Pit Bulls

[mranderson]

An internet friend sent me a video on Pit Bulls that shed some light on the breed. So, I was wondering.

How do you feel about this breed? Do you feel that all Pits are mean killers, or have the instinct? Or do you feel that a small number of them cause a bad reputation for the rest? Do you support some cities ordinance against ownership of this breed?

The video can be found at http://fs5.deviantart.com/f/2004/296...lashfinal2.swf.

[kellekokid]

well that made me cry...out of pain for those potentially loving and loved dogs and out of fury because idiot cruel people are allowed to do that to pits and think it's all great fun. All along it's the dog that is suffering and in the end is put down and sometimes that is painful too. The people should be shown the same kind of treatment they give the pits...and then they can be "put down"...

Then I was crying over the pictures of the pits with their loving families and big smiles on their beautiful faces.
I wish all of this breed were treated that way....love, respect and dignity.

[dirtrider73068]

My feelings on pit bulls is this, I like the breed they only mena if trained to be. i have been around pit bulls before adn everyone was very gentle and loving. I have a negihbor who has a amercan pit bull and he is the nicest thing you would ever see very loving and playful, I enjoy being around him, if he was not that nice then no I do not pitbulls. But any dog that is mistreated or trained to be mean can be mean.

[Midtowner]

Pit Bulls are a dangerous breed. I cannot for the life of me understand why anyone would choose such a dog. A friend of mine had a Pit Bull, incredibly nice, friendly, loyal, good tempered dog. However, the dog also caused the kid's neighbor to have to receive 8 stitches. It again bit someone else.

In an effort to not have to put it down, he gave the dog to some guy that lived on a farm about 20 miles away from where he lives. 2 days later, the dog found its way "home" to my friend.

He then kept the dog at his parents' house where it attacked one of their other dogs. They eventually had to put it down.

Now, any dog of this breed is capable of such action. They are an overly protective breed, and dangerous. Why, when there are so many other choices does anyone choose this?

[dirtrider73068]

Any animal provoked or trapped in a bad spot will bite no matter how good the family dog was mine has done that his self because it didn't want to be bothered. All dogs will bark its there instint to bark, other if trained and teased by prob casued the dog to bite will be bad. I have never been around a pit bull that was nice then turned against people. If a dog is teased then it will looked at its teaser as enemy's. If you want a dog to nice and loyal then don't tease or mistreat it or it will turn against its owner.

[Midtowner]

The difference is that when say a beagle, bird dog, whatever bites you, it won't cause severe lacerations. A pit bull's jaws have the ability to clamp down on something. It's unlike any other breed.

From Sports Illustrated, 1987:

G BITES MAN isn't news, they say, but PIT BULL BITES MAN is. Unfortunately the pit bull, when it attacks, doesn't merely bite man -- or, most horribly, child -- it clamps its powerful jaws down and literally tears its victim apart. ''The injuries these dogs inflict are more serious than other breeds because they go for the deep musculature and don't release; they hold and shake,'' says Sheryl Blair of the Tufts Veterinary School, in North Grafton, Mass., which last year held a symposium entitled Animal Agression: Dog Bites and the Pit Bull Terrier. ''Most breeds do not multiple-bite,'' says Kurt Lapham, a field investigator for the West Coast Regional office of the Humane Society. ''A pit bull attack is like a shark attack: He keeps coming back.'' ''A pit bull,'' says Judge Victor E. Bianchini of San Diego, '' is the closest thing to a wild animal there is in a domesticated dog."

In that same year, there were 18 fatalities due to dog attacks. Of those, 67% were caused by Pit Bull Terriers.

Here's the rest of the article -- you'll find it to be a pretty fair assessment of the risk involved with the breed:
http://www.dogexpert.com/Popular%20P...ullfriend.html

[dirtrider73068]

Well what about the german shepard? Have you seen them in police videos, they clamp down and don't let go untill are told, they are considered a safe pet! What about doberman's, what about the other bigger breed of dogs. German shepards can be trained to attack when given the command just as the same for pit bulls. Most of the problems comes with the lack of responsiblity of the owners and anybody that gets around the dog or dogs. If people would think and consider any dog mean before you attempt to get near it. I make sure to always make myself aware of any dog I am aruond untill I am fully sure htey dog is safe with haveing me around. If my dog barks or I feel is a threat to my friends or company in my house he is locked up. I think others should do the same.

[mranderson]

Well what about the german shepard? Have you seen them in police videos, they clamp down and don't let go untill are told, they are considered a safe pet! What about doberman's, what about the other bigger breed of dogs. German shepards can be trained to attack when given the command just as the same for pit bulls. Most of the problems comes with the lack of responsiblity of the owners and anybody that gets around the dog or dogs. If people would think and consider any dog mean before you attempt to get near it. I make sure to always make myself aware of any dog I am aruond untill I am fully sure htey dog is safe with haveing me around. If my dog barks or I feel is a threat to my friends or company in my house he is locked up. I think others should do the same.

In addition to the Pit and the German Shepard, you have the Doberman, Rottweiler, Pomeranian, Chow, and probably more.

