Public safety #1

[rcjunkie]

Hell yes this is a great society we live in where the 3 of us can form our personal opinions. What makes it much better still is the fact that we can base our opinions how ever we want, on what ever we want. What makes it even better still is, if we can find even one person willing to hear our opinions, with just a few exceptions, we can voice those opinions darn near anywhere we please. God Bless America.

However, in my opinion, with his ability to comprehend at a much higher level than you possess, it makes Mr. Couch's opinion an educated one based upon facts. Whereas your less educated opinion is nothing more than what it is. Which in my opinion is an uneducated opinion. And remember, a sharp mower blade, is a happy mower blade.

I'm sure Mr. Couch would be happy to hear your ringing endorsement.

Budget: look/cut/spend wisely.

Remember, a clean and shiny truck is a happy truck and a greased pole wont hurt your hands.

[Wambo36]

I'm sure Mr. Couch would be happy to hear your ringing endorsement.

Budget: look/cut/spend wisely.

Remember, a clean and shiny truck is a happy truck and a greased pole wont hurt your hands.

No but a greased pole will lead to broken ankles, torn up knees or much worse. This is pretty much basic common sense but hey, with your vast knowledge of the inner workings of the ole FD, surely you knew that. I'm beginning to wonder since this is the second time you posted it in your sign off. You weren't in charge of safety at the parks dept. were you?

[andy157]

I'm sure Mr. Couch would be happy to hear your ringing endorsement.

Budget: look/cut/spend wisely.

Remember, a clean and shiny truck is a happy truck and a greased pole wont hurt your hands.

Hey likewise. Remember you started this conversation by pointing out his higher level of education as well as his superior knowledge. You know when I first read that I thought to myself...this guy is retired, what is he sucking up to Couch for...but I thought, nah, surely not. Now your talking about "greased poles" hmmm I don't know. Lets just say I'll take your word on the greased pole thing, and leave it at that.

[rcjunkie]

Hey likewise. Remember you started this conversation by pointing out his higher level of education as well as his superior knowledge. You know when I first read that I thought to myself...this guy is retired, what is he sucking up to Couch for...but I thought, nah, surely not. Now your talking about "greased poles" hmmm I don't know. Lets just say I'll take your word on the greased pole thing, and leave it at that.

I'm not sure about the greased poles myself, must be a fireman thing!!


Budget: look/cut/spend wisely

[rcjunkie]

No but a greased pole will lead to broken ankles, torn up knees or much worse. This is pretty much basic common sense but hey, with your vast knowledge of the inner workings of the ole FD, surely you knew that. I'm beginning to wonder since this is the second time you posted it in your sign off. You weren't in charge of safety at the parks dept. were you?

Sounds like your talking from experience. Did you file a workers comp claim, how long were you off work, any long term disability, did you return ASAP, or did you milk the system.

Have a Good Day, I'm headed out on the Lake, trying to catch lunch/dinner.

Budget: look/cut/spend wisely

[David]

Get a room you three!

[andy157]

[QUOTE=rcjunkie;293279]andy, you can stop by your local Walmart and pick up a cheap calculator for less than $5.00 (being that your so under paid, I'll buy you one if needed), the average park employee makes no where near $71,000. If you feel a new calculator isn't required, sharpen your your pencil or stop using that fuzzy math.

"check your budget, cut where you can, spend wisely"[/QU

I have plenty of calculators so I don't feel as though I require an additional one at this time. However, in lieu of you spending a portion of your vast wealth(you must have Zillions considering you have a mansion on Lake Tenkiller) on a calculator I'll just take the 5 bucks. That would really help me out by reducing my begging time by an hour or two.

The City's allotment from it's General Fund for the Personal Services expenditures (if you don't know what that means look on page 54 of the FY/09-10 budget for a definition) for the 203 Parks and Recreation Department employees is $14,435,075. Using these factors see if you can determine what the average cost per employee would be.

Now, if you are having a hard time understanding third grade math and it seems a little fuzzy then you might want to spend that $5.00 on a math tutor for some remedial math training, if so I'll understand. If not then let me know and I'll try to walk you through the process.

[andy157]

Get a room you three!

This homey don't play that game, and it's safe to say Wambo don't either, beyond that I can't say.

[rcjunkie]

[QUOTE=andy157;293701]

andy, you can stop by your local Walmart and pick up a cheap calculator for less than $5.00 (being that your so under paid, I'll buy you one if needed), the average park employee makes no where near $71,000. If you feel a new calculator isn't required, sharpen your your pencil or stop using that fuzzy math.

