Capitol Hill Definition

[Prunepicker]

Back in the 50s those of us who went to Grant considered ourselves Capitol
Hillians.

Puh-leez! Children may be reading this thread. Grant and Capitol Hill don't
mix. It don't mix no way at all. DANG! Get a clue!

[Generals64]

Puh-leez! Children may be reading this thread. Grant and Capitol Hill don't
mix. It don't mix no way at all. DANG! Get a clue!

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Oh My Gosh, the nerves have been touched and the arteries have been severed....Help something's wrong..............OMG.....

[papaOU]

WHERE ARE ALL MY COMPADRES??


And after I have given you the best years of my life!!

I should have listened to mother.............

[papaOU]

Well kick me in the rear. For some time I have been looking for information about Capitol Hill and searching subject "Capitol Hill, Oklahoma" and kept coming up dry. Very frustrating. Searching last night I suddenly realized that there was never a Capitol Hill, Oklahoma!!!!!!!!!! It's Capitol Hill, Oklahoma Territory. What an idiot..............

[Martin]

saw an interview the other day of a capitol hill historian... he stated that the incorporated boundaries of capitol hill went from 15th to 44th from north to south and blackwelder to high from west to east. i'm betting that those are the extents, 'cause i doubt the town was perfectly square.

-M

[papaOU]

saw an interview the other day of a capitol hill historian... he stated that the incorporated boundaries of capitol hill went from 15th to 44th from north to south and blackwelder to high from west to east. i'm betting that those are the extents, 'cause i doubt the town was perfectly square.

-M

Where did you see it and who was this person?

I can accept the east/west boundries better than the north/south. If I remember right the original boundries were the river to the north and 29th street to the south. But then there was the Capitol Hill Golf Course that went from 36th/Grand to 44th. But that was an extension of the original Capitol Hill. East was Shields and West was Mount St. Mary's (Shartel). I have seen some that take it to Western on the West. Seems at one point there was a large saw-mill lumber yard on Western.
Doug pointed out that there was an East Capitol Hill that went from Shields(west) to High (east). Also called the "Schilling Additon". Schilling was mayor of Capitol Hill.

I think I am correct. At least part of it.

[Doug Loudenback]

saw an interview the other day of a capitol hill historian... he stated that the incorporated boundaries of capitol hill went from 15th to 44th from north to south and blackwelder to high from west to east. i'm betting that those are the extents, 'cause i doubt the town was perfectly square.

-M

I suppose that anything is possible but the historian's data is pretty hard for me to accept without seeing his/her sources. I doubt that 44th even existed when Capitol Hill incorporated as a city in 1904. Blackwelder to High? That's about 25-26 city blocks wide by my reckoning, more or less.

The statistics in the following articles certainly work against the expansive comments of the historian:

February 28, 1904 Oklahoman Article: 722 inhabitants



April 22, 1904 Oklahoman Article: 133 Voted



Keeping in mind that city services would presumably need to be supplied to the city's inhabitants, I'm quite skeptical that Capitol Hill had the boundaries stated by the historian.

There should be proof somewhere to settle this, maybe at the downtown library, maybe in archived Oklahoma City ordinances which annexed the city. But, somewhere.

[Martin]

the gentleman's name is john michael williams and it was an interview from the ward 4 show on channel 20. this video will probably make its way to okchistory.com in the near future.

don't get me wrong, i'm not taking this guy's word as gospel... but check out this excerpt from a 1909 map (i linked a slightly different view of this same map earlier in the thread) that shows that 44th is not a totally crazy proposition. all street names are contemporary on this map. -M

[Doug Loudenback]

We'll see. Like I said, anything is possible ... until source documents are located. After then, not.

[papaOU]

I am going to make a concentrated effort to find a reproduction map I found a few years ago. Well. Ten or more years ago but that no longer seems a long time. The map shows the streets running east and west are represented as A st, B st,............29th was the south boundary and the river to the north. Some businesses are shown. One that stays with me is a coal yard on what was to become Robinson.

