Access Oklahoma Turnpike Projects

[BoulderSooner]

Interstate 44 for it's entire length through Oklahoma is partially a turnpike (Will Rogers, Turner, HE Bailey) and it's not a turnpike through Tulsa, OKC, and Lawton.

Not an interstate, but is planned to be, US HWY 412 is the same. Enid to I-35 is free, I-35 to Keystone Lake is the Cimarron Turnpike, Keystone Lake through Tulsa to Chouteau is Free, Chouteau to Kansas is the Cherokee Turnpike, and then to the Arkansas border is free.

Leaving Tulsa in almost any direction and you will end up on a Turnpike. (Cimmaron, Cherokee, Will Rogers, Turner, Muskogee, Creek)

But I think I see your point, Interstate routes should be FREE roads and not toll roads for the entire length.

https://highways.dot.gov/highway-his...m-include-toll

sure but I40 and I35 are not during any stretch ... if it was like kansas part of them would be ...

[scottk]

sure but I40 and I35 are not during any stretch ... if it was like kansas part of them would be ...

The Kansas Turnpike, much like the Turner Turnpike, predates the Interstate Highway System by just a few years. These routes were built as Toll Roads and were allowed to remain toll roads as an Interstate route being built parallel to them did not make fiscal sense.

From my perspective these routes are toll roads simply because of timing. Turner was opened in 1953, the Kansas Turnpike 1954-1956, the interstate system was formed in the summer of 1956.

[jn1780]

Well since physical toll booths are pretty much gone now, there are better funding mixes that can be used. Every interstate should technically be tolled with apportion plates bearing a higher share of the road maintenance costs.

[Urbanized]

The Kansas Turnpike, much like the Turner Turnpike, predates the Interstate Highway System by just a few years. These routes were built as Toll Roads and were allowed to remain toll roads as an Interstate route being built parallel to them did not make fiscal sense.

From my perspective these routes are toll roads simply because of timing. Turner was opened in 1953, the Kansas Turnpike 1954-1956, the interstate system was formed in the summer of 1956.

That’s interesting. I grew up with family at each end of both turnpikes, and I’m a U.S. and Oklahoma history buff who’s also interested in transportation. So I thought I knew most of the history of the highway system and the turnpikes in Oklahoma and Kansas. But I’d never heard that explanation before. Makes a ton of sense.

Other than traveling on them I never really felt a family connection to the roads themselves until a few years ago. My dad, who passed away a few years ago, told me a story connected to the construction of Turner Turnpike. When he was a youngster he worked for his grandfather, who among other things owned the ice dock in Luther. Dad said he had to go work the ice dock at like 4:30 or 5 a.m. every day because the turnpike construction workers came by every morning to get ice for their thermoses and lunch boxes. Made me feel more connected to the time the turnpike was built.

[scottk]

That’s interesting. I grew up with family at each end of both turnpikes, and I’m a U.S. and Oklahoma history buff who’s also interested in transportation. So I thought I knew most of the history of the highway system and the turnpikes in Oklahoma and Kansas. But I’d never heard that explanation before. Makes a ton of sense.

Other than traveling on them I never really felt a family connection to the roads themselves until a few years ago. My dad, who passed away a few years ago, told me a story connected to the construction of Turner Turnpike. When he was a youngster he worked for his grandfather, who among other things owned the ice dock in Luther. Dad said he had to go work the ice dock at like 4:30 or 5 a.m. every day because the turnpike construction workers came by every morning to get ice for their thermoses and lunch boxes. Made me feel more connected to the time the turnpike was built.

The Turner Turnpike was the first of it's kind (toll road) west of the Mississippi when it was built and the original toll was $1.40, which adjusted for inflation from 1953 would be $16.54 today! To think about the millions of cars that have traveled that route over the last 70+ years!

What's interesting to me is that until just the last 10-15 years, there were still many rest stops built into the Turner Turnpike. Chandler and Kellyville both had Phillips 66 service stations, and Welston and Bristow had McDonald's right off the turnpike in addition to the service plaza in Stroud that most are familiar with today that is now only west bound and the newer one near Chandler that is only east bound. Gone are the picnic and rest areas (teepee picnic tables) that were abundant across Oklahoma turnpikes and highways.