"check your budget, cut where you can, spend wisely"[/QU

I have plenty of calculators so I don't feel as though I require an additional one at this time. However, in lieu of you spending a portion of your vast wealth(you must have Zillions considering you have a mansion on Lake Tenkiller) on a calculator I'll just take the 5 bucks. That would really help me out by reducing my begging time by an hour or two.

The City's allotment from it's General Fund for the Personal Services expenditures (if you don't know what that means look on page 54 of the FY/09-10 budget for a definition) for the 203 Parks and Recreation Department employees is $14,435,075. Using these factors see if you can determine what the average cost per employee would be.

Now, if you are having a hard time understanding third grade math and it seems a little fuzzy then you might want to spend that $5.00 on a math tutor for some remedial math training, if so I'll understand. If not then let me know and I'll try to walk you through the process.

Checks in the mail---you do have a checking account don't you or should I send cash.

Do you seriously think that salary is the only thing that comes from Personal Services Expenditures---are you sure you passed the written tests for the Fire Department or did someone sneak you in the back door. Someday I'll explain how to read and understand the budget manual.
As for getting a room with andy and wambo, it wouldn't work, I'm 6'4 and weigh 260, their ego's are are least twice that size, I don't know of any rooms that big.

Well got to go, I let my cook and butler have the day off, have to fix my own dinner.

Take care, be safe and God Bless!!

"Keep the trucks shiny and don't slide down any dry poles"

BUDGET: look,cut,spend wisely

[andy157]

[QUOTE=rcjunkie;293742]

Checks in the mail---you do have a checking account don't you or should I send cash.

Do you seriously think that salary is the only thing that comes from Personal Services Expenditures---are you sure you passed the written tests for the Fire Department or did someone sneak you in the back door. Someday I'll explain how to read and understand the budget manual.
As for getting a room with andy and wambo, it wouldn't work, I'm 6'4 and weigh 260, their ego's are are least twice that size, I don't know of any rooms that big.

Well got to go, I let my cook and butler have the day off, have to fix my own dinner.

Take care, be safe and God Bless!!

"Keep the trucks shiny and don't slide down any dry poles"

BUDGET: look,cut,spend wisely

Considering I directed you to the page where the definintion of Personal Services could be found, I think I have a pretty clear understanding as to it's obligations, so I don't believe I will require you to provide any further explaination. Let me type this real slow..using these factors see if you can determine what the average COST per employee would be.

[okcsmokeandfire]

Andy, Mike, Wambo, you guys are wasting your time verbally sparring with RC. He is set in his beliefs and its obvious he is not willing to hear much less understand anyone elses opinion or facts.

He is entitled to have his opinions just as we are. So why dont we let this guy enjoy his retirement from the city.

Lets move on and try to educate someone that would like to know the facts about the fire service, not someone who is looking to drag us down.

Lets agree to disagree and move on.

[rcjunkie]

Andy, Mike, Wambo, you guys are wasting your time verbally sparring with RC. He is set in his beliefs and its obvious he is not willing to hear much less understand anyone elses opinion or facts.

He is entitled to have his opinions just as we are. So why dont we let this guy enjoy his retirement from the city.

Lets move on and try to educate someone that would like to know the facts about the fire service, not someone who is looking to drag us down.

Lets agree to disagree and move on.

Come on now okcsmokeandfire, don't spoil the fun, I love a challenge, well maybe your right, it's not much of a challenge. I guess you three can hide under a rock until the next election.

BUDGET: look,cut,spend wisely

[rcjunkie]

[QUOTE=andy157;293770]

Considering I directed you to the page where the definintion of Personal Services could be found, I think I have a pretty clear understanding as to it's obligations, so I don't believe I will require you to provide any further explaination. Let me type this real slow..using these factors see if you can determine what the average COST per employee would be.

Your the man andy, you showed me didn't you. You have got to be a fairly new hire, and it's obvious your not involved with budget preparation because you have no idea what's covered under Personal Services. We have been discussing AVERAGE ANNUAL SALARY NOT AVERAGE ANNUAL COST. Personal Services Budget covers more than just salary, so dividing this budget amount by the number of employees tells you absolutely nothing.
I give up, one of the reason's I retired was because I got tired of dealing with mental midgets, I refuse to do it now.

BUDGET: look, cut, spend wisley

[Chef]

rcjunkiefirst of all I would like to know what part of Tenkiller do you go to. I have been going for 53 years(Strayhorn Landing for me). If we ever meet at the lake I'll by the first cold one. I will tell you we have different views on this subject. I have been reading this post daily. I was unable to locate the page about the city having an 85 million dollar rainy fund. You seem to know how the budget process works. Are you aware the the city is only required by law I believe to place 2% of its budget in the rainy day fund. The city council a few years back voted to increase that to 10%. They did that for the tough times we are in. I ask you why do think they are not going to pull from the rainy day fund to help all departments within the city.

