Tribal Police Attempt to Arrest Non-Tribal Citizen

[Zuplar]

^^^ Interesting, guess it gets into the weeds as to how far the term "citizen" applies in a legal sense, not just a conversational sense. Also, tribal membership/citizenship (not sure if those terms are completely interchangeable) is a completely separate situation that requires more than just living within reservation boundaries, isn't it?

It is, so that's why my question remains, could they simply change it to include more people? My understanding is many tribes have relaxed their requirements in the past, specifically with blood quantum requirements as that practice is considered problematic at the very least.

[Dob Hooligan]

It is, so that's why my question remains, could they simply change it to include more people? My understanding is many tribes have relaxed their requirements in the past, specifically with blood quantum requirements as that practice is considered problematic at the very least.

Within the rules established for Federally recognized tribes, I think they can accept who they want when they want.

They traditionally have not wanted to do so. I think the tribes have not had the financial resources to expand services to expanded tribal members. No reason to add more people you can't support.

Now that some tribes are doing better financially, the reason not to expand becomes the opposite. No reason to give money more than they have to just because they have finally gotten a little.

[Zuplar]

Within the rules established for Federally recognized tribes, I think they can accept who they want when they want.

They traditionally have not wanted to do so. I think the tribes have not had the financial resources to expand services to expanded tribal members. No reason to add more people you can't support.

Now that some tribes are doing better financially, the reason not to expand becomes the opposite. No reason to give money more than they have to just because they have finally gotten a little.

I mostly agree with your comments.

The thought I have on your last comment is for those tribes that are doing very well, the reason to extend tribal citizenship could be to further their sovereignty. Completely controlling their boundaries similar to a state would really change peoples perceptions on the strength of the tribes. From my understanding the tribes see themselves as equal to the state of Oklahoma. I think in reality this is a stretch because again they don't really control their jurisdiction the same way other states do and in that regard they are dependent on the state of Oklahoma. This affirmation of their reservations has changed IMO the status quo I grew up with, that the tribes reservations weren't really reservations in the traditional sense. Since Mcgirt, the Tribes seem to have a renewed since of establishing their place as equals to the state of Oklahoma. If that is indeed the case the next step may be for them to claim all those living within their boundaries as tribal citizens.

My thought is if I'm a non-native, living in a newly affirmed reservation, I still don't really care about the tribes, because I don't have a say in any matters. Sure there are plenty of projects the tribes do that both directly and indirectly effect non-natives, this isn't the same IMO. Now if all of a sudden I can vote on projects similar to how I can for the city, county, and state I live in, I think you get a lot more bye in from the population.

With all that being said, I can definitely see why the Tribes and their citizens wouldn't want to incorporate non-natives. Non-native interests could slowly erode those and usurp those interests traditionally help by the Tribe. My guess is this is the sole major reason keeping such a thing from happening. But at the end of the day I don't see how these Tribes are every seen as more than what they are if they have less rights than every other government in the USA, and by that I'm referring to their jurisdiction over non-natives.

[BoulderSooner]

I mostly agree with your comments.

The thought I have on your last comment is for those tribes that are doing very well, the reason to extend tribal citizenship could be to further their sovereignty. Completely controlling their boundaries similar to a state would really change peoples perceptions on the strength of the tribes. From my understanding the tribes see themselves as equal to the state of Oklahoma. .

the issue with this idea of course is that the tribes would then be giving up control of them selves .. if they extend citizenship the new members would out number the actually members of the tribe .

[Dob Hooligan]

I mostly agree with your comments.

The thought I have on your last comment is for those tribes that are doing very well, the reason to extend tribal citizenship could be to further their sovereignty. Completely controlling their boundaries similar to a state would really change peoples perceptions on the strength of the tribes. From my understanding the tribes see themselves as equal to the state of Oklahoma. I think in reality this is a stretch because again they don't really control their jurisdiction the same way other states do and in that regard they are dependent on the state of Oklahoma. This affirmation of their reservations has changed IMO the status quo I grew up with, that the tribes reservations weren't really reservations in the traditional sense. Since Mcgirt, the Tribes seem to have a renewed since of establishing their place as equals to the state of Oklahoma. If that is indeed the case the next step may be for them to claim all those living within their boundaries as tribal citizens.

My thought is if I'm a non-native, living in a newly affirmed reservation, I still don't really care about the tribes, because I don't have a say in any matters. Sure there are plenty of projects the tribes do that both directly and indirectly effect non-natives, this isn't the same IMO. Now if all of a sudden I can vote on projects similar to how I can for the city, county, and state I live in, I think you get a lot more bye in from the population.

With all that being said, I can definitely see why the Tribes and their citizens wouldn't want to incorporate non-natives. Non-native interests could slowly erode those and usurp those interests traditionally help by the Tribe. My guess is this is the sole major reason keeping such a thing from happening. But at the end of the day I don't see how these Tribes are every seen as more than what they are if they have less rights than every other government in the USA, and by that I'm referring to their jurisdiction over non-natives.

As a thought exercise I would agree with you.

I think there are few tribes that would have the ability to do what you are suggesting. From a governance and economic standpoint, they aren't built for that scale.

I would suggest the tribes are focused on being sovereign. And different from the state. That doesn't necessarily mean equal. Just sovereign, and different.

[Zuplar]

the issue with this idea of course is that the tribes would then be giving up control of them selves .. if they extend citizenship the new members would out number the actually members of the tribe .

Right, I mentioned something very similar in my last paragraph.

In general it's an interesting concept, and at the core of it wasn't sure if it was even legal for them to do.

With all that being said, I can definitely see why the Tribes and their citizens wouldn't want to incorporate non-natives. Non-native interests could slowly erode those and usurp those interests traditionally help by the Tribe. My guess is this is the sole major reason keeping such a thing from happening. But at the end of the day I don't see how these Tribes are every seen as more than what they are if they have less rights than every other government in the USA, and by that I'm referring to their jurisdiction over non-natives.

[Midtowner]

So maybe it is plausible the tribes could extend citizenship to all people who live within their boundary.

They have the right to extend citizenship to anyone they want, although every group I've ever worked with employs one of two methods--either you have an ancestor traceable to the Dawes rolls or you can prove a certain blood quantum. Maybe both.