On a related note, I always found the Glass House McDonald's (Howard Johnson) on the Will Rogers Turnpike near Vinita an interesting landmark as it spanned over the interstate.

[gjl]

$1.40 was a lot of money in 1953. And i had always heard that it was originally only supposed to be a toll road until it was paid for. Will Rogers too. I don't know if that is true or not.

[BoulderSooner]

$1.40 was a lot of money in 1953. And i had always heard that it was originally only supposed to be a toll road until it was paid for. Will Rogers too. I don't know if that is true or not.

that was true until the citizens of Oklahoma voted in 1954 to make it not the case ..

[bombermwc]

Crazy idea, put up a vote to disban the OTA and do some budget reallocation to ODOT so we can maintain all of the roads.

If we can fund all of these turnpikes with tolls, if we have a tax spread out the entire state instead (widen the base, lower the rate) we would be able to do this for a better price too. Not only that, but we would remove a lot of administrative overhead as well as the conflict of interest in a group that's sole purpose seems to be expand to money grab more without the transparency that gives proper accountability.

Just a thought....

[jn1780]

Oklahoma needs to figure out where future funding will come from first. Can't depend on gas tax revenue forever and taxes from electic charge stations won't work either because most electric car charging is going to take place at home.

[BoulderSooner]

Crazy idea, put up a vote to disban the OTA and do some budget reallocation to ODOT so we can maintain all of the roads.

If we can fund all of these turnpikes with tolls, if we have a tax spread out the entire state instead (widen the base, lower the rate) we would be able to do this for a better price too. Not only that, but we would remove a lot of administrative overhead as well as the conflict of interest in a group that's sole purpose seems to be expand to money grab more without the transparency that gives proper accountability.

Just a thought....

lol you would need to find a ton of money .. to maintain the toll roads ... creating an extra state wide tax is a non starter as it should be ..

[bombermwc]

lol you would need to find a ton of money .. to maintain the toll roads ... creating an extra state wide tax is a non starter as it should be ..

Why is that a non-starter? That's literally how ODOT works. We don't get all of ODOT's funding from use taxes at the pump either. And as said, we have to re-think that model as we move more to E vehicles in the next 20 years. There are ways to tax charging at home and away (yes OG&E can tell the difference on your bill on when its the car vs your fridge) to tax the charging. You may also see a much higher annual tag renewal or license fee. But it's much more simple to simply alter the state taxes across the board to include some small amount to do this. ODOT's really needed this for 50 years anyway.

It's not going to be as much as you think either. As I said, the more broad the base, the lower the rate can be. When you expand that to the 4M people in the state, you're talking pennies on those taxes that add up. We could absolutely do this for very little. I've always been confused about why Oklahomans are so opposed to taxes to help with roads but then make roads their #1 complaint. The money has to come from somewhere....it doesn't magically just appear. Either you pay it as a ridiculously high toll, or you pay it in a tax that's MUCH lower. 5 cents at the pump 20 years ago would have gotten most of our projects completed a LONG time ago that are still puttering along. But we complain about adding 5 cents all the while the price of gas itself is a few DOLLARS more. The logic on the anti-tax mentality is just....well, confusing.

[BoulderSooner]

Why is that a non-starter? That's literally how ODOT works. We don't get all of ODOT's funding from use taxes at the pump either. And as said, we have to re-think that model as we move more to E vehicles in the next 20 years. There are ways to tax charging at home and away (yes OG&E can tell the difference on your bill on when its the car vs your fridge) to tax the charging. You may also see a much higher annual tag renewal or license fee. But it's much more simple to simply alter the state taxes across the board to include some small amount to do this. ODOT's really needed this for 50 years anyway.

It's not going to be as much as you think either. As I said, the more broad the base, the lower the rate can be. When you expand that to the 4M people in the state, you're talking pennies on those taxes that add up. We could absolutely do this for very little. I've always been confused about why Oklahomans are so opposed to taxes to help with roads but then make roads their #1 complaint. The money has to come from somewhere....it doesn't magically just appear. Either you pay it as a ridiculously high toll, or you pay it in a tax that's MUCH lower. 5 cents at the pump 20 years ago would have gotten most of our projects completed a LONG time ago that are still puttering along. But we complain about adding 5 cents all the while the price of gas itself is a few DOLLARS more. The logic on the anti-tax mentality is just....well, confusing.

the turnpikes don't have to rethink any model .. they are set up to be fine with E vehicles ..