[Mikemarsh51]

Chef, the quote was from Jim Couch about the $823,000,000.00 budget being approved. He stated the we had approx. 11% of that in fund balances. Fire union president Phil Sipe stated that at a $14,000,000.00 monthly shortfall that money would be gone rather quickly. The idea would not fix any problems, just put off the inevidable.

[andy157]

[QUOTE=rcjunkie;293801]

Your the man andy, you showed me didn't you. You have got to be a fairly new hire, and it's obvious your not involved with budget preparation because you have no idea what's covered under Personal Services. We have been discussing AVERAGE ANNUAL SALARY NOT AVERAGE ANNUAL COST. Personal Services Budget covers more than just salary, so dividing this budget amount by the number of employees tells you absolutely nothing.
I give up, one of the reason's I retired was because I got tired of dealing with mental midgets, I refuse to do it now.

BUDGET: look, cut, spend wisley

Thanks, I'll take that as a compliment. I'm not sure we, as in you and I have been discussing average annual salary, since I've not used that term.

For me it has always been about Personal Services. I should have been more clear, and I'm sorry you didn't understand. Your right, I had no idea that when I used the term earned and/or make that you took that to mean only the salary portion.

I wrongfully took for granted that you knew I was referring to wages and benifits which are categorized as Personal Service expenditures according to the M.B.A. My bad.

[andy157]

rcjunkiefirst of all I would like to know what part of Tenkiller do you go to. I have been going for 53 years(Strayhorn Landing for me). If we ever meet at the lake I'll by the first cold one. I will tell you we have different views on this subject. I have been reading this post daily. I was unable to locate the page about the city having an 85 million dollar rainy fund. You seem to know how the budget process works. Are you aware the the city is only required by law I believe to place 2% of its budget in the rainy day fund. The city council a few years back voted to increase that to 10%. They did that for the tough times we are in. I ask you why do think they are not going to pull from the rainy day fund to help all departments within the city.

Chef, I believe if you will look back at post #54 Steve's explaination as to the City's justification for not using more of the fund balance will answer your question.

[rcjunkie]

rcjunkiefirst of all I would like to know what part of Tenkiller do you go to. I have been going for 53 years(Strayhorn Landing for me). If we ever meet at the lake I'll by the first cold one. I will tell you we have different views on this subject. I have been reading this post daily. I was unable to locate the page about the city having an 85 million dollar rainy fund. You seem to know how the budget process works. Are you aware the the city is only required by law I believe to place 2% of its budget in the rainy day fund. The city council a few years back voted to increase that to 10%. They did that for the tough times we are in. I ask you why do think they are not going to pull from the rainy day fund to help all departments within the city.

A cold one sounds good!!

I have a cabin and 10 acres abut 1/2 mile from Barnacle Bills. Do you have property at Strayhorn or use camp grounds.

I think the decision to increase the funding of the rainy day fund to 10% was a very wise move, and the present Council/Mayor, has made some changes that have served to lesson the impact of the recent economy situation. All this talk about all of the Maps programs not bringing in the additional revenue people claimed it would are way off base, could you imagine where the City would be without the tax/revenue benefits from the previous Maps programs. To gain a clear picture, one just has to look at Tulsa to understand what could have happened to OKC and it's employees.

Have a Great Day

[Mikemarsh51]

Junkie, you need to watch Fox25 because OKC's budget director was on last night saying that the 12% budget cut he is calling for will call for the loss of an equal amount of employees that Tulsa is about to lose. He also stated he had been telling the city council this for over a year. Both Police and Fire reps were asked if this was true. Both stated it was and the city knew it but never discussed it because they wanted to get Maps3 passed. Check out Fox25.


Go to Youtube

Maps 3 after the vote services are being slashed

[rcjunkie]

Junkie, you need to watch Fox25 because OKC's budget director was on last night saying that the 12% budget cut he is calling for will call for the loss of an equal amount of employees that Tulsa is about to lose. He also stated he had been telling the city council this for over a year. Both Police and Fire reps were asked if this was true. Both stated it was and the city knew it but never discussed it because they wanted to get Maps3 passed. Check out Fox25.


Go to Youtube

Maps 3 after the vote services are being slashed

Thanks Mike, I'll look for it. Please note that if this indeed happens, I'll be one of the first at Council meeting to voice my opposition.
I'm moving just outside of Oklahoma County into Cleveland County so my voting days in OKC are numbered, but there is other methods to voice any objections or approvals.