[Generals64]

I am going to make a concentrated effort to find a reproduction map I found a few years ago. Well. Ten or more years ago but that no longer seems a long time. The map shows the streets running east and west are represented as A st, B st,............29th was the south boundary and the river to the north. Some businesses are shown. One that stays with me is a coal yard on what was to become Robinson.

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Hey dude, check out the Capitol Hill thread of the book...it's cool...

[Doug Loudenback]

Well, here's something interesting. The following is a notice of sheriff's sale on real property located in Capitol Hill appearing in the March 24, 1903, Oklahoman. Notice the legal description ...



... in Capitol Hill, addition to Oklahoma City, O.T.

So, it seems, Capitol Hill was part of Oklahoma City before Capitol Hill became an incorporated town. It's a fun little puzzle, this one is.

[Doug Loudenback]

To recapitulate, these messages were in this thread on 5/13/2009:

saw an interview the other day of a capitol hill historian... he stated that the incorporated boundaries of capitol hill went from 15th to 44th from north to south and blackwelder to high from west to east. i'm betting that those are the extents, 'cause i doubt the town was perfectly square.

5/13/2009: I suppose that anything is possible but the historian's data is pretty hard for me to accept without seeing his/her sources. I doubt that 44th even existed when Capitol Hill incorporated as a city in 1904. Blackwelder to High? That's about 25-26 city blocks wide by my reckoning, more or less. * * * I'm quite skeptical that Capitol Hill had the boundaries stated by the historian.

5/13/2009: don't get me wrong, i'm not taking this guy's word as gospel... but check out this excerpt from a 1909 map (i linked a slightly different view of this same map earlier in the thread) that shows that 44th is not a totally crazy proposition. all street names are contemporary on this map

5/13/2009: We'll see. Like I said, anything is possible ... until source documents are located. After then, not.

Well, I'm so very glad that I was not so damn dumb as to make any bets based upon my skepticism ... certainly that I didn't bet "the pot," cause I'd have lost every nickel.

This morning, I spoke with David Sellers, owner of the Capitol Hill Beacon, and I told him what I was up to with my research on Capitol Hill, particularly right now focusing on what Capitol Hill's boundaries were when it was annexed by Oklahoma City during 1909-1910. We chatted and he said that it would be fine to come by later in the afternoon. Meanwhile, I talked with Steve and we agreed to have a burger at the Grill on the Hill, 324 SW 25th St, and then drop in for a visit with Mr. Sellers.

Tip: DO NOT order the double burger unless you are prepared to almost explode ... their hamburger meat was lean, large, and good, and I was compelled to eat it all up ... still suffering.

Anyway, during our visit with Mr. Sellers, both of us learned a lot about the Beacon and other stuff. But, to the point of this thread, the Beacon has been giving a free copy to subscribers of an 8 page 8 1/2 x 11 document for some time now.

The document's name: When Capitol Hill was a City -- 1904-1910. He kindly allowed me permission to scan and use it in my blog stuff on Capitol Hill, which I will shortly do.

But, for this minute, here are cropped images of Capitol Hill ... which answer the questions that have been discussed in this thread:

1900: First, the 1900 plat ... the document's text notes that the incorrect spelling of Capitol Hill was quickly fixed during the incorporation process. He (I'm pretty sure that Mr. Sellers was the document's author) also notes that in this plat the northern boundary was NOT 22nd since the north side of blocks 1-5 are a few feet short of 22nd.

Larger: http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49...con_2_crop.jpg



1904: At page 4 is an image showing Capitol Hill when it incorporated in 1904. Notice that it includes not only the Capitol Hill plat but also College Hill, Schilling, and Eckroat additions. That blows away the notion that Capitol Hill did not extend further east than Shields or the Santa Fe tracks.

Larger: http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49...con_4_crop.jpg



1910: And, last, the one that I am sooo glad I bet no money on ...Capitol Hill when it was annexed by Oklahoma City ... I'd have been walking the streets looking for a shopping cart to push my few remaining belongings in ...

Larger: http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49...con_7_crop.jpg



Notice that the western and eastern boundaries were indeed Blackwelder and High, and that the northern boundary was either 15th or the North Canadian River and as far south as 44th, between Santa Fe and Shields.

