Proposed Fire Dept budget cuts

[Mikemarsh51]

12% budget cuts from OKC fire Chief to to city council. Close fire stas. 3, 4, 11, 28. Rigs out of svc- E3, E4, E11, E28, E51, RL9, RL14, RL18, BP15, BP20, BP23, BP25, TK35, TK37. 141 total FF gone. Please pass this on to your friends and family in OKC. Call City Councilpersons

[Midtowner]

MAPS 3 isn't even being collected yet. If MAPS3 monies could fix this problem, it could only be done through the issuance of bonds, which I believe is not even possible due to the way MAPS is structured. Anyhow, one thing has diddly squat to do with the other.

Again with the non sequitur.

You just won't quit with that BS, will you?

[PLANSIT]

12% budget cuts from OKC fire Chief to to city council. Close fire stas. 3, 4, 11, 28. Rigs out of svc- E3, E4, E11, E28, E51, RL9, RL14, RL18, BP15, BP20, BP23, BP25, TK35, TK37. 141 total FF gone. MAPS3 was suppose to help these things. Please pass this on to your friends and family in OKC. Call City Councilpersons

It's 12% across the board. Every city department is cutting. Deal with it.

BTW, We haven't collected any money or built anything for MAPS3 yet.

[bkm645]

Why don't we wait to cut jobs until the budget is passed for next year? I have a suspicion that the fire and police department will not get a full 12% cut from the budget. They will probably take some of the use tax from MAPS 3 like they already promised to do so they can pay for public safety.

Also, check out this article for what has actually happened so far: NewsOK.

[andy157]

Why don't we wait to cut jobs until the budget is passed for next year? I have a suspicion that the fire and police department will not get a full 12% cut from the budget. They will probably take some of the use tax from MAPS 3 like they already promised to do so they can pay for public safety.

Also, check out this article for what has actually happened so far: NewsOK.

It looks as though they are already spending M3 money to save F & P positions in the Mid-year budget cuts. Thats what the article says. Does it not? I don't know how that can be.

[BigD Misey]

It looks as though they are already spending M3 money to save F & P positions in the Mid-year budget cuts. Thats what the article says. Does it not? I don't know how that can be.

Cool! I didn't realize maps 3 has a 17 mill contingency built in. Just went to City of Oklahoma City | Public Information & Marketing and looks like it is. If the city has any kind of shortfall it appearantly can use these funds for whatever they need to. I'd say that would classify. Hope this helps.

[Wambo36]

MAPS 3 isn't even being collected yet. If MAPS3 monies could fix this problem, it could only be done through the issuance of bonds, which I believe is not even possible due to the way MAPS is structured. Anyhow, one thing has diddly squat to do with the other.

Again with the non sequitur.

You just won't quit with that BS, will you?

Unless I'm missing something, you're the first one to mention MAPS. Why would that be?

[Mikemarsh51]

Big D Misey, that contingency fund is equal to the amount they are short on the practice arena, coincidence, I think not!

[Wambo36]

Mike, unfortunately cuts that deep into coverage and manpower will drop our ISO rating and the first anyone will know about it is when their property insurance jumps. Hopefully the city will have answers for the citizens who will have to find a way to "deal with it" as Plansit so artfully puts it.

[kevinpate]

It looks as though they are already spending M3 money to save F & P positions in the Mid-year budget cuts. Thats what the article says. Does it not? I don't know how that can be.

I think the article is incorrect andy. hard to spend funds which do not yet exist. Perhaps the existing use tax funds? Or, perhaps the council decided that it would use M3 use tax funds (which aren't actually M3 funds at all, but companion funds, once they come available. the funds will come available in the current FY, just not there yet.

Can't really tell from the article.

[okcsmokeandfire]

Mike, unfortunately cuts that deep into coverage and manpower will drop our ISO rating and the first anyone will know about it is when their property insurance jumps. Hopefully the city will have answers for the citizens who will have to find a way to "deal with it" as Plansit so artfully puts it.

