BOK vs. Ford Center

[OKC74]

I heard on the radio tonight that Britney Spears' tour is coming to Tulsa. While everyone may not be a fan of hers, this is a major concert tour...one that would normally not come to Oklahoma. Obviously Ford Center is currently closed for the renovations/updates, but my question is...if it were open, would the tour have chosen OKC over Tulsa? What about once Ford Center's improvements are complete? Will our arena measure up to the new BOK Center? I haven't been there, but I've heard good things about it. When it first opened, I noticed they had a lot of big acts coming through, but I thought this was all a part of their "grand opening". However, it seems as if they KEEP getting the big names...names that, even when Ford Center was still open, OKC was not getting (Celine Dion to name just one). Is this all still a part of the BOK's "newness", or is it solely because Ford Center is currently closed? Just wondering if this irks anyone else...the fact that Tulsa is getting these big shows. I know there has been discussion before in other threads where people have stated they don't care about the concerts because WE have the NBA. While I am also super excited about the NBA...why can't we have both? Obviously scheduling conflicts come into play during the basketball season, but what is going to happen once the improvements are made, we are in the OFF season for NBA, and the concerts start rolling through Oklahoma? Will they continue to choose BOK?

[okyeah]

Britney has already performed at the Ford Center, though. I went to that. It was the "Dream Within a Dream" tour in 2002. anyway...yes, I do think it is because bok is new

[nighttrain12]

In the first place, Britney has already been to OKC a number of years back at the Ford Center. I don't think Celine ever played in OKC but she really didn't tour that much in the U.S. previously and played a number of years almost exclusively in Vegas. When she finally finished there, the Thunder were playing and that really limited the open dates during basketball season.

I do share your concerns however and this is one reason I hope the Blazers go back to the Cox Conv. Center as that would open up about 35 more dates at the remodeled and improved Ford. I think it will be even better than the BOK Center as a facility. After the 2009/10 NBA season is over in mid April 2010, I think you will see a ton of big concerts during the Summer tour season.

In the meantime, its not that far to drive to T-town to see Britney, Miley, and Keith Urban with Sugarland, (who have all already been to OKC).

[narrowexpanded]

Tulsa gets better shows the OKC, period. I guess since the Ford Center opened, OKC has gotten a fair share of "big" concerts, but just keep on eye on oklahomarocks.com once a month and you'll see that Tulsa gets a much wider variety of concerts then we do. It wouldnt surprise me in the least if the BOK center starts to pull a larger cut of the bigger shows now that its open. I know that lack of a desirable midlevel venue and the NBA schedule play a part in this, but it would be cool if someone more in the know could explain some of the finer rationale in more detail.

[nighttrain12]

oklahomarocks.com doesn't work for me. I do agree Tulsa has a wider variety of concerts.

BOKcenter has only been open about 9 or 10 months so it is still brand new. I think we will be amazed at what events (in addition to 41 NBA games) are at Ford Center after it reopens. The sales tax vote was to improve the Ford Center for both the NBA and other events including concerts.

[OkieHornet]

it's OklahomaRock.com - Your Source for Oklahoma Music

not oklahomarockS.com

[metro]

Oh joy, another thread on Ford Center vs. BOK and why they are getting more shows......

[bombermwc]

That's what I thought metro...ugh.

But since it's here, let's chat it up a bit.

Let's look back to when Ford Center opened. Concerts flocked in and went crazy for several years. They've stayed consistent really since then and didn't drop off much until the Thunder came in. And now that it's closed for the summer, it's pointless to argue. BOK is new and so they are promoting it like crazy, just like they did Ford Center. Remember that SMG manages both sites (also the Cox Center), so it's not like they are going to kill either of their clients.

Now, you give me a choice between the Thunder and a concert, I take the Thunder any day. But beyond that, Ford Center does hold a few thousand more people. It may not seem like much, but think about that for a second. At say $50 a ticket, for 2000 more seats, that means an immediate additional $100K. Up the price to something like what the Stones charged and you'll see why those seats are important. My Stones ticket was $150...so that would be $300K. Obviously not every seat costs the same, but that just serves as an example.