I've still not seen the Oklahoma City ordinance annexing Capitol Hill which would be the true source document for the last map, above, but I now have every confidence that the information contained in the Beacon's publication is correct.

By the way, Capitol Hill History buffs would be well served to regularly pick up a copy of the now weekly Capitol Hill Beacon. Each issue contains one full page of historical reflections which range from the obscure to the more important. As an example of the former, the May 7, 2009, issue notes that 55 years earlier on that day "Katz Drug adds a pet department, full of noisy parakeets." Each full page is cram-packed with history items about things that occurred 60, 55, and 50 years ago. It's a must have.

[Generals64]

To recapitulated, these messages were in this thread on 5/13/2009:

Well, I'm so very glad that I was not so damn dumb as to make any bets based upon my skepticism ... certainly that I didn't bet "the pot," cause I'd have lost every nickel.

This morning, I spoke with David Sellers, owner of the Capitol Hill Beacon, and I told him what I was up to with my research on Capitol Hill, particularly right now focusing on what Capitol Hill's boundaries were when it was annexed by Oklahoma City during 1909-1910. We chatted and he said that it would be fine to come by later in the afternoon. Meanwhile, I talked with Steve and we agreed to have a burger at the Grill on the Hill, 324 SW 25th St, and then drop in for a visit with Mr. Sellers.

Tip: DO NOT order the double burger unless you are prepared to almost explode ... their hamburger meat was lean, large, and good, and I was compelled to eat it all up ... still suffering.

Anyway, during our visit with Mr. Sellers, both of us learned a lot about the Beacon and other stuff. But, to the point of this thread, the Beacon has been giving a free copy to subscribers of an 8 page 8 1/2 x 11 document for some time now.

The document's name: When Capitol Hill was a City -- 1904-1910. He kindly allowed me permission to scan and use it in my blog stuff on Capitol Hill, which I will shortly do.

But, for this minute, here are cropped images of Capitol Hill ... which answer the questions that have been discussed in this thread:

1900: First, the 1900 plat ... the document's text notes that the incorrect spelling of Capitol Hill was quickly fixed during the incorporation process. He (I'm pretty sure that Mr. Sellers was the document's author) also notes that in this plat the northern boundary was NOT 22nd since the north side of blocks 1-5 are a few feet short of 22nd.

Larger: http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49...con_2_crop.jpg



1904: At page 4 is an image showing Capitol Hill when it incorporated in 1904. Notice that it includes not only the Capitol Hill plat but also College Hill, Schilling, and Eckroat additions. That blows away the notion that Capitol Hill did not extend further east than Shields or the Santa Fe tracks.

Larger: http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49...con_4_crop.jpg



1910: And, last, the one that I am sooo glad I bet no money on ...Capitol Hill when it was annexed by Oklahoma City ... I'd have been walking the streets looking for a shopping cart to push my few remaining belongings in ...

Larger: http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49...con_7_crop.jpg



Notice that the western and eastern boundaries were indeed Blackwelder and High, and that the northern boundary was either 15th or the North Canadian River and as far south as 44th, between Santa Fe and Shields.

I've still not seen the Oklahoma City ordinance annexing Capitol Hill which would be the true source document for the last map, above, but I now have every confidence that the information contained in the Beacon's publication is correct.

By the way, Capitol Hill History buffs would be well served to regularly pick up a copy of the now weekly Capitol Hill Beacon. Each issue contains one full page of historical reflections which range from the obscure to the more important. As an example of the former, the May 7, 2009, issue notes that 55 years earlier on that day "Katz Drug adds a pet department, full of noisy parakeets." Each full page is cram-packed with history items about things that occurred 60, 55, and 50 years ago. It's a must have.

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We were asked about things we remembered from Katz Drug....Those parakeets were upstairs above the Soda Fountain....think about that...Hmmmm....Something else, the Basement everyone talks about at Langston's was actually under Katz Drug....That was their Stockroom. If you all remember, you shopped in the Langston's store and then stepped down into the Katz drug area....and then walked down the stairs. Mrs. Scroggins worked for TG&Y and for some unseen reason quit and went to work in Langston's Basement. I'm sure ALL of us met her at one time or other....When langston's got the Katz drug area, they had their boot department in the Store area......

