New Arena (formerly Prairie Surf)

[Pete]

I don't think we should compare Inglewood to downtown OKC. There are more people in a 5 mile radius of that area than most, if not all, of OKC.

Not sure why someone tried to earlier.

Was just addressing the comment that our arena will have more to do in the immediate area.

The Intuit Dome is just a small part of a massive development that is only getting started.


It's funny to think about but when the Staples Center opened in downtown L.A., I was working only a few blocks away and there was almost nothing around that arena but vacant lots. Today, L.A. Live is directly adjacent and the entire area has been filled in with all types of very dense development, including a bunch of high-rises.

[bison34]

Was just addressing the comment that our arena will have more to do in the immediate area.

The Intuit Dome is just a small part of a massive development that is only getting started.


It's funny to think about but when the Staples Center opened in downtown L.A., I was working only a few blocks away and there was almost nothing around that arena but vacant lots. Today, L.A. Live is directly adjacent and the entire area has been filled in with all types of very dense development, including a bunch of high-rises.

Oklahoma City needs innovative, but also proven, developers for the land around the new arena. This good ol boy, back room BS needs to be thrown out the window for this area, especially.

I didn't realize the Staples Center was in an almost empty part of downtown LA before it was built.

[BoulderSooner]

Oklahoma City needs innovative, but also proven, developers for the land around the new arena. This good ol boy, back room BS needs to be thrown out the window for this area, especially.

I didn't realize the Staples Center was in an almost empty part of downtown LA before it was built.

the team owners get market rate ground lease for that land in their agreement ..

[bison34]

the team owners get market rate ground lease for that land in their agreement ..

Well, hopefully it won't sit empty like the land next to the Paycom Center. I can see them just sitting on it. Altruism wasn't shown in putting like, 5% of the total project budget up, so I have doubts they will try to get this developed correctly or quickly.

[caaokc]

Well, hopefully it won't sit empty like the land next to the Paycom Center. I can see them just sitting on it. Altruism wasn't shown in putting like, 5% of the total project budget up, so I have doubts they will try to get this developed correctly or quickly.

I’d imagine they’ll move more quickly considering how expensive this team is about to get.

[Urbanized]

Well, hopefully it won't sit empty like the land next to the Paycom Center. I can see them just sitting on it. Altruism wasn't shown in putting like, 5% of the total project budget up, so I have doubts they will try to get this developed correctly or quickly.

Altruism isn’t what will be driving development on this site. I’m not sure I understand why that’s even a part of your calculation when discussing commercial real estate development of this type. It will be developed as quickly as possible. In fact I’d expect the development to roughly coincide with the arena’s construction.

[bison34]

Altruism isn’t what will be driving development on this site. I’m not sure I understand why that’s even a part of your calculation when discussing commercial real estate development of this type. It will be developed as quickly as possible. In fact I’d expect the development to roughly coincide with the arena’s construction.

Sure, sure. I am sure plenty of people said similar things with the RECOH land, yet it may sit empty for 10 more years, and has already been empty for decades.

I hope you are right, though.

[Urbanized]

So much hyperbole. The REHCO site was an operating (and very successful) car dealership from 1923 to 2011. It’s been a little over a decade, NOT “decades” - several years of which were pandemic-impacted - and during that time it was also briefly in flux due to consideration for the arena site.

The owners were also well aware during much of that time (meaning most of the past decade) that there would be a new arena, one that would likely land NEAR that property if not on it. They almost certainly didn’t want to make rash decisions that would limit possibilities before the arena election and the location decision was made.

I swear the development entitlement that people on here have regarding privately-owned property that doesn’t belong to them (or the City) is baffling to me. Sometimes it takes time (and strategy) to do things correctly and to not needlessly suffer opportunity cost. There’s a term for this: patient money.

We aren’t OWED anything when it comes to the REHCO site. But there’s also no doubt in my mind that the group that controls that land will develop something great there in due time, now that the arena location is settled. They’re legitimately the most accomplished local urban development team in this city at this point.

The surplus property on the site of the new arena is an entirely different proposition. It’s controlled under agreement by the Thunder, who’ve made no secret of their desire (and need) to wring every dollar out of the fan experience, and their intention to pursue current NBA trends and best practices in this regard. As of today that means contiguous entertainment options that capitalize on team connection and arena proximity. That site is likely to be developed so fast that it will make our heads spin.

[bison34]

So much hyperbole. The REHCO site was an operating (and very successful) car dealership from 1923 to 2011. It’s been a little over a decade, NOT “decades” - several years of which were pandemic-impacted - and during that time it was also briefly in flux due to consideration for the arena site.

