National Basketball Association

[davidreavis]

Dude made over $5.6MM per W. Biggest coaching fleece in NBA history.

Holy... Inflation is a real deal

[FighttheGoodFight]

As I understood, Monty didn't want to coach last season with his wife having cancer but couldn't say no to 65 million guaranteed. Good for him. Pistons make another poor decision.

[Jersey Boss]

I am surprised that Flipkowski was not picked first round.

[Jersey Boss]

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...majority-stake
Celtics put up for sale.

[dankrutka]

I am surprised that Flipkowski was not picked first round.

Read up on his girlfriend and family situation. Not a Thunder guy.

[FighttheGoodFight]

Read up on his girlfriend and family situation. Not a Thunder guy.

But for sure a Utah guy

[Dob Hooligan]

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...majority-stake
Celtics put up for sale.

Strike when the iron is hot. Looks like the main ownership got in 20 years ago when they were probably in their 40s-50s. Team values are obviously very high now. I think this is an other era where the ownership structure of the NBA is going to fundamentally change. It is still American, and individuals, for the most part and from what I can tell. But we will soon be at a level where Sovereign Wealth and Private Equity funds are going be a large portion of the available ownership capital.

[Laramie]

[dankrutka]

Without watching the video, it seems like Seattle and Las Vegas are foregone conclusions for expansion at this point.

[Dob Hooligan]

Without watching the video, it seems like Seattle and Las Vegas are foregone conclusions for expansion at this point.

Just so's I could respond to you with knowledge, I listened to all 9 plus minutes. He says Seattle and Las Vegas. Seattle a certainty, and Las Vegas probably. He has zero new insights, or information. Simply regurgitating what he has read elsewhere. I do not think he has a good understanding of business. I would suggest the VAST majority of sportswriters are like him. He guesses Mexico City is the third option.

He suggests that there are both a $5 billion arena proposal, and a separate $10 billion arena/hotel/casino on the Las Vegas Strip. Both privately funded. The $5 billion arena is probably the All Net Arena pipe dream that Jackie Robinson has been pitching for the former Wet' n' Wild location just south of the Sahara. Robinson has been selling this for 15 years with no money or real movement. The $10 billion proposal is probably the Oak View Group's massive complex located down by the South Point Hotel Casino. I recall reading late last year, an attendance projection for this arena that amounted to more than 2 sold out events daily @18,000 per.


He describes Las Vegas as a "Cash Cow". I do not think Las Vegas has enough population to support teams in NHL, NBA, NFL and MLB. The assumption that visitors will the travel to see their favorite team in "Vegas" rapidly dissipates with a game frequency of more than 20 per year. He appeared to state Las Vegas was closer to Denver than California, and didn't seem to realize Las Vegas is in the Pacific Time Zone.

He repeatedly mentions another expansion team in Canada, yet never mentions Montreal. Makes me doubt his knowledge. He continually mentions "maybe Vancouver".

I however, will repeat my opinion that Seattle and Louisville Kentuckey are the two cities.

You heard it here first.

And I will promptly eat crow here if I am wrong.

[Laramie]

Louisville IMO would definitely go ape over an NBA franchise and would be among the best small markets.

The KMC 'Yum' arena seats 22,090 for NBA basketball--they could potential be among the NBA's Top 3 attendance getters.

We don't know if the NBA would put Louisville another 'small market' over Seattle or Las Vegas. Louisville has two Fortune 500 companies, similar to OKC.

NBA has New Orleans (58), Salt Lake City (46), Memphis (45), Oklahoma City (42) and Milwaukee (40) as the smallest markets all below 2 million MSA populations. Louisville would fall one notch below OKC at (43).

[BoulderSooner]

I however, will repeat my opinion that Seattle and Louisville Kentuckey are the two cities.

You heard it here first.

And I will promptly eat crow here if I am wrong.

Seattle and Vegas it was decided a long time ago ..

[FighttheGoodFight]

Seattle and Vegas it was decided a long time ago ..

Yep no doubt it is Seattle and Vegas. Nothing else will even be considered. Been a known secret for years.