Also keep in mind that concerts could give a crap what the facility looks like or how flashy it is. They don't use a scoreboard, they don't care who designed it. They all bring in their own equipment. They want an arena that holds somewhere AROUND 20K (even though it's smaller for a concert than a basketball game). So when you compare the two arenas....the only difference is the number of seats. The two places are pretty much evenly matched. After the expansion, Ford Center doesn't really add anything a concert cares about. The added concessions and vendor space is more of an additional income for the city, not the concertier.

[BDP]

Here we go again...

1. The BOK center is not getting any bigger shows than the Ford Center has had. A sample of acts that have played the Ford Center: Paul McCartney, Elton John and Billy Joel, the Rolling Stones, Fleetwood Mac, the Eagles, Britney Spears, Cher, George Strait, Toby Keith, the Dixie Chicks, Kenny Chesney, Eric Clapton, Bon Jovi, Tim McGraw & Faith Hill, Tool, Green Day, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Foo Fighters, Nine Inch Nails, Coldplay. And there are more I just can’t think of right now. And this is in addition to the many children's and family shows, a cirque de soleil production, and several major college sporting events it has hosted over the years. And, yes, now it is also host to the NBA.

2. The Ford Center is going through renovations and isn’t booking shows until October.

3. Many of the BOK shows have already been to the Ford Center

4. While you can point to some acts that BOK is getting that the Ford Center has not, you can also find many that have come to the Ford Center that have not made it to the BOK center. In fact, mainly due to BOK Center's age, there are a LOT more in the latter category.

5. The concert industry is in a rut. Tulsa is a new market. New markets are one bright spot for the industry as people go as much for novelty as for the actual event

6. The Ford Center was a top ten venue in North America for ticket sales its first year and a top 25 venue in North America for the next couple of years. This is because of #4. I would expect the same for the BOK given that the industry hasn't changed much, including that many of the top arena acts are the same. Even if the Ford Center wasn't in renovations, a repeat act is more likely to tap the Tulsa market before it comes to back OKC again.

7. The NBA should have little effect on bookings. Every arena in the country manages to work around permanent tenants. And yes, it is much better for a venue's viability to have a major permanent tenant, if for nothing else, it helps justify and facilitate continued maintenance and improvement of the facility.

8. The real effect of the BOK center is that you will have more acts coming to Oklahoma more often. They will often skip smaller markets on some tours to avoid saturation. The net affect is that your entertainment options are increasing in a way that would probably not have happened without the BOK center. That is to say, Britney Spears, Billy Joel, The Eagles, etc. were probably just as likely to skip Oklahoma this time around as they were to book at the Ford Center if renovations were not taking place.

9. The first two acts after this year's renovations are King of Leon and Robin Williams. They are currently not booked at the BOK center. This doesn’t really show anything other than that it works both ways.

10. Britney Spears is a major concert tour that has ALREADY come to Oklahoma and, just my opinion, I'd rather have the 2002 version of Britney than the 2009 version, if I had to choose and, really, I'd choose neither. In fact, I would choose Kings of Leon over any Britney and especially Celine Dion any day, but that's just my taste.

Really, I don’t understand why this keeps coming up. What did people expect? Would anyone really expect the same shows to come to the same markets tour after tour? It just doesn’t happen for markets of our size. The BOK center is a great addition to Oklahoma’s major entertainment venue inventory and it is a great thing that it is off to a start as great as the Ford Center’s was. This will ensure that your entertainment options in Oklahoma continue to grow, which improves quality of life and, in turn, sustainability of the community. So, relax. Enjoy the day trip to Tulsa for a show or two. Or stay home and enjoy some different acts, major college sporting events, and the NBA. Hey, look at that, it’s getting harder for people to say there’s nothing to do in Oklahoma… thank you Ford Center AND BOK Center.

