Bricktown Casino

[mranderson]

The Shawnee tribe is considering building a casino in Bricktown or somewhere else Downtown. This is a move opposed by Mick Cornett, but one I personally favor.

It would require the tribe to purchase land, possibly owned by the city and register it with the Bureau of Indian Affairs before they can build.

Do you favor this move? What about other casino's downtown? If not, where would you like to see them?

[TheImmortal]

Well if it's in bricktown, i would have to say no...unless they made it something unique and family friendly in addition to just a casino. and also, as long as it doesnt look like half the other casinos that have that horrendous triangle shaped design(Buffalo Run,WinStar,etc). They could make it work very well, I suppose it just depends on their willingness to provide whats best for the city and not their pockets.

[HOT ROD]

They should NOT be located in Bricktown.

I say, locate them on tribal lands or near the "Oklahoma River" somewhere, like S Eastern Avenue.

[Nuclear_2525]

The only way I would want to see a casino in Bricktown, is if it was a real casino, like the Cherokee casino in Catoosa. BUT, certain conditions would apply. The Casino, of course, would need to be predominately brick. I would want to see a high rise hotel, with the possibility of condos above the hotel, instead of a spread out 2-3 story hotel. I just don't want to see this casino take up a ton of land in Bricktown.

[okcpulse]

I feel the casino should be in Bricktown, but Lower Bricktown, after I-40 is relocated. They could buy the cotton gin property, a property I would like to see moved to a more industrial zone.

[HOT ROD]

I feel the casino should be in Bricktown, but Lower Bricktown, after I-40 is relocated. They could buy the cotton gin property, a property I would like to see moved to a more industrial zone.

ya, that might work. ...

[BDP]

The Casino, of course, would need to be predominately brick.

Why would the casino be required to do this when nothing else has been required to do so? A few years ago I would have been against a casino in bricktown, but now it would probably fit right in. It's interesting in a Daily OK article Cornett said that it wouldn’t fit in with what "we're" trying to create down there. But, what are we trying to create down there? It's seems that development is all about traffic, nothing more. Well, a casino would definitely bring in the people.

I have a feeling that some city leaders are going to fight any efforts to get a casino in downtown or in OKC more as a way to protect the race track and its expanded gambling offerings than out of any other concern.

[okcpulse]

BDP, you have to remember that 'Lower Bricktown' is not within Bricktown's actual boundaries, therefore any development south of Reno does not have to conform to Bricktown's stringent design standards. Yes Bricktown should have extended its boundaries to include this area, but I'm sure with Hogan's influence, the Bricktown Association did not.

Therefor, if the casino was built south of Reno the design would be farely liberal from what must conform to actual Bricktown.

[okrednk]

I am all for the acquisition on the casino whether it be Bricktown or wherever. I think any place you put a casino, especially if you build it right (big and Vegas style), the city might be stumbling onto a big move they don't know about.


Build it and they will come.

[BDP]

I think any place you put a casino, especially if you build it right (big and Vegas style),

Can Oklahoma really have Vegas style gambling anyway? Don't you have to pay to play each hand? I have not been to an OK casino, but this is what I have heard and that's why I don't go. If this is the case, then OKC really doesn't gain much from having a casino. Louisiana and Missouri offer vegas gambling and so any new OK casino really only competes with the casinos already in existence for their short commute non-extended stay type customers. While I have pretty much resigned not to get too involved with what goes into bricktown (it is what it is), I don't think that a casino would be that big of a deal. At least, I don't think it would make much more impact. Now, if it was a resort with several additional amenities, that'd be a different story, but if it's just Lucky Star-Bricktown Branch, then it's not that big of a deal, imo.

[brianinok]

I am against a casino being built in Bricktown. But, if one is going to be built, I can get on board with the idea if it is done right. It better have:

- A normal looking building (all brick would be nice).
- Classy looking (at least as classy as a casino can look).
- Not tent-style like Winstar.
- Large enough to be an attraction.
- Urban style-- not suburban.

It would be nice if it had the following:

- A real hotel (not a Microtel, a hotel with all 4* amenities) that can also be used for convention purposes.
- A parking garage bigger than what they need to also be used for general Bricktown parking.

