Oklahoma City Chiefs

[April in the Plaza]

"The defeat Tuesday of a three-eighths cent sales tax to fund a new downtown Royals ballpark and renovate the Chiefs’ Arrowhead Stadium was almost assuredly not the end of the matter. Other teams and cities have faced similar setbacks, and that hasn’t slowed a wave of stadium construction underway across the U.S."

https://apnews.com/article/royals-ch...037ebc5b2dcc47

What's the possibility of bringing the Chiefs to OKC? :-)

Nah. We're already subsidizing enough new buildings for folks who have sufficient capital to build and maintain the buildings themselves.

[Laramie]

they both might leave KCM

there is a real chance they both move to KCK

Glendale, AZ - 252,136 - 248,325 (+1.53%) - NFL, rejected NHL Arizona Coyotes. Facilities for NHL
Kansas City, KS - 153,345 - 156,607 (−2.08%) - MLS stadium. No facilities for NFL or MLB.

Just don't see it happening--Kansas City, KS offering $2.8 billion subsidies for an NFL and MLB stadiums. It would take them (KCK) five years to plan and build infrastructure to move those franchises if they passed and approved $3 billion in subsidies this year for two stadiums. The State of Kansas would have to kick in some funds as well as a city the size of KCK offering to subsidize the bulk of the project.

.

[Laramie]

It would be a disaster for Oklahoma City to bring in an NFL franchise in addition to supporting the Thunder. Our city's MSA is 1,477,926; half-a-million shy for supporting two big league franchises.

There are 4.088 million in the State. Another big league franchise in OKC would put the NBA Thunder in shock and kill the Oklahoma Sooners' football and sports programs..

[jbkrems]

It would be a disaster for Oklahoma City to bring in an NFL franchise in addition to supporting the Thunder. Our city's MSA is 1,477,926; half-a-million shy for supporting two big league franchises.

There are 4.088 million in the State. Another big league franchise in OKC would put the NBA Thunder in shock and kill the Oklahoma Sooners' football and sports programs..

What about Arena or other minor league football ??? Would that also be a disaster?

[Swake]

Glendale, AZ - 252,136 - 248,325 (+1.53%) - NFL, rejected NHL Arizona Coyotes. Facilities for NHL
Kansas City, KS - 153,345 - 156,607 (−2.08%) - MLS stadium. No facilities for NFL or MLB.

Just don't see it happening--Kansas City, KS offering $2.8 billion subsidies for an NFL and MLB stadiums. It would take them (KCK) five years to plan and build infrastructure to move those franchises if they passed and approved $3 billion in subsidies this year for two stadiums. The State of Kansas would have to kick in some funds as well as a city the size of KCK offering to subsidize the bulk of the project.

.

The state of Kansas is reportedly backing the plan. Almost half the metro is in Kansas, along with much of the money. Don't just look at KCK, look at Johnson County, KS. Jackson County, MO is where the tax plan for the teams failed, but next door Johnson County, KS is nearly the same size and much wealthier. Most of Kansas City, MO is in Jackson County while Johnson County is Overland Park, Olathe and a bunch of other towns.

Part of why the plan failed is that both stadiums are today among the best stadiums in MLB/NFL. The Royals' stadium is really only 14 years old since it was completely rebuilt. People in KC love both stadiums but hate where they are. Access to the Truman Sports Complex sucks and it is in a terrible, even depressing, area. I'm not sure holding a vote in Kansas changes those feelings.

[scottk]

Just a guess but I bet before long I bet there will be a new proposal put up for vote with just the Arrowhead upgrades in it. I think that would have passed easily. It's been my experience that KC is like St. Louis but backwards. I go in KC stores and there are racks and racks of Chiefs gear and a corner of Royals gear. St. Louis is the other way with the Cards vs. the Blues and the NFL teams that moved. So I don't think the Chiefs are going anywhere.

I agree if this was a split vote, where Question 1- Arrowhead Upgrades and Question 2 was Royals New Stadium...Arrowhead Stadium improvements would have passed easily.

[Elrenogolf]

Kansas has had a fund to attract pro sports teams since they set up sports betting in September 2022. The state gets about a 10% cut of sports betting revenue, and 80% of the tax revenue collected is supposed to be earmarked for that fund.

[mugofbeer]

I agree if this was a split vote, where Question 1- Arrowhead Upgrades and Question 2 was Royals New Stadium...Arrowhead Stadium improvements would have passed easily.

Local sports hosts interviewed the owner of the Rockies before their local opening day. He agreed with this statement and noted the bond issue to build the much less expensive current Bronchos stadium only passed 51 - 48% 20 years ago. That was also after a championship season. There was also something about a very expensive remodel of the Chiefs owners suite at the same time they were pushing for the stadium package that went over very badly.

[Laramie]

What about Arena or other minor league football ??? Would that also be a disaster?

Don't get me wrong, I would love to have NFL Chiefs in OKC, what a rivalry we would have with Dallas, Denver and Houston. Our population numbers and state corporate sponsorships don't add up. An NFL stadium in OKC would cost at least $1.5 billion.

