I Have Seen the Future of Crossroads Mall

[ljbab728]

Read post #9 again, assisted living center was mentioned.

You're correct. I did miss that and for an assisted living center that price is normal. I still say that there isn't the demand for anything of that size in OKC especially on the South side. Turning that site into an assisted living center would be the largest facility of that kind in the city by far.

[ljbab728]

There actually is a demand for that kind of housing. The only problem is the majority of South OKC's Seniors are/were working class people that do not have the kind of money that exists in other areas of the city. It is kind of hard to build a nest egg when you raise your grandchildren or spend your money bailing your kids out of trouble at every turn.

Turning Crossroads to a residential layout would be costly. From what I understand the mall is in need of electrical, plumbing and drainange upgrades that Maerich neglected to complete. They just paid for quick fix repairs over the years.

Saying the South side seniors can't afford something because they're bailing their kids out of trouble almost amounts to slander. It's a gross overstatement at the least. Lower income people don't have a monopoly on children who get in trouble. Just look at Ernest Istook's son.

[fredfredburger]

Saying the South side seniors can't afford something because they're bailing their kids out of trouble almost amounts to slander. It's a gross overstatement at the least. Lower income people don't have a monopoly on children who get in trouble. Just look at Ernest Istook's son.

But he's not black.

[rcjunkie]

But he's not black.

The color of ones skin has nothing to do with the topic of this thread. Comments like this only show ones ignorance and/or stupidity.

[fredfredburger]

The color of ones skin has nothing to do with the topic of this thread. Comments like this only show ones ignorance and/or stupidity.

huh? I thought we were talking about crossroads mall?

[rcjunkie]

huh? I thought we were talking about crossroads mall?

We are, so again I ask, what does the color of ones skin have to do with Crossroads. You not implying that your racist or at the very least a bigot.

[Kerry]

We are, so again I ask, what does the color of ones skin have to do with Crossroads. You not implying that your racist or at the very least a bigot.

Based on his posting in some other threads I think FredFred has some 'race and class' issues going on.

[silvergrove]

Then build then new racetrack there.

I like the idea, would it be feasible though? Are there a lot of neighborhoods around that mall that would complain about the noise of a racetrack? It's near a highway anyways.

[Spartan]

... and a dumb thread continues to degenerate. Imagine that.

[ljbab728]

... and a dumb thread continues to degenerate. Imagine that.

I agree and when Fred begins to add his comments that always seems to happen because everyone is so outraged.

[westsidesooner]

I like the idea, would it be feasible though? Are there a lot of neighborhoods around that mall that would complain about the noise of a racetrack? It's near a highway anyways.

Thats the only reason I mentioned a racetrack in that part of town.....It'll never happen of course, but theres not a lot of substantial residential areas within a mile of the mall.....same reason the mall failed. The only other use I can think of for a space like that would be a comuter college.

[ljbab728]

Thats the only reason I mentioned a racetrack in that part of town.....It'll never happen of course, but theres not a lot of substantial residential areas within a mile of the mall.....same reason the mall failed. The only other use I can think of for a space like that would be a comuter college.

With Oscar Rose and South OKC so easily reached from there that's not going to happen.

[Bunty]

Not all enclosed malls are "out of it". I go to Penn Square regularly and it's always busy. I was at Quail on Saturday and close in parking wasn't going to happen. I do qualify for handicap parking and got lucky. I visit some of the newer outdoor centers also and parking isn't any better, espcially if you want to go to more than one store. They may eventually have the same problem but for now they seem to be doing fine.

Yeah, you're right and Spartan is wrong. Just one look at Penn Square offers plenty of proof how wrong he is. The main reason they're not building enclosed shopping malls any more is simply because the already existing ones like Penn Square and Quail Springs are doing a good job filling in the need for them. The metro market is only so big to support such huge commercial complexes.

[westsidesooner]

With Oscar Rose and South OKC so easily reached from there that's not going to happen.

I know.....but for the life of me I can't think of what they'd use that much space for. Theres already call centers in other malls, a prison is out of the question, Maybe a convention space but with a new convention center in downtown I can't see that either....how about an indoor amusement/theme park with water slides, theatre, restaurants, kidzone. Attach a hotel and make it a giant great wold lodge. The area around Crossroads doesn't help much. Maybe someday Tinker will take it over. I have no idea. Maybe a monument to the indoor mall craze of the 70's. That would be depressing.

[ljbab728]

I just watched a one hour show on Cox channel 740 called "Mall Mania". It's a very good review of the history, current happenings, and future of malls. It could give local investors some very good ideas.

[smooth]

I just watched a one hour show on Cox channel 740 called "Mall Mania". It's a very good review of the history, current happenings, and future of malls. It could give local investors some very good ideas.

For those people who don't have high definition access, would you please reveal the network instead of the channel?

[ljbab728]

Unfortunately, it's only on a high defintion channel called HD Theater or HDTHR.

[smooth]

Unfortunately, it's only on a high definition channel called HD Theater or HDTHR.

Thank you. The channel is irrelevant. The NETWORK is what is important. You were probably the only one that knew it was High Definition only.