[Patrick]

We need to create a casino district in Oklahoma City, not allow casinos to enter into a ruin Bricktown. Possibly an area along the Oklahoma River might be an option. A few casinos could even develop riverboat casinos....not necessarily operational, but just for looks.

[BDP]

We need to create a casino district in Oklahoma City, not allow casinos to enter into a ruin Bricktown

But what is ruin? I don't want to put words into your mouth, but I'm guessing ruin means large uninspiring developments that draw large crowds. To me, the idea seems perfectly consistent in philosophy with a Bass Pro, a multiplex, and a place like Toby's. If such a development would ruin bricktown, then we may have already done it. All of these things are defended because, well, they worked. They draw crowds, for the time being. It's no doubt that a casino in downtown would do the same and it certainly isn't going to look worse than some what's down there now.

If it's just the stigma of gambling we're talking about, I would say that what was left of that disappeared in the 90s. No one is going to look down upon a community for having gambling these days. Most communities in America have gambling within a few hours of themselves.

I agree it's not ideal, but whether we like it or not, a casino would fit in with bricktown these days. Maybe not when it was a modest collection of pubs and restaurants, but it wouldn't be that drastic of a development today. And, if nothing else, it would actually be something the city proper doesn't already have, excepting the race track, and you can't say that about many other large developments in bricktown lately.

[travich]

I think a casino would add to the excitement downtown! Since it's an Indian casino, would that mean it wouldn't bring tax revenues into the city...?

[Luke]

Isn't the OKC - LAS flight the #1 flight out of Will Rogers? Obviously Okies like to gamble. I know when I go to Vegas I like going to the nice hotels. I'm sure many Okies do as well. Therefore, I'm in agreement with whoever said that if a casino were built in OKC, it better be over the top in quality much like a Vegas Hotel with all the amenities (see Bellagio, Wynn, Venetian, MGM Grand...)

I think a top notch Resort Hotel like those in Vegas would go well with the convention business downtown brings.

[fromdust]

I think a casino would add to the excitement downtown! Since it's an Indian casino, would that mean it wouldn't bring tax revenues into the city...?

this tax thing , i heard, was the real reason cornett does not want a casino in bricktown. no revenue for the city.

[floater]

I agree that a casino would fit in Bricktown. It still needs a daytime diversion, and would continue the 24/7 feel that's just now starting with the IHOP. But that is beside the point. Bricktown is starting to fill out, and the kind of casino it deserves would not have enough room with what is available. What is left -- the land north of Reno east of the ballpark, and the Lower Bricktown lots -- should leave room for more housing, retail (a bookstore!!), hotels, and a rec center like Dave and Busters.

But I agree with Patrick, downtownguy, etc that a location along the river or in Hub Cap Alley is a better one -- still close to downtown, but still separate from it (and within walking distance). The land on Reno between Bricktown and the truckstops on Martin Luther King might also be a nice spot -- visible from I-235 and I-40, somewhat isolated, creating a nice Reno stretch (delicious reference to Nevada) if accompanied with nice hotels (I agree about the Microtel). Either way, it would have to rely on the Oklahoma Spirit or its own shuttle service to truck downtown customers there.

I also have a feeling politics is at hand here. There's no coincidence that it took a Democrat to get a lottery for education.

Personally, I am not a fan of casinos. I don't think people choose to live in a place because it has a casino (and if they do, I don't think I'd want them). But there is no doubt that one close to downtown would boost tourism significantly. And the state does earn revenue from gaming, even though the city would not.

[BDP]

I don't think people choose to live in a place because it has a casino

Good point, but do you think, on the scale of neighborhoods, that people would choose not to live in a place because of a casino. Would having a casino be detrimental to living downtown? If so, what would make it different than other bricktown developments to negatively differentiate it?

Obviously we all agree how it is done is important, but is there anything inherent in a casino today that would affect trying to develope downtown as a community to live in?

[mranderson]

What do you think about building the casino next to the American Indian cultural center?

[Luke]

What do you think about building the casino next to the American Indian cultural center?

Too cliché. Tacky even.

[floater]

Good point, but do you think, on the scale of neighborhoods, that people would choose not to live in a place because of a casino. Would having a casino be detrimental to living downtown? If so, what would make it different than other bricktown developments to negatively differentiate it?

