New Police Car Design?

[TornadoKegan]

Has anyone seen this on the road yet? it looks like a new design for MPD
IMG_4272.jpg

[bombermwc]

I'm new to Moore, but I'm curious why they're all Ford Explorers. What's the logic there? I don't thin I've ever seen an actual Moore PD CAR, only the SUVs.

[TheTravellers]

I'm new to Moore, but I'm curious why they're all Ford Explorers. What's the logic there? I don't thin I've ever seen an actual Moore PD CAR, only the SUVs.

They can't get tanks, or other big iron, so they settle for SUVs? Only slightly sarcastic, since PDs are getting so militarized...

[Bill Robertson]

I'm new to Moore, but I'm curious why they're all Ford Explorers. What's the logic there? I don't thin I've ever seen an actual Moore PD CAR, only the SUVs.

I would imagine it's the same reason people buy SUVs. They're much more versatile than a car.

[MagzOK]

I've read articles that with all an officer's gear, SUVs are just easier. Also the Crown Victoria was the fan favorite across the country however Ford decided to stop making that vehicle and what they offer now in the new Police Interceptor isn't well liked. So the market for police vehicles is pretty much limited to a Dodge Charger which you see Edmond has gone all in with, the Ford Police Interceptor, GM SUVs or the Ford Explorer. OKC started in with the new interceptors from Ford when they came out but they've seemed to have been upgrading to the Explorers also.

[Robert_M]

I saw something several years ago now I think on Moore Monthly after a bunch of snow storms that they were going to go to all SUVs because they were having trouble helping motorists in bad weather since they were using the SUVs they had at the time for priority calls or something along those lines.

[Brett]

Not sure if the F-150 is in the Moore PD fleet but I'm sure it would look good with the new graphics.

[TornadoKegan]

Not sure if the F-150 is in the Moore PD fleet but I'm sure it would look good with the new graphics.

The closest they got to a F150 is a Excursion

[zcamaro70]

The only options for police vehicles are SUV's or pickups. They do not make cars for police anymore. (Dodge is about to stop production of theirs).

[bombermwc]

The only options for police vehicles are SUV's or pickups. They do not make cars for police anymore. (Dodge is about to stop production of theirs).

That's so weird. I guess the market just isn't what it was? Or everyone's just converting some base model fleet purchase instead of paying the manufacturer to do it out of the box. I know Norman PD has often purchased things like Jeep Cherokees or whatever and then paid to have the lights/equipment all slapped on later (for $10k+). I actually wonder if the power consumption of the new equipment has anything to do with it. The LED lights, and lower power gear like the laptop/etc don't drain the power like they used to so you don't need this wholly specialized system to be able to power it all and still accelerate well. And heck, any car has good acceleration these days, I mean no one is buying a Dodge Neon where you have to turn the AC off to get on the highway lol.

One thing you can say in Moore that you can't in OKC is that there's not much reason to travel long distances for fuel costs. More is what <50sq miles. Not 1000.

I wouldn't have thought about the snow thing. That's a nice thought, but there has to be more to it. I can't imagine they plan the entire fleet over something that happens 1 or 2 times a year???

[TornadoKegan]

saw the new design on the road today

[Dob Hooligan]

That's so weird. I guess the market just isn't what it was? Or everyone's just converting some base model fleet purchase instead of paying the manufacturer to do it out of the box. I know Norman PD has often purchased things like Jeep Cherokees or whatever and then paid to have the lights/equipment all slapped on later (for $10k+). I actually wonder if the power consumption of the new equipment has anything to do with it. The LED lights, and lower power gear like the laptop/etc don't drain the power like they used to so you don't need this wholly specialized system to be able to power it all and still accelerate well. And heck, any car has good acceleration these days, I mean no one is buying a Dodge Neon where you have to turn the AC off to get on the highway lol.

One thing you can say in Moore that you can't in OKC is that there's not much reason to travel long distances for fuel costs. More is what <50sq miles. Not 1000.

I wouldn't have thought about the snow thing. That's a nice thought, but there has to be more to it. I can't imagine they plan the entire fleet over something that happens 1 or 2 times a year???

4 door sedans are a dying breed. Especially from American car makers. I don’t think Ford makes one at all, and Chevy and Dodge are phasing them out, if they haven’t already stopped.

[NavySeabee]

They can't get tanks, or other big iron, so they settle for SUVs? Only slightly sarcastic, since PDs are getting so militarized...

The only reason PD’s have that equipment is the same reason fire departments have old military cargo trucks in their fleet. The military sold it for pennies on the dollar. When you are a cash strapped department (as the majority of PDs are) you jump on a cheap armored vehicle. It cost almost as much as a new or good used fire truck for a new or used APC built for civilian police use. The down side to that military equipment is a lot of its warn out and it spends a lot of time in the shop. That’s why you only see it on the road during special events, certain emergencies and disaster operations. Most of the time they sit in a police yard or garage.

[bombermwc]

And that makes them pointless to purchase. Whetsell was notorious for this in OK County and it sat at the MWC storage lot and never got used. Waste of money.