[rte66man]

The Turner Turnpike was the first of it's kind (toll road) west of the Mississippi when it was built and the original toll was $1.40, which adjusted for inflation from 1953 would be $16.54 today! To think about the millions of cars that have traveled that route over the last 70+ years!

What's interesting to me is that until just the last 10-15 years, there were still many rest stops built into the Turner Turnpike. Chandler and Kellyville both had Phillips 66 service stations, and Wellston ftfy and Bristow had McDonald's right off the turnpike in addition to the service plaza in Stroud that most are familiar with today that is now only west bound and the newer one near Chandler that is only east bound.

When the service areas were first opened, they all had a full service Howard Johnson's restaurant. EB at Chandler, Stroud, and Bristow; WB at Heyburn and Wellston. There was a dog-ugly pedestrian overpass for westbound traffic wanting to eat at the EB Stroud HoJo.

Gone are the picnic and rest areas (teepee picnic tables) that were abundant across Oklahoma turnpikes and highways.

Before they were removed, do you remember the composting toilet experiments at the picnic areas? I distinctly remember the EB one at MM18

[Plutonic Panda]

lol you would need to find a ton of money .. to maintain the toll roads ... creating an extra state wide tax is a non starter as it should be ..

Bullsh!t. Tons of other states have found a way to make this happen.

[gjl]

I got this email today.

Dear Valued Customer,

The Oklahoma Turnpike Authority wants to ensure you have direct and factual information about the toll increase approved by the OTA Board at its Dec. 10, 2024, regular monthly meeting.

Turnpike toll rates are set to ensure the Authority can meet its financial obligations as well as operate and maintain the turnpike system. The OTA does not receive any state tax appropriations and operates and maintains the system solely from toll revenue. This means that the cost to construct, maintain and operate the turnpike system is not an obligation of Oklahoma taxpayers; rather, these costs are borne by only those that travel on the system of which 40% are from out of state.

The toll rate increase goes into effect Jan. 1, 2025. As a PIKEPASS customer, you do not need to do anything differently when you travel a turnpike other than be aware of the average 1-penny per mile increase to PIKEPASS toll rates. As an example, today’s PIKEPASS rate to travel between Oklahoma City and Tulsa on the I-44/Turner Turnpike is $4.50. As of Jan. 1, the toll will be $5.40, which reflects the 1-penny per mile increase. You may find toll rates for the 11 turnpikes that will receive increases in the December Board meeting agenda packet starting on page 14: Agenda for 12-10-2024 OTA Board Meeting.pdf

This toll rate increase was designed to generate a 15 percent increase in toll revenues system wide but the specific toll rate increase for travel will vary by turnpike based on the amount of infrastructure improvements planned as part of the ACCESS Oklahoma long-range plan.

20 percent toll increase on the I-44/Turner, I-44/Will Rogers, I-344/John Kilpatrick and I-335/Kickapoo turnpikes.
15 percent toll increase on the I-44/H.E. Bailey, Creek, Indian Nation and Muskogee turnpikes.
10 percent toll increase on the Cimarron, Cherokee and Chickasaw turnpikes.
The Gilcrease Expressway in west Tulsa will not see a toll rate increase until early 2026 because it is on a separate trust indenture.

Also beginning Jan. 1, to simplify the tolling process, the classification of vehicles has been reduced from five toll categories of vehicles to three: small, medium, and large. These classifications are still based on the number of axles on a vehicle traveling the turnpike system.
Why a toll rate increase?

The ACCESS Oklahoma long-range plan is the most significant reinvestment into Oklahoma’s turnpike system since its inception in 1953. The ACCESS Oklahoma long-range plan was designed to address significant transportation needs on the existing turnpike system while also helping solve growing congestion, travel time reliability, and safety issues plaguing the state highway system, especially along the I-35 Southern Corridor between Moore and the Texas state line.