[BDP]

even though it's smaller for a concert than a basketball game

The capacity is higher for concerts than basketball games because people are seated on the floor. Ford Center capacity is more than 20k for concerts.

[metro]

But often concerts block off a good portion of seats that are even with and behind the stage.

[BDP]

Yes, but capacity for concerts is above 20k, which is more than it is for basketball or hockey.

[Steve]

If you really crave a Britany Spears concert performance, follow these instructions:
- Play one of her CDs
- Have a friend or loved one, male or female, doesn't really matter, dress up as Britney.
- Have the friend do their best effort (or not) at lip-synching to the music.
Congratulations. You've just saved at least $70 and still got the same experience as those seeing her at BOK.

[nighttrain12]

If you really crave a Britany Spears concert performance, follow these instructions:
- Play one of her CDs
- Have a friend or loved one, male or female, doesn't really matter, dress up as Britney.
- Have the friend do their best effort (or not) at lip-synching to the music.
Congratulations. You've just saved at least $70 and still got the same experience as those seeing her at BOK.

Sorry but I don't have a friend or loved one that looks anywhere near as hot or dress as slutty as Britney does. LOL

[Jesseda]

Are we at it again with the mine is bigger that yours....

[bluedogok]

In the 70-80's when most concerts hit more markets than the bigger acts do now, many of them would rotate between OKC (Myriad or Lloyd Noble Center) and Tulsa between tours. Some would split long tours and hit them about 4-6 months apart. I know Rush used to alternate, one album tour would be in OKC (The Myriad) and the next would be in Tulsa and they stayed in that rotation until the early 90's. Like others have said, many have played the Ford Center, time for BOK to get theirs while the Ford Center is being redone.

We get very few concerts here in Austin, the only facility is The Erwin Center on the UT campus and they just don't book many. Most book the SBC Center in San Antonio and probably will get less since the Verizon Amphitheater in Selma (north suburb if San Antonio) has been purchased for redevelopment. We have also had the medium sized outdoor venues close here in town recently because of development. So there goes another option for touring acts.

I do think OKC needs a shed/amphitheater, the Zoo is well past its prime.

[kevinpate]

> the Zoo is well past its prime.

The only real issue with ZooAmp, for me anyway, is the early 'call it a night' limit

[OkieHornet]

We get very few concerts here in Austin

[bluedogok]

We get very few of the larger, national touring acts here, most go to San Antonio if they even go anywhere other than DFW or Houston. What we do have is an abundance of local acts playing in clubs all the time. They are not the same thing, I don't consider locals playing clubs to be a "concert".

[narrowexpanded]

I guess I shouldnt have posted my issues on this thread, as I dont really have a problem with shows booked at the Ford vs BOK...my issues relate to OKC not having anything like Cains Ballroom to bring in the shows that cant fill a large amphitheater. I lived in Norfolk Virginia and got spoiled by the Norva, a small concert hall in downtown Norfolk with a new mall directly across the street. The amount of variety and volume of shows are what I wish for for OKC. Since returning to OKC, I can see the improvement in many areas, and I know we just had Wilco...Morrissey played a show here a few years ago, this would have been unheard of when I was growing up. But Ive been told a number of times that we dont get as many solid mid-level shows because venues like the CC Events Center, Diamond Ballroom, Farmers Market, etc arent making artists WANT to come here. Ive driven to Tulsa for shows, I just wish I didnt have to.

[metro]

[narrowexpanded]

cute

[In_Tulsa]

Number 9 worldwide number 2 in US


Tulsa's BOK Center Makes Top 10 - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com |

[khook]

Check out the figures when the Ford center opened and it was much the same as the BOK is today..... NEW center.... new acts.....

[warreng88]

Number 9 worldwide number 2 in US


Tulsa's BOK Center Makes Top 10 - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com |

Anyone notice that the Ford Center was #49 even with the Thunder and being closed for renovations?