[megax11]

Are you serious? Why do you have this desire to bring back Crossroads Mall? Many things wrong with that idea. First of all, Crossroads is dead because the location is bad. A better proposal to bring the mall back would be to pick it up and move it to Moore. Even then it would continue to struggle because indoor shopping malls are dinosaurs. No one is building them any more, no one is going to them anymore, and stores are no longer adding locations in indoor shopping malls for the most part. That's probably the #1 shift in city planning trends that has occurred over the last 10 years.

And second of all and more importantly, even if you wanted to bring it back, why? Crossroads disappearing frees up retail demand for downtown retail, and more importantly, for inner southside retail to make a comeback. If you have followed the history of the southside as much as I have, as a southsider myself, you'd know that Capitol Hill and other inner southside strips used to be vibrant retail areas--right up until when Crossroads Mall came. Crossroads sucked the life out of the southside. Now it's gone, now the southside can make a comeback.

And all of those things you proposed--a Medieval Dinner Theatre, a Dave and Busters, a Books a Million, an 18 screen theater (which Crossroads already has, also going to go out of business soon)--why can't these things go some place better than Crossroads? I'm sorry but this is like the worst idea I have ever heard, in my life.

Is that fact, or opinion?

See I have facts from tons of people in the mall. Everyone from the PR lady, to merchants from stores long gone, and none of them said the mall died, because of booby-baby gangbangers, or an overall bad location.

They all said a number of things, and all said the same.

1. The person(s) owning the mall charged too much rent.

2. The merchants asked for the place to be fixed up more to attract customers with a more lively mall... They were either ignored, or flat out told, "no."

With floors from 1974, and the only thing having been beefed up and modernized, was the ceiling of the mall, what did you expect?

I mean Quail was all brown and ugle, until it got its makeover. Now look at the mall. 50's style food court (the mall actually HAS a food court unlike Crossroads,) and even a movie theatre inside.

If Crossroads fixed itself up, you damn well better be sure that place would draw crowds again.

Believe it or not, imposing a curfew doesn't help either, as gangbanger or not, the youth probably had some money to take to the mall to spend.

The location can't be the reason, and isn't according to almost everybody in the mall, because then the mall wouldn't have flourished since 1974, up until around 2003/4.

It was greed that killed the beast. The owners wanted to line their pockets, while not listening to the merchants wishes, that lead to its downfall. You got to stay with the times, but that mall stayed in the 70's/80's, thanks to its look, and people want lively scenery, not dreary browns.

[oneforone]

Thank you. The channel is irrelevant. The NETWORK is what is important. You were probably the only one that knew it was High Definition only.

HD Theater is owned by Discovery Networks. Unfortantely, most of the programming is Hi-Def only. Although HD Theater does show many Discovery, TLC and Science Channel shows there is no standard network broadcast for shows like Mall Mania and many others because they are one time shows and not series.

One of my favorites was Mustangs Across America. It was about a group of Mustang enthusiast driving from Las Vegas to Birmingham, AL. They made a stop in Mustang where they attended a city party and chili cook off. The show made many postive notes on Mustang and showed the beautiful landscape of I-40 between OKC and Amarillo.


http://mustangsacrossamerica.com/

[Bunty]

Well, what's happening is that Penn Square and Quail Springs is putting Crossroads thru the same thing now as Crossroads did to Shepherd Mall during the 70s and 80s.

[smooth]

Well, what's happening is that Penn Square and Quail Springs is putting Crossroads thru the same thing now as Crossroads did to Shepherd Mall during the 70s and 80s.

No. The thing happening to Crossroads is housing additions that, for the most part, were still in good shape and safe when the mall was built but now border on being slums, gang bangers running off most of the law abiding customers, major construction which closed the area for a couple of years (and will again), and owners that are like the majority of companies in the fact they could care less about you... Just how much they can line their pockets (no major remodeling or expansion).

[mburlison]

It's simple, sell the land to a Native American nation and make a Casino out of it.

[Larry OKC]

It's simple, sell the land to a Native American nation and make a Casino out of it.

Its not that simple. While it certainly can be sold to a tribe, for it to be a Casino, the land has to be put into trust (a Federal thing). There are a lot of regulations and not just any tribe could get a casino opened in that location. The way I understand it, there has to be a historical claim to that piece of land by that particular tribe. Looks like that area was unassigned.

The whole land in trust/historical claim is one of the snags the tribe that was originally wanting to open a casino in Bricktown and now near Remington Park/Frontier City is running into. They are the Shawnee tribe (not to be confused with the town of Shawnee and the Casinos owned/operated by the Citizen Potawatomi). The tribe that is trying to get the casino built here, their headquarters "is nearly 200 miles [away]...in far northeastern Oklahoma" (from an opposition letter signed by Senators Inhofe, Coburn, Representative Fallin and Mayor Cornett).

Just to confuse things further, if you can get a non-tribal casino built and then sell it to a tribe, that seems to be OK (see Remington Park and the Chickasaw Nation)

[Kerry]

Just to confuse things further, if you can get a non-tribal casino built and then sell it to a tribe, that seems to be OK (see Remington Park and the Chickasaw Nation)

I don't think that particular example has anything to do with the casino at Remington Park being an Indian casino. There is unique legislation about a casino at horese racing track that has nothing to do with who the owner is.