This 15-year plan features significant corridor widening projects that will bring the I-44/Turner Turnpike, the I-344/John Kilpatrick Turnpike, and portions of the I-44/Will Rogers Turnpike to six lanes. The long-range plan includes hundreds of projects from bridge and pavement reconstruction to adding new interchanges that improve access to local communities along the turnpike while also helping emergency response times. Three new routes are included that will complete the Oklahoma City Outer Loop, which started nearly 30 years ago with the construction of the John Kilpatrick Turnpike; and the addition of a Southern I-35 Corridor reliever route that will connect directly with the I-335/Kickapoo Turnpike at I-40.

It is common to see a toll rate increase when paying for a large investment in a system such as ACCESS Oklahoma. The last toll rate increase in 2019 impacted cash customers as part of the Driving Forward turnpike construction program. This new toll rate increase will be the 12th in OTA’s history.

In addition to the toll rate increase in 2025, there will be a 6 percent toll rate structure inflationary increase planned for implementation every other year starting Jan. 1, 2027. These rate adjustments will be reviewed annually in consultation with OTA’s traffic engineers as required by the Authority’s Trust Agreement. Upon review, the Board will consider adopting the inflationary adjustment to the schedule of tolls sometime before each effective date.

Even after this increase, OTA will still be one of the lowest toll rates in the nation, rising from an average 6-cents per mile to 7-cents per mile. This compares with a national tolling average of 22-cents per mile. And as a PIKEPASS customer, you will continue to enjoy the lowest toll rate possible.

Watch the Board meeting here for the full explanation by OTA Executive Director Joe Echelle during the Director’s Report toward the end of the video.

As you head into the new year, please ensure that your contact information, including your license plate number, is up to date on your PIKEPASS account. This will help us make sure that you continue to receive the lowest toll rate possible for your travel.

The Oklahoma Turnpike Authority appreciates your continued support as a PIKEPASS customer. If you have any questions or concerns about your account, please contact our Customer Service team at 1-800-PIKEPASS (1-800-745-3727).

[scottk]

In regards to the rate increases, it is what it is, if you have to drive to Tulsa, you take the Turner Turnpike, unless you want to add 35-45 minutes to your trip taking a free state highway and going through small towns.

I really feel for those without a PikePass or other state toll tag that has interoperability with OTA, if the math is right, a two axle vehicle with Plate Pay will pay $10.20 to travel the Turner Turnpike between Tulsa/OKC. The same vehicle was only paying $4.00 in 2016.

For someone who is more familiar with OTA financials, how much "cross pledging" is done between the Turnpikes? I feel like the Creek, Turner, and Kilpatrick traffic counts and tolls are heavily supporting to the rural, less traveled turnpikes, but could be completely wrong as the heavily used turnpikes could require way more upkeep in repaving and expansion of lanes.

Kilpatrick has portions pushing close to 90k vehicles a day, Creek has portions with 60k, and The Turner averages anywhere between 30k to 44.5 k vehicles daily. In comparison the Indian Nation is 20 miles longer than the Turner and gets only 3.7k to 8.9k (https://oklahoma.gov/ota/investor-re...y-traffic.html

[Jeremy Martin]

In regards to the rate increases, it is what it is, if you have to drive to Tulsa, you take the Turner Turnpike, unless you want to add 35-45 minutes to your trip taking a free state highway and going through small towns.

I really feel for those without a PikePass or other state toll tag that has interoperability with OTA, if the math is right, a two axle vehicle with Plate Pay will pay $10.20 to travel the Turner Turnpike between Tulsa/OKC. The same vehicle was only paying $4.00 in 2016.

For someone who is more familiar with OTA financials, how much "cross pledging" is done between the Turnpikes? I feel like the Creek, Turner, and Kilpatrick traffic counts and tolls are heavily supporting to the rural, less traveled turnpikes, but could be completely wrong as the heavily used turnpikes could require way more upkeep in repaving and expansion of lanes.