The owners were also well aware during much of that time (meaning most of the past decade) that there would be a new arena, one that would likely land NEAR that property if not on it. They almost certainly didn’t want to make rash decisions that would limit possibilities before the arena election and the location decision was made.

I swear the development entitlement that people on here have regarding privately-owned property that doesn’t belong to them (or the City) is baffling to me. Sometimes it takes time (and strategy) to do things correctly and to not needlessly suffer opportunity cost. There’s a term for this: patient money.

We aren’t OWED anything when it comes to the REHCO site. But there’s also no doubt in my mind that the group that controls that land will develop something great there in due time, now that the arena location is settled. They’re legitimately the most accomplished local urban development team in this city at this point.

The surplus property on the site of the new arena is an entirely different proposition. It’s controlled under agreement by the Thunder, who’ve made no secret of their desire (and need) to wring every dollar out of the fan experience, and their intention to pursue current NBA trends and best practices in this regard. As of today that means contiguous entertainment options that capitalize on team connection and arena proximity. That site is likely to be developed so fast that it will make our heads spin.

It is more because so many large-scale private developments have been either tempered or cancelled completely/delayed with no beginning in sight. The Hub on Broadway, Boulevard Place, Alley's End (may finally be about to start), Alley North has already taken a hit (even if getting Pappadeaux's is great, the quality of the overall development will be hurt, IMO), all within 1 or 2 miles of the arena. Just seeing all these large developments not moving forward or stalled, it begins to wear on you. I know it happens everywhere around the country, and there are plenty of successful developments in the city. But the misses have been big.

And I didn't even mention the Boardwalk at Bricktown disaster in that list.

The arena will happen, and will be immaculate, no doubt. The quality team working on it guarantees that. We shall see if the land surrounding it will live up to that same potential. I hope it does. There is immense potential, and just needs the right developers with the right depth of pockets.

[Urbanized]

I get holding a grudge against stalled developments on OCURA (publicly-owned) land and/or ones that tie up public incentives. Although I also understand that sometimes spreadsheets, unexpectedly spiraling interest rates, materials costs and other factors can conspire to change and/or kill projects. It’s reality.

But the REHCO site is a very different animal from most of what you’ve cited, and the Thunder’s development of the arena site’s contiguous property is vastly different from ALL of the above.

[dankrutka]

For me, I recognize being patient with the REHCO site. It's very important to get the development at that site right. Having said that, they could have spent a little money to improve the aesthetics of the property. It's been a total eyesore for over a decade right in the middle of two massive public investments (about to be 3 with the arena) which they'll massively profit from. It's just disappointing that such a super visible part of OKC as an ugly surface lot for so long.

[Pete]

For me, I recognize being patient with the REHCO site. It's very important to get the development at that site right. Having said that, they could have spent a little money to improve the aesthetics of the property. It's been a total eyesore for over a decade right in the middle of two massive public investments (about to be 3 with the arena) which they'll massively profit from. It's just disappointing that such a super visible part of OKC as an ugly surface lot for so long.

They also make a ton of money from Thunder contract parking as well as all the events downtown.

Those lots are pretty disgraceful, especially since they have been in use for a decade. Not exactly a temporary situation.

[April in the Plaza]

I went to the Thunder-Clippers game on Saturday at the Intuit Dome, and there's a lot OKC can learn from the arena even if the price points are different. Here's some main points:

- Intuit Dome App: To attend the game you have to download the Intuit Dome app and provide them a bevy of information, including biometric data. Every person (unless a minor) has to have the app. It's the worst experience I've ever had related to attending a sporting event. Completing all the components of the app required 3-4 hours, primarily because it didn't work. For example, it took 1 hour alone just to get a confirmation code for my wife to create an account. After one hour, she received like 25 confirmation codes all at once. The app is also incredibly invasive and even requires creating a CLEAR account, taking pictures, uploading your driver's license. I had already bought the tickets or I would have opted out. I felt very violated, but I guess I should have expected it from a big tech guy like Balmer.

i wonder if a city owned arena would have a harder time incorporating this type of trash.

heard Intuit also has microphones in every seat. no thanks.

[jn1780]

i wonder if a city owned arena would have a harder time incorporating this type of trash.

heard Intuit also has microphones in every seat. no thanks.

I bet they yank those out in a few years.

[jn1780]

The bar is set really high on the REHCO and now Boardwalk site.