On a side note, any update on the firefighter that was seriously injured just before Christmas, I think the report stated that he fell while hanging lights at his church!!

Have a Great Day and a Better Weekend

[Wambo36]

Why is Fox25 News the only ones covering this. Where are the other news outlets in this city?

As far as the FF who fell while working at his church, last I heard he was looking at multiple surgeries and a very long recovery. He broke alot of bones.

[MGE1977]

Thanks Mike, I'll look for it. Please note that if this indeed happens, I'll be one of the first at Council meeting to voice my opposition.
I'm moving just outside of Oklahoma County into Cleveland County so my voting days in OKC are numbered, but there is other methods to voice any objections or approvals.

On a side note, any update on the firefighter that was seriously injured just before Christmas, I think the report stated that he fell while hanging lights at his church!!

Have a Great Day and a Better Weekend

I'm not sure what to say to this? Junkie must have fallen off the boat at tenkiller and struck his head on a piece of driftwood. This appears to be a kindly sort of remark made reasonably and in good faith. Weird.

I can really appreciate this from you Junkie.

As to the aforementioned FF, he is rehabbing well and expected to return with the addition of some bionics.

I'm going to weigh in on this thread again, because I've got itchy typing fingers.

It was mentioned during the MIII threads that we were only bringing issues such as these to the front because we were not getting anything from the passage of MAPS.

We were cornered by the obvious disregard that has plagued our negotiations with the city for many years, as stated previously 1995, a year that consequently gave Marrs his political legs. In what other issue is the discrepancy between wants and needs more glaringly apparent? In what other issue could one find the two faces of city government in a lineup side by side.

The smiling, handshaking, ever your buddy, best dressed in 2007 party pleaser, and the hand ringing, nervous, fiscal augur who chimes in with foreboding prognostics of dire financial straits to come, both were on display within weeks of the vote.

I'm not looking to rehash the MIII thing, no need. I would like to examine the duality upon which certain issues are spun and their timing because there are those who like to reiterate that we only got into the fight because we weren't getting our dues. I think that is an unfair accusation. We got into the fight because our services, as they are provided to the citizens who pay for them, are ever being hacked away at behind closed doors in negotiations, while simultaneously appearing to be a priority in public.

In fact a keystone promise made during said campaign was frankly rejected by members of the council, mind you after the vote was passed. Had they denied Mick's wants prior to the vote, perhaps the sway would have gone the other direction, perhaps not....

What other venue would have brought this duality to light better than MIII? Rig issues have recently been brought up because prior to the capricious turn to pander to a hockey team, we weren't really having rig issues. Granted, we were still in the old ones that were on their respective last legs, but we were on a schedule for replacement, now, we have a ladder company operating out of a minivan, not a piece of fire apparatus, a van that soccer moms use for commuting. That rig is only good for manpower meaning that without gear there is no rescue until somebody comes to the rescue of the Fire and Rescue Department.

We are well paid as employees, enough so that our families are taken care of. We are not getting rich as firefighters. We are doing well enough to know that our job is the best job out there. As a department, we are a money suck. How could it be any other way? On a person's worst day we are called to respond in force to mitigate emergencies satisfactorily with citizens our primary concern and their property second and we do this with the moniss that were supposed to be dedicated to us by the vote of the people because service such as ours should be expensive, for being free.

[OUGrad05]

Thanks Mike, I'll look for it. Please note that if this indeed happens, I'll be one of the first at Council meeting to voice my opposition.
I'm moving just outside of Oklahoma County into Cleveland County so my voting days in OKC are numbered, but there is other methods to voice any objections or approvals.

On a side note, any update on the firefighter that was seriously injured just before Christmas, I think the report stated that he fell while hanging lights at his church!!

Have a Great Day and a Better Weekend

Definately check it out RC because I was gung ho for maps 3 as well, I'm not a fan of the police or fire union and agreed they were blowing things out of proportion. But my brother sent me the link today, it definately seems the mayor and council ignored the warnings. They KNEW a budget mess was coming, you don't miss 10 and 12% revenue shortfalls. They were covering it up, plain and simple Which saddens me to say because I was all for Maps3 defended it to family time and again, and now I look like the fool.

Why is Fox25 the only ones covering this. Where are the other news outlets in this city?

Gaylords.

[fire121]

[Wambo36]

I'm not sure what to say to this? Junkie must have fallen off the boat at tenkiller and struck his head on a piece of driftwood. This appears to be a kindly sort of remark made reasonably and in good faith. Weird.

I can really appreciate this from you Junkie.

No kidding. I almost fell out of my chair. Pleasantly suprised.

If that day before the council comes Junkie, let us know, we'll form a line.