Arena football didn't make it here when we had an original AFL (Portland Forest Dragons) franchise relocated here; later AF2 came to the city. Arena football never caught fire in OKC.

IMO Oklahoma City MSA should attempt to lure a spring football league like the United Football League (UFL) to either Edmond (12,000 seat Richison Stadium) or Norman (84,000 seat GF Memorial Stadium lower bowl) until we get the MAPS 4 multi-purpose stadium built increasing the seating capacity from 8,000 to 20,000 with the addition an upper deck..

The MAPS 4 Multi-purpose stadium needs to be ready to bring in another anchor tenant based on the track record of the Funk's USL OKC Energy.

[Bill Robertson]

Don't get me wrong, I would love to have NFL Chiefs in OKC, what a rivalry we would have with Dallas, Denver and Houston. Our population numbers and state corporate sponsorships don't add up. An NFL stadium in OKC would cost at least $1.5 billion.

Arena football didn't make it here when we had an original AFL (Portland Forest Dragons) franchise relocated here; later AF2 came to the city. Arena football never caught fire in OKC.

IMO Oklahoma City MSA should attempt to lure a spring football league like the United Football League (UFL) to either Edmond (12,000 seat Richison Stadium) or Norman (84,000 seat GF Memorial Stadium lower bowl) until we get the MAPS 4 multi-purpose stadium built increasing the seating capacity from 8,000 to 20,000 with the addition an upper deck..

The MAPS 4 Multi-purpose stadium needs to be ready to bring in another anchor tenant based on the track record of the Funk's USL OKC Energy.

While I happen to like both arena FB and spring FB neither seem to be more than barely existing. The two spring FB leagues merged and dropped a bunch of teams in the process. Arena FB looks like they're having their first season this year since filing for bankruptcy in 2019. I doubt very seriously that OKC could get either. Or really even want either.

[BoulderSooner]

The NFL prettty much works ANYWHERE and would work in OKC

[Elrenogolf]

Saw an article on ESPN about a hypothetical situation where the NFL expanded to 100 teams and choosing which cities would get teams. Although this is meant to be a silly article, I thought the OKC comment was interesting:

Oklahoma City, Oklahoma: OKC might be on the shortlist for potential NFL expansion sites in the real world given the city's population, affinity for football and support for the Thunder once they arrived in town in 2008. It's an easy pick, regardless of which division it ends up participating in.

[Jersey Boss]

The NFL prettty much works ANYWHERE and would work in OKC

Except St. Louis and San Diego

[BoulderSooner]

Except St. Louis and San Diego

worked in both places ... the cities didn't build a new stadium and the teams left .... (because football works everywhere) ...

the fact that any team can move (see buffalo's threat) and work proves my point .

[Jersey Boss]

^ So you did not mention the qualifier of stadium paid for by tax payers. Odd though that the owner of the Rams paid $5B out of his pocket for LA stadium but would not do that in St. Louis. Not every NFL stadium is bankrolled by the tax payers.

[Urbanized]

Pretty easy to understand...the ROI in Los Angeles is probably 10x the ROI in St Louis. One approach is not any more magnanimous than the other; one just makes far more sense on a spreadsheet.

[TornadoKegan]

Not happening they are relocating to the Kansas side of KC

[Laramie]

The only way you're going to get a 'glance' from the NFL to Oklahoma City is to build a 75,000 seat retractable roof state-of-the-art stadium: that would be a long-long shot. A stadium could be built on a $750 million investment. OKC with an increase in downtown hotels would be in a position to attract a once-in-a-lifetime event like the NCAA basketball final four. NFL would take better risks in markets like San Diego, San Antonio or St. Louis. San Antonio-Austin combined MSA's boasts 5.2 million people--twice that of Oklahoma City-Tulsa-Stillwater markets..

Because Oklahoma's current population would be hard pressed to support three D1 college football teams (100 mile radius) and the NFL, all would risk taking a hit.

Much like San Antonio building the Alamodome, you run the risk of investing in a stadium with no guarantee that an expansion or relocation franchise would come. You might get on the short list for a UFL franchise.

Let's not forget St. Louis' investment in the 67,200 seat Dome at America's Center built in 1992 at a cost of $280 million ($560 million in 2023 dollars) -- the facility wasn't 'quality' enough to keep an NFL franchise in Missouri's largest city with a MSA population of 2.7 million same size as San Antonio. Difference being St. Louis supports MLB as well.

[HOT ROD]

I dont understand/agree with your theory Larry (OMG, don't hate me). How?? Can Oklahoma NOT support two D1 and an NFL team when the D1 plays on Sat 12 times per year (OU and OSU put together 2024) and the NFL plays 9 Sundays (Seattle Seahawks sched 2024). We're already doing the D1 so we're basically adding the 9 Sunday games with an NFL team. Are you SURE? Oklahoma couldn't do that? Football crazed Oklahoma!!!