[PokeFromOk]

Urbanized,
Appreciate the color here on REHCO. You mentioned REHCO ownership group above, who actually owns the site and is there any overlap with Thunder ownership? At one point, I thought there was but a little unsure now.

Agree that getting this right is very important and patience was smart. Hopefully they will start kicking tires on development ideas once the renderings for the new arena start coming out next year. Would think they would need to see what the plan for the area surrounding the new Arena will be and even perhaps what the plan for the Paycom site will be before they move, but hopefully those data points will start coming into focus in the next year or so and then they can start planning in earnest on what will work best here.

[Pete]

Reminder of what these lots look like.

Really atrocious and right in the middle of about a billion $ of public investment (soon to be multi-billions).

The City should have required them to bring these properties up to Downtown Design Review standards before they were awarded the massive parking contracts for the Thunder games.

[cinnamonjock]

They really are a hodgepodge mess and are very visible in aerial shots of the arena.

[warreng88]

Reminder of what these lots look like.

Really atrocious and right in the middle of about a billion $ of public investment (soon to be multi-billions).

The City should have required them to bring these properties up to Downtown Design Review standards before they were awarded the massive parking contracts for the Thunder games.

I understand why the city redid the SW 2nd and Harvey curb cuts, but I feel like when the development is done on the area, the whole intersection will most likely be closed and redeveloped.

[Pete]

I understand why the city redid the SW 2nd and Harvey curb cuts, but I feel like when the development is done on the area, the whole intersection will most likely be closed and redeveloped.

When the Ford dealership closed in 2011, Fred Hall & Co. said they were working on development plans.

That was 13 years ago and absolutely nothing has happened here since. At some point, the City has to go forward, especially since that area lies between two incredibly popular parks, with lots of people walking back and forth and the streetcar stop right there.


Whatever happens here, I know there is a priority of maintaining the "Harvey Spine" as that is indicated in all long-term planning docs.

It probably won't remain a street for cars, but whatever does happen would require REHCO petitioning to close those streets and obtain rights to develop on City land -- and likely pay handsomely.

[CaptDave]

I feel like when the development is done on the area, the whole intersection will most likely be closed and redeveloped.

Hopefully not. That area could become something special with two parks on either side and a $1B arena coming. This area and the Paycom site could radically transform the urban core of OKC if developed by someone willing to do the extra work and not go for the quickest and easiest buck with a lowest common denominator plan. (Like Lower Bricktown)

[Duane821]

This might be a waste of the space, but my dream for this area would be to recreate a small historic district with 1, 2, and 3 story brick buildings, etc. (much like what was lost during urban renewal). Maybe even mimic some of the iconic OKC buildings that were lost during that time, at least on the facade side.

Cool storefronts on the ground floor with loft apartments on the upper floors.

I believe this would be incredible placed between the Myriad Gardens and Scissortail Park and would add a lot of charm to the area and more housing downtown. Great infill.

I feel like more and more people are looking for these kinds of step-back-in-time experiences (think downtown Guthrie), although I recognize the new build facet of it might make it seem cheap.

Just a thought.

[bison34]

This might be a waste of the space, but my dream for this area would be to recreate a small historic district with 1, 2, and 3 story brick buildings, etc. (much like what was lost during urban renewal). Maybe even mimic some of the iconic OKC buildings that were lost during that time, at least on the facade side.

Cool storefronts on the ground floor with loft apartments on the upper floors.

I believe this would be incredible placed between the Myriad Gardens and Scissortail Park and would add a lot of charm to the area and more housing downtown. Great infill.

I feel like more and more people are looking for these kinds of step-back-in-time experiences (think downtown Guthrie), although I recognize the new build facet of it might make it seem cheap.

Just a thought.

Too much demand there for 3 story buildings to be it. Need mid or even hi-rise to make it fiscally make sense.

[Jake]

Some massive surface lots. You could fit an entire Pappadeux down there.

[BoulderSooner]

When the Ford dealership closed in 2011, Fred Hall & Co. said they were working on development plans.

That was 13 years ago and absolutely nothing has happened here since. At some point, the City has to go forward, especially since that area lies between two incredibly popular parks, with lots of people walking back and forth and the streetcar stop right there.


Whatever happens here, I know there is a priority of maintaining the "Harvey Spine" as that is indicated in all long-term planning docs.

It probably won't remain a street for cars, but whatever does happen would require REHCO petitioning to close those streets and obtain rights to develop on City land -- and likely pay handsomely.

the city actually presented to the planning commission to close those streets ... a long time ago .... it was continued forever then removed from the agenda ..