Obviously we all agree how it is done is important, but is there anything inherent in a casino today that would affect trying to develope downtown as a community to live in?

I think for some people, it would be a drawback to living in an area. I don't think it would be a detriment to Bricktown if planned well for traffic and parking.

IMO Bricktown will not be a residential center. Like others in downtown OKC, it should be mixed-use, but geared toward entertainment just as Deep Deuce and Midtown should have some retail and commercial/institutional but geared toward residential. If located in or near Bricktown, I don't think the negative effects would hurt downtown's development as a neighborhood. It is an entertainment district. People expect some unpredictability there. But for the other sub-neighborhoods -- Midtown, arts district, Auto Alley, CBD, Flatiron -- it would be a mismatch.

[BDP]

IMO Bricktown will not be a residential center. Like others in downtown OKC, it should be mixed-use, but geared toward entertainment just as Deep Deuce and Midtown should have some retail and commercial/institutional but geared toward residential. If located in or near Bricktown, I don't think the negative effects would hurt downtown's development as a neighborhood. It is an entertainment district. People expect some unpredictability there. But for the other sub-neighborhoods -- Midtown, arts district, Auto Alley, CBD, Flatiron -- it would be a mismatch.

Good points.

[HFK]

Good God why would anyone want an indian casino anywhere near Bricktown? Every Indian casino (and most others) I've ever been in has been a gaudy, tacky, noisy, seedy, smoke-filled cess-pool. Yeah, they attract people, and make money, but so do whorehouses... This has to be the worst Bricktown improvement idea yet,

When I think of the impact of casinos upon a town I can't help but think of Deadwood. Last Summer, during a roadtrip through Wyoming and the Black Hills, I spent an evening in the old hotel in Deadwood (can't remember the name, but it was the one that Teddy Roosevelt stayed at). I'd never been in Deadwood before, but a buddy of mine who'd lived in the area many years ago told me that the town was great. Of course, the casinos had been added since he lived there. Yeah, there were tons of people, roaming around all night long, spending money, but the town had absolutely zero charm: all but one of the old bars had slot machines and/or tables, and even the 'nice' 2nd story resteraunt I went to required their guests to wade through the gambling room on the first floor for access. That was a really disappointing night: I could see the great potential of the town (Park City, with better history, full-strength beer, and without the need to buy a "membership" before drinking it). All that potential was buried in the bells, buzzers, smoke, and neon. Gambling eradicates the quaintness and charm of a place.

[jbrown84]

I oppose it. This is why. The people that go to casinos in Oklahoma--even the nice ones like the Cherokee in Catoosa--are not the same people that go to casinos in Vegas. And we are not going to attract the Vegas people because we don't have full scale gambling. No blackjack, no craps, no true slots. We aren't going to attract very many tourists, and the ones we do are going to go home and advise their friends not to go to this casino because of the 90% white trash customer base. All it will do is bring in the kind of people that don't stay the night, especially in expensive downtown hotels, and I think it could discourage families from coming down there. Even Vegas is not a very family-friendly place and it is all tourists.

[mranderson]

I oppose it. This is why. The people that go to casinos in Oklahoma--even the nice ones like the Cherokee in Catoosa--are not the same people that go to casinos in Vegas. And we are not going to attract the Vegas people because we don't have full scale gambling. No blackjack, no craps, no true slots. We aren't going to attract very many tourists, and the ones we do are going to go home and advise their friends not to go to this casino because of the 90% white trash customer base. All it will do is bring in the kind of people that don't stay the night, especially in expensive downtown hotels, and I think it could discourage families from coming down there. Even Vegas is not a very family-friendly place and it is all tourists.

When you have a state full of people that will listen to some holy roller former state representitive spew his inaccurate opinion about gaming, it creates a situation where you must start small andi buld as you proove this guy wrong.

I have not been to one of these casino's, however, I do know black jack is legal in the state under the gaming laws. I do not know if the casino's have "real" slot machines. Yes, it is true there is no craps or even roulette. Give it time... There will be.

Who knows. Maybe the casino will be a class act we all can be proud of. Not all non Las Vegas casino's are dumps... And, yes... Many are smoke filled... Even in Vegas.