[Dob Hooligan]

Yep no doubt it is Seattle and Vegas. Nothing else will even be considered. Been a known secret for years.

This is not argumentative....but, can anyone here walk me through the numbers and make it add up? I have heard this "done deal" from Bill Simmons and others for years. I never hear any real numbers about franchise fee, start up costs, arena, local market size and sports dollar saturation, etc. Ownership structure doesn't matter for any team anymore-people with the money will go to any city that is available. LeBron might want to be an owner. But even if he came in with a genuine, real, free cash $100 million, that would give him 2% of a team with a $4 billion expansion fee and $500 million start up costs. Also, take in to account that any expansion team will have to forfeit a substantial amount of the new media rights revenue.

The richest woman in Las Vegas decided that buying the Dallas Mavericks and "betting" on Texas casino gaming would be a better use of her money than a Las Vegas expansion team.

Also, add two teams to the Pacific Time Zone and see how that affects viewing numbers and their value. The Pac-12 died because their late start times were less valuable than the Big-12 Central and Eastern Time Zone start times.

[BoulderSooner]

This is not argumentative....but, can anyone here walk me through the numbers and make it add up? I have heard this "done deal" from Bill Simmons and others for years. I never hear any real numbers about franchise fee, start up costs, arena, local market size and sports dollar saturation, etc. Ownership structure doesn't matter for any team anymore-people with the money will go to any city that is available. LeBron might want to be an owner. But even if he came in with a genuine, real, free cash $100 million, that would give him 2% of a team with a $4 billion expansion fee and $500 million start up costs. Also, take in to account that any expansion team will have to forfeit a substantial amount of the new media rights revenue.

The richest woman in Las Vegas decided that buying the Dallas Mavericks and "betting" on Texas casino gaming would be a better use of her money than a Las Vegas expansion team.

Also, add two teams to the Pacific Time Zone and see how that affects viewing numbers and their value. The Pac-12 died because their late start times were less valuable than the Big-12 Central and Eastern Time Zone start times.

8-10 billion ... owners don't have to share that money with players ..

that is a quick cash payment of 300 mil +/- to each owner ship team ..

and the new media deal goes from 1/30 owners share to 1/32 owners share .. (expansion teams won't forfeit any media revenue )

[Laramie]

Here’s what NBA’s new media-rights deal means for possible Sonics return | Analysis: https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/...turn-analysis/

Now that NBA owners know they are guaranteed $6.9 billion annually from national TV alone, they can go about setting an expansion fee. That fee, expected to top $4 billion, would generate immediate cash for each of the 30 teams that wouldn’t be subject to revenue sharing with players. It would enable owners to offset pandemic-related shortfalls and the future loss of broadcast revenue from the new TV package because they would need to share it among 32 teams instead of 30.

Imagine the rivalry with Oklahoma City that will be created upon the return of the NBA to the Emerald City.

[Dob Hooligan]

8-10 billion ... owners don't have to share that money with players ..

that is a quick cash payment of 300 mil +/- to each owner ship team ..

and the new media deal goes from 1/30 owners share to 1/32 owners share .. (expansion teams won't forfeit any media revenue )

Make the numbers add up. Source it from the NBA, and not Bill Simmons or Stephen A.

$8-10 billion puts the NBA within the revenue universe of the NFL. Show me how that pencils out. It is not possible.

Why would an NBA owner give up over 5% of their media money for a new partner?

Give me a source and make it add up.

[Dob Hooligan]

Here’s what NBA’s new media-rights deal means for possible Sonics return | Analysis: https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/...turn-analysis/



Imagine the rivalry with Oklahoma City that will be created upon the return of the NBA to the Emerald City.

That is a good story. Thank you for that. Suggest everyone here read it.

[FighttheGoodFight]

Make the numbers add up. Source it from the NBA, and not Bill Simmons or Stephen A.

$8-10 billion puts the NBA within the revenue universe of the NFL. Show me how that pencils out. It is not possible.

Why would an NBA owner give up over 5% of their media money for a new partner?

Give me a source and make it add up.