Kilpatrick has portions pushing close to 90k vehicles a day, Creek has portions with 60k, and The Turner averages anywhere between 30k to 44.5 k vehicles daily. In comparison the Indian Nation is 20 miles longer than the Turner and gets only 3.7k to 8.9k (https://oklahoma.gov/ota/investor-re...y-traffic.html

Without cross pledging the OTA would collapse. The Kilpatrick, Creek and Turner are the only turnpike roads that pay for themselves. Every other toll road in OK is heavily in the red.
For the OTA to survive it has to get new bonds issued to help cover the old debt. It amazes me that our legislature has allowed them to run uncontrolled for 70 years. And now they are asking for 8-10 BILLION more dollars to build more roads that history has shown won't pay for themselves. We will continue to have rate hikes to support this Ponzi scheme until the state legislature has the balls to get them under control. No other state entity could spend 8 BILLION dollars without legislative approval.

[mugofbeer]

Bullsh!t. Tons of other states have found a way to make this happen.

Please tell us how without increasing debt, taxes or fees? Tolls on certain highways are the best method because only the users pay the tolls and the tollways get built far faster.

[Plutonic Panda]

Please tell us how without increasing debt, taxes or fees? Tolls on certain highways are the best method because only the users pay the tolls and the tollways get built far faster.

There is no other way you’re gonna have to do one of the things you mentioned. I still think that would be better than tolling the highways. It’s kind of a moot point though to discuss this because it isn’t happening.

[bison34]

Bullsh!t. Tons of other states have found a way to make this happen.

Not when Oklahoma has to have a SUPERMAJORITY to raise any taxes. Hence why it is basically a nonstarter. Teachers basically had to strike to get a pay raise and more funding a few years ago.

[jn1780]

Without cross pledging the OTA would collapse. The Kilpatrick, Creek and Turner are the only turnpike roads that pay for themselves. Every other toll road in OK is heavily in the red.
For the OTA to survive it has to get new bonds issued to help cover the old debt. It amazes me that our legislature has allowed them to run uncontrolled for 70 years. And now they are asking for 8-10 BILLION more dollars to build more roads that history has shown won't pay for themselves. We will continue to have rate hikes to support this Ponzi scheme until the state legislature has the balls to get them under control. No other state entity could spend 8 BILLION dollars without legislative approval.

Legislature allows it because they know it's the only way to get new roads. OTA makes for a very useful boogeyman. OKC and Tulsa residents are the ones footing the bill for all the miles of state highways so it's not like "cross pledging" is unique to the turnpikes. Someone of these under utilized turnpikes are broken links that are part of long term plans. The Kickapoo is a good example that won't really be useful until the Norman bypass is built. That will take some traffic off of I-35 and who knows how long until ODOT actually gets funding to properly expand I35 from Norman to I-44.

I would also look at the history of all the turnpikes. Oklahoma legislature led the effort to get a lot of them built. Heck OTA wanted to give the Chickasaw turnpike back to ODOT at one point.

[Plutonic Panda]

I think giving ODOTs funding issues any expansion of the 35 from Norman to OKC will involve toll lanes. I imagine that would require new legislation since Oklahoma currently doesn’t have any of those.

[jn1780]

I think giving ODOTs funding issues any expansion of the 35 from Norman to OKC will involve toll lanes. I imagine that would require new legislation since Oklahoma currently doesn’t have any of those.

Agreed. We need express lane tolling. There is still a "free road" but it may be congested.

[BoulderSooner]

Without cross pledging the OTA would collapse. The Kilpatrick, Creek and Turner are the only turnpike roads that pay for themselves. Every other toll road in OK is heavily in the red.
For the OTA to survive it has to get new bonds issued to help cover the old debt. It amazes me that our legislature has allowed them to run uncontrolled for 70 years. And now they are asking for 8-10 BILLION more dollars to build more roads that history has shown won't pay for themselves. We will continue to have rate hikes to support this Ponzi scheme until the state legislature has the balls to get them under control. No other state entity could spend 8 BILLION dollars without legislative approval.

the system is crossed pledged because the PEOPLE of OKLAHOMA VOTED to cross pledge the system .... the system does pay for itself ... PERIOD

[BoulderSooner]

Even after this increase, OTA will still be one of the lowest toll rates in the nation, rising from an average 6-cents per mile to 7-cents per mile. This compares with a national tolling average of 22-cents per mile. And as a PIKEPASS customer, you will continue to enjoy the lowest toll rate possible.
.

This is kind of key ..