Tell us Midtowner. Are these breeds dangerous too?

[dirtrider73068]

Yea the chow was another I trying to think of is just as mean as the pit bull trust me I had one bite at me anf all I did was stand there and reach down to pet it. Chows are known to be nice then turn mean same thing with blue healers they are nice adn then turn mean.

[kellekokid]

Personally sad as it is to say probably one of the last breed of dog I would choose to have as a pet is a pit bull simply because their jaw power if so very strong and there is such a huge public fear of them. As well trained and loved and respected as they would be in my home any time they might come in contact with the public there would be an automatic fear. I also would be respectful enough of my pets space and any company's nerves that if need be they would be seperated till there was a comfort level....in fact I have had to do that...one of my friends is nervous around dogs and my Lou and she for some reason just don't click....anyone else he will lick to death, she~ he wants to take a DNA sample of....that's what I call it anyway, she might have a different name for it

[Midtowner]

In addition to the Pit and the German Shepard, you have the Doberman, Rottweiler, Pomeranian, Chow, and probably more.

Tell us Midtowner. Are these breeds dangerous too?

Pomeranian!?

Those things are like 10 lbs! Please find me one case where a Pom put someone in the hosptial.

As far as attacks that actually injure people go, even though Pit Bull Terriers account for a small minority of the dogs in existance. However, as recently as 2003, when 24 people were killed by dog attacks, 1/3 of those were caused by Pitt Bull Terriers (that's 8 deaths). 6 occured by rottweilers, the rest were caused by other breeds.

http://ncrf2004.tripod.com/id3.html

I'd say that both Pits and Rotts are unsafe. Why would anyone have those around their home when safer breeds are available?

Just do a google search for "dog attacks" and see how many times Pit Bulls come up compared to other dogs... why is that? It's certainly a documented fact that their attacks are more fatal than attacks by other dogs.

[mranderson]

Just because a dog weighs ten pounds does not mean it is nice. I know people who have had poodles attack them.

Personally, I have never met a Pomeranian that I felt was gentle.

[windowphobe]

I won't support any breed-specific legislation or ordinances. In assessing the potential violence of any particular dog, the behavior of the dog's owner is far more of a factor than any presumed genetic tendencies. (I've had Rottweilers in my office, fercryingoutloud; they weren't any kind of threat at all - but they'd been properly trained. You give a dog, even a small spaniel, to a sociopath, and sooner or later that dog is going to be a menace to someone.)

[Midtowner]

Here's a simile for you:

A pit bull is to a pomeranian as a sawed-off-shotgun is to nail clippers.

[dirtrider73068]

I won't support any breed-specific legislation or ordinances. In assessing the potential violence of any particular dog, the behavior of the dog's owner is far more of a factor than any presumed genetic tendencies. (I've had Rottweilers in my office, fercryingoutloud; they weren't any kind of threat at all - but they'd been properly trained. You give a dog, even a small spaniel, to a sociopath, and sooner or later that dog is going to be a menace to someone.)

That is the point I was trying to make, it is the owners feeling towrds the dog on how the dogs acts. If hte owner is mena and vicous then so will the dog.

[Midtowner]

That is the point I was trying to make, it is the owners feeling towrds the dog on how the dogs acts. If hte owner is mena and vicous then so will the dog.

But does one dog have more of a capability to inflict injury than another?

Given the choice, which would you rather have attack you? A miniature schnauzer, or a Pitt Bull?

[dirtrider73068]

Neither both have teeth both can bite and both can cause the injury. Its not how bad its the fact that all dogs can bite and cause injury. The schnauzer biting me may not cause much injury as I can defend against it but when the schnauzer bite a child that can not defend his/her self then the injury obtained then would be greater. All dogs will bite and cause injury so all dogs should be considered dangerous in my book untill I feel safe around them. Thats all of my opion on this subject, no matter the dog if provoked they will bite any size any breed!!

[mom2des_n_nate]

Ok this pit bull discussion lets see I agree with dirt on this one. I have a friend that has a pit bull and if it was as mean and vicious as everyone makes the breed out to be I would not allow this dog around my 3 year old daughter. Aside from him maybe knocking her down and licking her to death thats about it. Once again its all in how the animal is rasied and handled.

[Midtowner]

Dog bite & attack statistics

The most recently published statistics are from 1994. Other statistical sources provide estimates of dog-related injuries.