[TheTravellers]

The only reason PD’s have that equipment is the same reason fire departments have old military cargo trucks in their fleet. The military sold it for pennies on the dollar. When you are a cash strapped department (as the majority of PDs are) you jump on a cheap armored vehicle. It cost almost as much as a new or good used fire truck for a new or used APC built for civilian police use. The down side to that military equipment is a lot of its warn out and it spends a lot of time in the shop. That’s why you only see it on the road during special events, certain emergencies and disaster operations. Most of the time they sit in a police yard or garage.

In addition to bombermwc's post making good sense, why does a civilian police force need an Armored Personnel Carrier, except in very unusual, rarely-seen circumstances?

[bombermwc]

Well Whetsell used to make claims that they were needed during tornados to be able to drive through the debris. Except, that's an AWFUL idea. You are just as likely to roll right over a body under the debris as you are to be able to drive over nails. If you've ever seen a reason to back off on the militarization of the police, here's a good one.

Norman SWAT uses a thin walled box truck that those officers do not feel safe in as they could be shot through the walls. So they claim they needed an armored vehicle to protect themselves and use as a barricade. I believe it was denied by the city council. Now, i'm not looking to make the situation unsafe for the officers, so someone with actual information on this, what is the statistic on how often that actually comes up as an issue in Oklahoma? Meaning, do we actually have officers operating in this capacity, actually needing to be protected in real-life situations or is that just solving a problem that isn't there?

Like TheTravellers said, buying something that is expensive (or requires high maintenance) for it to just sit 99% of the time, just isn't efficient. Perhaps the Cleveland County officers could purchase one for the whole use by the county. But if OK County is any indication, then its still going to sit even in that world, so what's the use? They just don't have a need.

I'd personally rather see the money spent on normal cruisers if it's not recurring funds. And if its recurring, then pay for resources for the department (officers themselves or resource officers that are trained to handle situations like mental health crisis, or training for the officers in de-escalation techniques, etc),

[BoulderSooner]

Well Whetsell used to make claims that they were needed during tornados to be able to drive through the debris. Except, that's an AWFUL idea. You are just as likely to roll right over a body under the debris as you are to be able to drive over nails. If you've ever seen a reason to back off on the militarization of the police, here's a good one.

Norman SWAT uses a thin walled box truck that those officers do not feel safe in as they could be shot through the walls. So they claim they needed an armored vehicle to protect themselves and use as a barricade. I believe it was denied by the city council. Now, i'm not looking to make the situation unsafe for the officers, so someone with actual information on this, what is the statistic on how often that actually comes up as an issue in Oklahoma? Meaning, do we actually have officers operating in this capacity, actually needing to be protected in real-life situations or is that just solving a problem that isn't there?

Like TheTravellers said, buying something that is expensive (or requires high maintenance) for it to just sit 99% of the time, just isn't efficient. Perhaps the Cleveland County officers could purchase one for the whole use by the county. But if OK County is any indication, then its still going to sit even in that world, so what's the use? They just don't have a need.

I'd personally rather see the money spent on normal cruisers if it's not recurring funds. And if its recurring, then pay for resources for the department (officers themselves or resource officers that are trained to handle situations like mental health crisis, or training for the officers in de-escalation techniques, etc),

just wanted to point out that these things are usually free for local law enforcement (i'm sure there are some exceptions )

https://www.dla.mil/Disposition-Serv.../Program-FAQs/

your point about Maintenance is a valid one ..

[onthestrip]

In addition to bombermwc's post making good sense, why does a civilian police force need an Armored Personnel Carrier, except in very unusual, rarely-seen circumstances?

Because the public is armed with lots of ARs with high capacity magazines and other high powered arms? Cant blame police for wanting protective things like this when citizens have lots of weapons themselves.

[TheTravellers]

Because the public is armed with lots of ARs with high capacity magazines and other high powered arms? Cant blame police for wanting protective things like this when citizens have lots of weapons themselves.

How often have any of these armored ex-military vehicles actually been used for incidents/calls in OKC or OK?

[bombermwc]

How often have any of these armored ex-military vehicles actually been used for incidents/calls in OKC or OK?

That's my question. Are they getting them (for free or reduced/whatever) and then causing a maintenance drain and never actually serving a purpose?

[Chris G]

I remember seeing a PD rep saying the market for used police SUV's was a lot better than the were getting for sedans. Don't know how much more SUV's were selling for over sedans, but it's a good statement to make to get public opinion to support it.

[LakeEffect]

4 door sedans are a dying breed. Especially from American car makers. I don’t think Ford makes one at all, and Chevy and Dodge are phasing them out, if they haven’t already stopped.

Ford only makes SUV police units now and Special Service Vehicles for trucks, since they've essentially existing the car market altogether. OKCPD is having to slowly switch over too. Dodge is the only one offering a standard police car now, and who knows how long that'll last.

[bille]

it appears the conversation swayed from the new design inquiry to the vehicle of choice but to answer the initial question, I believe Moore PD was looking for an updated design of the graphics and as an added bonus, the new design costs less than half of the previous design.

[Rover]

Because the public is armed with lots of ARs with high capacity magazines and other high powered arms? Cant blame police for wanting protective things like this when citizens have lots of weapons themselves.

It's more about the military dumping them cheaply.

It's a dangerous metality when civil police think they are military. Then thy have "enemies" not a public they serve. Whole different agendas and rules of engagement.

[dhpersonal]

I think it makes more sense for the police departments to switch to white vehicles to manage the Oklahoma heat.