[papaOU]

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We were asked about things we remembered from Katz Drug....Those parakeets were upstairs above the Soda Fountain....think about that...Hmmmm....Something else, the Basement everyone talks about at Langston's was actually under Katz Drug....That was their Stockroom. If you all remember, you shopped in the Langston's store and then stepped down into the Katz drug area....and then walked down the stairs. Mrs. Scroggins worked for TG&Y and for some unseen reason quit and went to work in Langston's Basement. I'm sure ALL of us met her at one time or other....When langston's got the Katz drug area, they had their boot department in the Store area......

Don't know about that! When you entered Langston's you were heading north. The stairs were in front of you and as you went down you were still going north. Clothing shelves went north where the dressing rooms were on the north wall. Cashier and lay-a-way were on the south wall. I was only there a couple of times when they took over the Katz area.

Anybody else remember one way or the other?

[Prunepicker]

Doug,
You're a veritable source of OKC history. Thanks!

[SOUTHSIDE GIRL]

My Mom volunteers at the Christmas Connection (in the Langston bldg) with a lady that spent alot of time in Capitol Hill and at Kats on Sunday. l will ask her to jot down some of the things she remembers, if I can't get her to join us at one of the meetings. I thought Langstons and Kats were two seperate buildings

[Generals64]

My Mom volunteers at the Christmas Connection (in the Langston bldg) with a lady that spent alot of time in Capitol Hill and at Kats on Sunday. l will ask her to jot down some of the things she remembers, if I can't get her to join us at one of the meetings. I thought Langstons and Kats were two seperate buildings

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Hey kiddo, they were originally but, Langston's picked up the lease for Katz Drug and they put a door in there......They sold Boots and hats along with other Western attire....

[papaOU]

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Hey kiddo, they were originally but, Langston's picked up the lease for Katz Drug and they put a door in there......They sold Boots and hats along with other Western attire....

I remember that happening.................

[Doug Loudenback]

Based on the information obtained from David Sellers, owner of the Capitol Hill Beacon, photo below taken by Steve Lackmeyer on May 18, 2009 ... David said that his family acquired ownership of the Beacon in the early 1940s (I forget which year) ... I'll be doing a separate article on the Beacon's history so I'll be interviewing him again for better and more detail ...



... my revised and, I'm pretty sure, final maps of Capitol Hill in 1900 (original plat), 1904 (when Capitol Hill incorporated) and 1910 (when Capitol Hill was annexed) are shown below, together with the train and trolley routes in the area:

Without Marked Areas

Larger: http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49...anborn1922.jpg



With Marked Areas

Larger: http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49...922_growth.jpg



I've also added a few pics in the Capitol Hill Blog Article thread, together with a question or two for you Capitol Hill buffs.

[SOUTHSIDE GIRL]

Is Columbus in the boundaries at 25th and Penn, not sure when it was built
or WEstwood at Exchange and Penn,

[papaOU]

Is Columbus in the boundaries at 25th and Penn, not sure when it was built
or WEstwood at Exchange and Penn,

I forgot about that one!

[Doug Loudenback]

Is Columbus in the boundaries at 25th and Penn, not sure when it was built
or WEstwood at Exchange and Penn,

I deliberately excluded Columbus since (1) Capitol Hill did not extend to Pennsylvania in 1910 and (2) not many seem to extend it that far by sentiment. More properly speaking, Columbus was in Packing Town, not Capitol Hill ... at least, that's my conclusion.

[Stan Silliman]

Is the Beacon still published? Wow. I remember seeing it but it never
crossed my mind that it was that old.

Live and learn, sometimes.

C'mon Prune, you claim to be a southsider but you never pick up a Beacon?
It's the second oldest paper in the metro. David and Gay Sellers are still there, still publishing.

If you pick a Beacon, turn to the back page. My column has been in there since 1988.

[papaOU]

C'mon Prune, you claim to be a southsider but you never pick up a Beacon?
It's the second oldest paper in the metro. David and Gay Sellers are still there, still publishing.

If you pick a Beacon, turn to the back page. My column has been in there since 1988.

Prune! Please pay for it when you pickup one up!!