*

In 2001, an estimated 68 million dogs were pets in the United States.
*

In 2001, an estimated 368,245 victims were treated for dog bite related injuries.
*

In 2001, children ages 5-9 had the highest dog-related injuries.
*

In 2001, an estimated 42% of dog bites (or 154,625) occurred in children age 14 and younger.
*

Approximately 7.9% of dog bites (or 16,476) were work-related.
*

Dog bite injury sites for all victims include:
o

45.3% to the arm/hand
o

25.8% to the leg/foot
o

22.8% to the head/neck.
o

For children 4 years and under, 64.9% of injuries were to the head/neck.
o

For those 15 and older, 86.2% of injuries from dog attacks were to the extremities.
*

Types of dog-related injuries recorded in Emergency Rooms:
o

26.4% as "dog bite"
o

40.2% as "puncture"
o

24.7% as "laceration"
o

6.0% as "contusion/abrasion/hematoma
o

1.5% as "cellulitis/infection"
o

0.8% as "amputation/avulsion/crush"
o

0.4% as "fracture/dislocation"
*

From 1979 through 1996, dog attacks resulted in more than 300 human dog-bite related deaths in the United States. Most of the victims were children.
*

In 1997 and 1998, at least 27 people died as a result of dog bite attacks (18 in 1997, and 9 in 1998). Of these, 19 were young children between zero and 11 years of age, and 8 were older children and adults between 17 and 87 years of age.
*

Of the 27 people who died as a result of dog bite attacks in 1997 and 1998, 67 percent (18) involved unrestrained dogs on the owner's property; 19 percent (5) involved unrestrained dogs off the owner's property; 11 percent (3) involved restrained dogs on the owner's property; and 4 percent (1) involved a restrained dog off the owner's property.
*

60 percent of the fatal dog bite attacks by unrestrained dogs that occurred off the owner's property in 1997 and 1998 involved attacks by more than one dog.
*

Of the 27 people who died as a result of dog bite attacks during 1997 and 1998, 67 percent (18) involved an attack by one dog; 19 percent (5) involved an attack by two dogs; and 15 percent (4) involved an attack by 3 dogs.
*

17 states accounted for the 27 dog bite fatalities that occurred in 1997 and 1998. They were: California (4 deaths); Georgia and North Carolina (3 deaths each); Kansas, Texas, and Wisconsin (2 deaths each); and Alaska, Arkansas, Colorado, Florida, Kentucky, Massachusetts, Michigan, Missouri, New York, South Dakota, and Tennessee (1 death each).
*

Rottweilers and Pit Bulls were involved in 60 percent of the 27 dog bite fatalities that occurred in 1997 and 1998. Rottweilers were involved in 10 deaths, and Pit Bulls were involved in 6.
*

From 1979 through 1998, at least 25 breeds of dogs have been involved in 238 human dog bite related deaths. Pit Bulls and Rottweilers were involved in more than 50 percent of these deaths.
*

Between 1979 and 1998, 58 percent of human deaths involved attacks by unrestrained dogs who were on their owner's property at the time of the attack.
*

It has been estimated that about 4.5 million people (nearly 2 percent of the American population) are bitten by dogs each year.
*

In 1994, of the estimated 4.7 million people who were bitten by dogs, 800,000 sought medical care. Of these, 332,000 sought treatment in emergency rooms, and 6,000 were hospitalized.
*

It has been estimated that nearly 334,000 dog bite injuries are treated in emergency departments each year.
*

Of those hospitalized for dog bite injuries in 1994, 55 percent were male.
*

The average hospital stay for a dog-bite injury has been estimated at 3.6 days.
*

In 1994, hospital charges for dog-bite victims was estimated at $62.5 million.
*

In 1994, emergency department charges for dog-bite victims was estimated at $102.4 million, and direct medical care charges incurred as a result of dog bites was estimated at $164.9 million.

[kellekokid]

I for one am gonna call this one done! :surrender
I'm just curious Midtowner....do you think any of the responsibility lies in the owners hands? Or do you believe that Pit Bulls no matter their raising, living on a chain or hanging out with their family as part of the family will always turn in to an attack dog? Reading over your posts it sounds like you think they will always turn out vicious.

[Midtowner]

No, I think that ALL dogs have the potential to be vicious, and attack. However, some breeds can do a lot more damage than others. The statistics prove that. Also, Pit Bulls are a lot more likely to be involved in a fatal mauling than say a labrador -- the statistics also prove that.

If we can't expect the parents of children to always be good parents, why do you think that the parents of Pit Bulls will always be good parents? Go back to my simile, I think it works on a lot of levels:

Pit Bulls are to Pomeranians as Sawed-off shotguns are to nail clippers.

Both weapons and both dogs can be safe or dangerous depending on who wields them. However, one weapon, and one dog are a LOT more capable of doing serious damage.

Also, from a regulatory standpoint, it is illegal to own assault weapons, or altered weapons that are too dangerous in many communities. Why should we not do the same for animals when there is a real danger there?

[Patrick]

Statistics are misleading in this case. Of course statistics will show that rotts and pitts cause more fatalities. Why is that? Hmmm..could be because these breeds are trianed to be killers. It isn't like cocker spaniels are trained to be killers. If they were, the statistics might change.

[Midtowner]

Statistics are misleading in this case. Of course statistics will show that rotts and pitts cause more fatalities. Why is that? Hmmm..could be because these breeds are trianed to be killers. It isn't like cocker spaniels are trained to be killers. If they were, the statistics might change.

One step backwards Patrick...

Why are Rotts and Pits trained to be killers? Because they are more capable killers.

Cocker Spaniels as killers? Yes, they were designed for that too. However, they were designed to hunt and kill small critters, not people. I'd imagine that you or I would have little difficulty taking on a Cocker SPaniel with death on its mind.. I rott or Pit, however? Whole 'nother story.