I’m guessing the media deal included the 2 teams already.

[BoulderSooner]

Make the numbers add up. Source it from the NBA, and not Bill Simmons or Stephen A.

$8-10 billion puts the NBA within the revenue universe of the NFL. Show me how that pencils out. It is not possible.

Why would an NBA owner give up over 5% of their media money for a new partner?

Give me a source and make it add up.

I will use the 6.9 B figure from the Seattle times ..

6.9B / 30 is 230 mil a year

6.9B /32 is 215 mil a year ...

so yeah owners will give up 15 mil a year of future money for an upfront cash payment of 300 million dollars ..

[BoulderSooner]

Make the numbers add up. Source it from the NBA, and not Bill Simmons or Stephen A.

$8-10 billion puts the NBA within the revenue universe of the NFL. Show me how that pencils out. It is not possible.

Why would an NBA owner give up over 5% of their media money for a new partner?

Give me a source and make it add up.

the 8-10 billion is what those teams will sell for .. If you don't believe so I don't know what to tell you .... there are only 30 NBA teams in the world (soon to be 32) that alone gives them value ..

[Dob Hooligan]

the 8-10 billion is what those teams will sell for .. If you don't believe so I don't know what to tell you .... there are only 30 NBA teams in the world (soon to be 32) that alone gives them value ..

I know the numbers being tossed around. Yet, I also notice that within the last year, the NHL Coyotes sold for a "reported $1.2 billion", The MLB Baltimore Orioles sold for $1.73 billion, and the NFL Washington Commanders sold for $6.05 billion. While I do understand the NBA has its house in incredible order, is growing in international popularity, and is the first in this new wave of medial deals, $5 billion for an expansion team is hard to understand from a dollars and cents standpoint.

Regardless, I think we headed for an unprecedented number of franchise sales in the next 5-10 years. The Celtics are signaling that the people that have been in over the last 20 years and longer are going to cash out, and the financial requirements of this explosive growth are going to make "lifers" like the Buss family unable to keep up.

[BoulderSooner]

I know the numbers being tossed around. Yet, I also notice that within the last year, the NHL Coyotes sold for a "reported $1.2 billion", The MLB Baltimore Orioles sold for $1.73 billion, and the NFL Washington Commanders sold for $6.05 billion. While I do understand the NBA has its house in incredible order, is growing in international popularity, and is the first in this new wave of medial deals, $5 billion for an expansion team is hard to understand from a dollars and cents standpoint.

Regardless, I think we headed for an unprecedented number of franchise sales in the next 5-10 years. The Celtics are signaling that the people that have been in over the last 20 years and longer are going to cash out, and the financial requirements of this explosive growth are going to make "lifers" like the Buss family unable to keep up.

season to season "profit" is not really as important as growth of franchise values ...

but i do agree that the NBA in particular might be hitting a bubble of value .. (which might be why mark cuban sold his team) ..

i will also add that the new (just started CBA) and its 2 aprons basically function as a hard cap .. . so every team will be able to compete money wise ..

[Urbanized]

As valuations go up the approach to ownership takes on a much more corporate veneer. Owning a team used to be more of a hobby for many, and it was very common to lose money on the deal. Family and multi-generational ownership made more sense. Now valuations have taken these team valuations into the realm of Fortune 500 company market caps. As recently as the eighties you could buy a major league team for a few million bucks.

I think you will see more and more flips, but you will also see much more in the way of succession planning, investor GROUPS rather than single owners, etc.

[BoulderSooner]

As valuations go up the approach to ownership takes on a much more corporate veneer. Owning a team used to be more of a hobby for many, and it was very common to lose money on the deal. Family and multi-generational ownership made more sense. Now valuations have taken these team valuations into the realm of Fortune 500 company market caps. As recently as the eighties you could buy a major league team for a few million bucks.

I think you will see more and more flips, but you will also see much more in the way of succession planning, investor GROUPS rather than single owners, etc.

I think you will also start to see Sovereign wealth funds .. own NBA teams

but at the end of the day when there are only 30 or 32 of something in the entire world .. you will have people that want to be owners ..