Its ironic, that you would mention property insurance, because several of the listed cuts are the only way some of these homeowners are getting insurance in the first place.

Ex.

TK-35 on the Southside, TK-37 on the Northside. Station 3 northside, Station 28 SE OKC, not to mention Station 4, which was being relocated to far NE OKC, but apparently not any more.

If you live in rural area that does not have any fire hydrants, those heavy tankers and stations are the only reason that you are getting reasonable property insurance rates.

If they go, good luck on getting insurance.

By the way, I am one of the tax paying citizens that will be directly affected by the increase of property insurance. I am sure you have sympathy. lol

I guess I will have to start digging up my coffee cans that are buried in the backyard. They are stuffed completely full with millions of dollars I have made over the last 20 years of being a firefighter. lol

Good luck

[kevinpate]

Big D Misey, that contingency fund is equal to the amount they are short on the practice arena, coincidence, I think not!

Try thinking instead of thinking not. One is not related to the other.
While you have some decent arguments on other fronts, it might be better to not strip your credibility by dancing after an unrelated issue that's a non-starter.

[kevinpate]

Why don't we wait to cut jobs until the budget is passed for next year? I have a suspicion that the fire and police department will not get a full 12% cut from the budget. They will probably take some of the use tax from MAPS 3 like they already promised to do so they can pay for public safety.

Also, check out this article for what has actually happened so far: NewsOK.

As tot he 12% projected cuts, that is for the next budget. As for the current job cuts, which are not F & P, can't wait to address a this FY revenue shortfall because, well, it's happening in the current FY.

[kevinpate]

FWIW, when a call goes out to make major cuts, the stated cuts are not always what would actually be cut. Sometimes, and I canna say yea or nay in this particular instance, worst case scenario presentations can help catch the right eyes or assist with creating the political will to avoid draconian cuts.

Until collections increase though, business as usual can not continue. Either revenue stream gets increased, or expenses get reduced, or a combination of the two.

[Mikemarsh51]

Kevinpate, You have to be kidding. Those contingency funds of Maps3 are absolutely going to be used to finish Maps for the Ford center. They are currently somewhere over 12 million short. Or if it sounds better, when that tax collection ends on March 31st they are going to need over 12 million of that contingency money. I don't have a problem with it. I was only pointing out to Big D Misey that most of what he was refering to was spoken for.

[Mikemarsh51]

We are hoping the ship will be righted by the new budget. A little birdy told me that sales tax collections for Jan 2010 are not near as bad, so we may be turning a corner.

[kevinpate]

... Those contingency funds of Maps3 are absolutely going to be used to finish Maps for the Ford center. ...

From inferred coincidence to absolutely, and in nothing flat.
Oh well, it is after all your credibility to thrash as you elect.

As to your prognostic accuracy, I find it doubtful enough I simply can't hop on your racing little conspiracy wagon, but hey, who knows. Perhaps I'll be eating crow somewhere down the road. if so, I wonder if I could get the BoBo folks to smoke it up and then fry it for me. Baked crow would be just awful.

[Wambo36]

By the way, I am one of the tax paying citizens that will be directly affected by the increase of property insurance. I am sure you have sympathy. lol

I guess I will have to start digging up my coffee cans that are buried in the backyard. They are stuffed completely full with millions of dollars I have made over the last 20 years of being a firefighter. lol

Good luck

I feel your pain. I live in 28's district. Funny thing is, if the wife hadn''t fallen in love with this spot and I could've talked her into building 1 mile further north, my homeowner insurance would already be between $800 to $1000 cheaper per year. Now, with these cuts, it's going to go up from there.

Where do you live okcfireandsmoke? I might have to come dig up one of your cans too.

[LakeEffect]

We are hoping the ship will be righted by the new budget. A little birdy told me that sales tax collections for Jan 2010 are not near as bad, so we may be turning a corner.