Now, I think we do need to expand our corporate base, continue to increase our metro population (and state pop increase would also help), and (of course) build a stadium. But IF we do these three things, I have no DOUBT Oklahoma City and the state/region would support a team. Those (to me) are the only issues, not the other aformentioned. Perhaps we could get there with the BOOST Oklahoma City is very likely from all of the announcements by 2030.

Once we get above 2 million metro, more corporate presence, and then vote in 2030 for a stadium - no doubt would the NFL arrival in (say) 2035 would be hugely successful (especially if Bennett and Co are owners), and appropriate.

[Laramie]

^ ^ ^
Again, you and Dan are my favorite posters--you guys have always contributed to this forum on many subjects.

Good points about the dates especially with D1 games on Saturdays and NFL games on Sundays.

Our corporate base will continue to expand with incentives (Business expansion/relocation) like the Oklahoma Quality Jobs Act: https://www.okcommerce.gov/doing-bus...ntive-program/

As for a stadium, have an extension vote once you pay off the NBA arena for a 75,000-seat retractable roof state-of-the-art indoor stadium that could be used by Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Langston, and some NFL exhibition games. Revive the All College Holiday Tournament for the new NBA arena.

The MAPS 4 Multipurpose Stadium (IIRC has a budget of $71 million for 8,000 seats) could be converted into a retractable roof stadium with an increase of 62,000 seats by extending the NBA arena tax by $650 million
for a State-of-the-art retractable roof stadium. This won't guarantee OKC an NFL team; however, stranger things allowed OKC to get an NBA relocation franchise.

The NFL is a different animal, when it comes to team worth, the NFL has the advantage over the NBA by a whopping 52%.

The Jacksonville Jaguars, $4 billion --28th among 32 NFL teams. Jacksonville MSA - 1,713,240
OKC Thunder are worth $3.05 billion --24th among 30 NBA teams. Oklahoma City MSA - 1,477,926

.

[BoulderSooner]

^ ^ ^
Again, you and Dan are my favorite posters--you guys have always contributed to this forum on many subjects.

Good points about the dates especially with D1 games on Saturdays and NFL games on Sundays.

Our corporate base will continue to expand with incentives (Business expansion/relocation) like the Oklahoma Quality Jobs Act: https://www.okcommerce.gov/doing-bus...ntive-program/

As for a stadium, have an extension vote once you pay off the NBA arena for a 75,000-seat retractable roof state-of-the-art indoor stadium that could be used by Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Langston, and some NFL exhibition games. Revive the All College Holiday Tournament for the new NBA arena.

The MAPS 4 Multipurpose Stadium (IIRC has a budget of $71 million for 8,000 seats) could be converted into a retractable roof stadium with an increase of 62,000 seats by extending the NBA arena tax by $650 million
for a State-of-the-art retractable roof stadium. This won't guarantee OKC an NFL team; however, stranger things allowed OKC to get an NBA relocation franchise.

The NFL is a different animal, when it comes to team worth, the NFL has the advantage over the NBA by a whopping 52%.

The Jacksonville Jaguars, $4 billion --28th among 32 NFL teams. Jacksonville MSA - 1,713,240
OKC Thunder are worth $3.05 billion --24th among 30 NBA teams. Oklahoma City MSA - 1,477,926

.

OU would use a stadium in OKC 0.00 times unless it was a bowl game or playoff game .. ..

[Dob Hooligan]

^ ^ ^
Again, you and Dan are my favorite posters--you guys have always contributed to this forum on many subjects.

Good points about the dates especially with D1 games on Saturdays and NFL games on Sundays.

Our corporate base will continue to expand with incentives (Business expansion/relocation) like the Oklahoma Quality Jobs Act: https://www.okcommerce.gov/doing-bus...ntive-program/

As for a stadium, have an extension vote once you pay off the NBA arena for a 75,000-seat retractable roof state-of-the-art indoor stadium that could be used by Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Langston, and some NFL exhibition games. Revive the All College Holiday Tournament for the new NBA arena.

The MAPS 4 Multipurpose Stadium (IIRC has a budget of $71 million for 8,000 seats) could be converted into a retractable roof stadium with an increase of 62,000 seats by extending the NBA arena tax by $650 million
for a State-of-the-art retractable roof stadium. This won't guarantee OKC an NFL team; however, stranger things allowed OKC to get an NBA relocation franchise.

The NFL is a different animal, when it comes to team worth, the NFL has the advantage over the NBA by a whopping 52%.

The Jacksonville Jaguars, $4 billion --28th among 32 NFL teams. Jacksonville MSA - 1,713,240
OKC Thunder are worth $3.05 billion --24th among 30 NBA teams. Oklahoma City MSA - 1,477,926

.

I think the next 10-15 years are going to close the gap between the NFL and top echelon college football. Traditional powers like OU are going to operate at nearly the same level as the NFL. Think in terms of those programs (OU, Notre Dame, Alabama, Michigan etc.) bringing enough in history, brand and revenue to be an addition to the NFL expanded universe WITHOUT having to pay an expansion fee.

In short, those college teams will help grow the pie immediately. And cash flow positive to the overall from the beginning.