my part, and I must correct you, It's JERK, not jerk!!

Have a Great Day Andy and be safe!

[PennyQuilts]

There sure is a lot of testosterone in this thread.

[andy157]

No making up on my part, and I must correct you, It's JERK, not jerk!!

Have a Great Day Andy and be safe!

I hate to hear that, and I stand corrected, thanks.

[andy157]

There sure is a lot of testosterone in this thread.

It's a guy thing.

[Wambo36]

Mike - I wasn't picking a fight and I understand you need to be compensated for ‘just sitting there’ - it is more than just being on-call. My only point is that you are not actively engaged in fire-fighting duties all 24 hours of every shift

Not exactly sure what your getting at Kerry. I'm sure you have a point but your not making it very well. What is your solution to what you see as a problem. As Mikemarsh said the nights that I get to sleep all night at the sta. are far out numbered by the nights that I'm up at least part of the night if not most or all of it due to calls. And I work at what's considered a slow station. I couldn't tell you how many times I report to work at 7:00 a.m. and eat my first meal at around 8:00 p.m. during grass fire season. You seem to want a schedule for something that by its nature is unscheduled. I'm not sure what your solution is.

and not every call is one you might not come home from (rare traffic accidents withstanding).

While you seem to think traffic accidents are the most dangerous thing we face, maybe you need to talk to some of the guys who made a simple medical call only to leave exposed to infectious TB or worse. I had a friend who retired from one of the metro area fire departments after 25 years only to be diagnosed with a rare cancerous tumor 6 months later. By coincidence it was the same type of cancer some of his fellow workers and retirees had been diagnosed with also. You see 20 years earlier they had all been on the same semi-trailer fire that was being used to store pesticides and herbicides. He died less than a year after his diagnosis. I hope you don't think that just because we don't get run over on the highway or have a house or building collapse while we're fighting a fire in it that what we're doing doesn't carry some risk. It's of course calculated risk most of the time and we accept it as part of the job, but I'm not seeing where your coming from.

[Wambo36]

There sure is a lot of testosterone in this thread.

I hear you PQ. We're solving the worlds problems one at a time. It's a little slower process than I thought.

Hope your return has been everything you anticipated.

[Mikemarsh51]

eef, you can slice this anyway you want to. Those guys that talked about free time may not have been taking into account the fact that when you work a shift, you are working a day shift, night shift and a graveyard shift. Still it is 1/3 of the time. 9 to 5 people work less than 1/4 of the time.

[Mikemarsh51]

Kerry, I got to agree with Wambo, I have no idea what your trying to say. Maybe you need Midtowner to explain it to you so you can pass it along to the rest of us.

[PennyQuilts]

I hear you PQ. We're solving the worlds problems one at a time. It's a little slower process than I thought.

Hope your return has been everything you anticipated.

It has been wonderful, thank you - so glad to be home.

Carry on, boys. Heads must be butted.

[kevinpate]

... Heads must be butted.

It's when they get all versa vicea that it' ain't purty.

[andy157]

It's when they get all versa vicea that it' ain't purty.

I have to agree, butted heads aint purty.

[andy157]

Several misconceptions in this thread that anyone with a newspaper subscription could rebut:

As has been written in the newspaper, the Fire Chief was asked to propose how he would make a 12 percent cut in FY 2011. It’s the Council’s prerogative to use the MAPS 3 use tax, so that he doesn’t have to make any cuts in the end, but he’s not in a position to count on that at this point in the process, so he has to propose cuts. But, it’s been well-documented in the paper that the Council does not intend to make any public safety cuts, thanks to the MAPS 3 use tax. The only remaining debate is whether the MAPS 3 use tax will also be used to increase the public safety staffing, as the Mayor proposed, but that’s not the issue at hand. Bottom line - there has been multiple public assurances by Mayor and Council that there will not be cuts to public safety in FY2010 or 2011, and there is no evidence yet to the contrary.

The idea that people need to start worrying about jumps in their home insurance costs over public safety cuts that aren’t happening is just silly.

Someone asked how use tax that hasn’t been collected yet can offset FY 2010 public safety cuts. Money is fungible, and the City does have a cash reserve. They can dip into that and then replenish it with the use tax when it is collected. Or a line of credit with minimal interest can be taken out, as with the Ford Center project. Not that big of a deal.

The Ford Center project is coming in under revenue estimates, but it’s also coming in under cost estimates. The hole really isn’t going to be that big. The idea that MAPS 3 contingency money will be used to fill the Ford Center hole is silly. That money won’t be available for years, and obviously it will likely be needed for MAPS 3. That’s why it was put there.

Then how will the hole be filled?

[kevinpate]

Then how will the hole be filled?

Same way the state does, take it from somewhere else.
Not so long ago, the highway patrol was noting that without relief, the last quarter of state fy would see them on 4 day a month furloughs.

That's already a non-issue if I recall right, but they had to plan for it all the same, just in case it wasn't. And they had to make it known to the folks who could do something about it in time for something to be done.

Not filling vacancies, foregoing raises and not repairing necessary stuff or replacing stuff can't cut the mustard forever. Sounds like OKC may be pretty close to that point, if not past it.

[Wambo36]

Several misconceptions in this thread that anyone with a newspaper subscription could rebut:

The idea that people need to start worrying about jumps in their home insurance costs over public safety cuts that aren’t happening is just silly.

You'll have to excuse us for believing what's being put out by the people who run the city. Unless the name "CaptainCouch" is code for Jim Couch, I'm not sure why we should put more stock in what your saying than in what he's saying. He made it pretty clear in the news story last night that there will be cuts coming. They've even hired outside legal help to make sure of it.