Little birdie? It's at the end of a recent Council agenda. Sales tax was only down 12% from the same period last year... so the decrease is decreasing (if that makes sense).

The practice arena was actually much cheaper than anticipated. From what I've learned, the City is proposing a variety of cuts to the renovation package to make up for the overall shortfall in the sales tax collection for the Ford Center...

[Midtowner]

Unless I'm missing something, you're the first one to mention MAPS. Why would that be?

He edited his post as soon as he realized how wrong it was... or something. The edit is as good as an admission of that.

See the original:

Originally Posted by Mikemarsh51
12% budget cuts from OKC fire Chief to to city council. Close fire stas. 3, 4, 11, 28. Rigs out of svc- E3, E4, E11, E28, E51, RL9, RL14, RL18, BP15, BP20, BP23, BP25, TK35, TK37. 141 total FF gone. MAPS3 was suppose to help these things. Please pass this on to your friends and family in OKC. Call City Councilpersons

[Mikemarsh51]

Midtowner that was my bad, thanks for helping me get it right.

[BigD Misey]

I'm sorry if i'm misreading it, but the article referenced above by kevinpate, quoting bkmb545, said in part:


Midyear budget cuts approved Tuesday by the Oklahoma City Council will mean 37 fewer jobs and reduced services, and will require the city to dip into its contingency funds.
-and-
All departments were asked to cut 2 percent from their budgets, although council members dipped into MAPS 3 use taxes to prevent layoffs for police and firefighters.

I may be reading that wrong, but isn't it saying the city dipped into the Contingency money collected off of taxes to prevent a higher percentage of cuts?
Help me out here!

[betts]

I'm not really sure why it's the city's duty to decrease people's property insurance. I actually think the city should be deannexing these rural areas. If people want to sprawl, let them do so outside of the city limits. I find it hard to believe that the property taxes being collected in underpopulated areas equals the cost of providing city services. I lived in Deer Creek for awhile, and we had to pay for fire protection out of our own pocket at the time. I figured it was the cost of choosing to live out in the boondocks. I got really tired of the drive, really quickly, and acreage is vastly overrated, IMO.

[Wambo36]

I'm not really sure why it's the city's duty to decrease people's property insurance. I actually think the city should be deannexing these rural areas. If people want to sprawl, let them do so outside of the city limits. I find it hard to believe that the property taxes being collected in underpopulated areas equals the cost of providing city services. I lived in Deer Creek for awhile, and we had to pay for fire protection out of our own pocket at the time. I figured it was the cost of choosing to live out in the boondocks. I got really tired of the drive, really quickly, and acreage is vastly overrated, IMO.

Ah Betts, they're not decreasing them. They're working on increasing them. I'd be happy if they'd just leave them alone. A quick history lesson; the area I live in tried to deannex from OKC several years ago. They had one problem. The city of OKC fought them tooth and nail. Apparently they don't share your view on property taxes on us boondocks folks.

I see your point. If they're going to decrease our already thin coverage let us annex into a municipality willing to do better. Unfortunately that's not how our city leaders do things.

Maybe if your through getting our medical director straightened out you can pop on over to city hall and get this city limits thing straightened out. Oh by the way, it's not just the people in the rural areas that will be affected, the ISO rating is city wide. It will affect everyone if it comes to pass.

[betts]

If it does, it does. If my insurance goes up, perhaps I'm saving somewhere else. I'm not through getting your medical director straightened out. I'm working on it, but I've got multiple irons in the fire, which is why I'm up at this time of night. I don't have time to play basketball,cook a lovely meal for my compatriots at work or buy banana splits for the group if the ball ends up on the roof, and I've got limited time to deal with your medical director. When I bump into him in the hallway at work, I'm going to get the conversation started.

I agree, you should be able to deannex, as long as that means the city has no obligations to the deannexed areas, and as long as they are on the outskirts. That's probably beyond my knowledge or capabilities to correct, however.