New Downtown Arena

[April in the Plaza]

That poll is worrisome, even with the small sample.

The team needs to encourage the season ticket holders to go vote. Anyone here with season tickets?

The strategy of saying absolutely nothing and hiding behind Holt (in an effort to save a few million dollars) is definitely a head scratcher.

[Rover]

The strategy of saying absolutely nothing and hiding behind Holt (in an effort to save a few million dollars) is definitely a head scratcher.

Trust me, they aren't hiding. Their push will come closer to voting time.

[jn1780]

A bad poll in late November would say more. I think there are a lot of people who would probably initially be opposed to the idea without hearing directly from Thunder management. The PR campaign is coming.....

[SouthOKC]

There is a massive difference in Poli’s studies and the Mayors valuation placed on GOODWILL toward the city from building an arena. Without an economic impact study he views it as anecdotal.

Even still I’m stating we can concede that the studies linked earlier in the thread are correct based on the data points used. So my overall point is, now what? So the city won’t make back in direct economic impact what we the people invest into the arena. The point he is missing is all that matters is the anecdotal part of this because he diminishes how the people who vote view the new arena.

Facts don’t care about feelings. Votes don’t care about facts.

Less than 45k voters showed up for MAPS 4 and it passed with a 71% “yes” vote. That’s with it being full of social focused program’s versus past MAPS programs focused on entertainment type development. While OKC is becoming more purple that all happened while still leaning republican.

That poll is as scientific as me stating we have 20+ in favor, 2 against, and 1 undecided/unknown on this site.

[mugofbeer]

Predicting a big year for the Thunder to help sell the arena.

[HOT ROD]

The strategy of saying absolutely nothing and hiding behind Holt (in an effort to save a few million dollars) is definitely a head scratcher.

particularly, when you consider Holt's response so far to the No Vote is that THEY will alway vote NO. But in reality, there's quite a few in that current NO side who otherwise would vote Yes and/or support the Thunder or 'all things OKC', but feel like this time the city has gone too far. I really do hope the city/Thunder can do some great PR - I am starting to worry about this. The vote is 2 months away, 60 days is not a long time.

[Urbanized]

Seattle Times article on OKC’s arena effort: https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/...-funded-arena/

This Bill Simmons quote is spine-chilling stuff:

I hate to start (expletive), but you know, OKC did steal a team from somebody else. This is the smallest market in the league. They have the smallest arena in the league … Google ‘Oklahoma City Thunder arena lease.’ Go Google all that stuff. It’s been a story there for a couple of years. They want the taxpayers to pay for a new stadium. They want to keep the team and the lease I think was up this year. They did a little three-year short lease extension.

But I just wonder — again, I hate starting (expletive) — but I just wonder, you had the Bucks being valued at $3.5 billion (and) you have Phoenix at $4 billion. What happens to this team when they have all these young assets?

Like if I’m in Seattle, and I don’t know if I’m gonna be able to get an expansion team anytime soon, because you know, I still think Seattle and Vegas are gonna be the expansion teams if/when it happens, but what if you get a little (anxious) in Seattle? You look at that OKC team with the assets they built, you have the lineage of they played in Seattle once upon a time anyway.

… What does Clay Bennett do if Seattle just offers him like $5 billion for the team. ‘We’ll take it, here’s $5 billion.’ What does the NBA do? And what happens if OKC wants to do it? What is the value of that team in a small market vs. a big market? And what if somebody just says (expletive) it and overpays?

Make no mistake: other cities smell blood in the water. The idea that OKC - at present a marginal NBA market - will have multiple shots to get this right is delusional. There is SERIOUS money in play here, and I’m not talking about the cost to build the arena.

[catcherinthewry]

Seattle Times article on OKC’s arena effort: https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/...-funded-arena/

This Bill Simmons quote is spine-chilling stuff:


Make no mistake: other cities smell blood in the water. The idea that OKC - at present a marginal NBA market - will have multiple shots to get this right is delusional. There is SERIOUS money in play here, and I’m not talking about the cost to build the arena.

So Simmons says he hates to start sh!t, but then starts sh!t. He's a clown and has been an OKC hater from day one calling the Thunder the OKC Zombies. He would love nothing better than for the Thunder to move back to Seattle.

[Urbanized]

^^^^^^^^
Agree with everything you said. But the point is that we (OKC) aren’t the only folks beginning to understand that this is the most pivotal moment to date in OKC’s short but surprisingly rich NBA history. They also innately get that the team will be immediately subject to a bidding war should we fail the test.

[PhiAlpha]

Yeah bill simmons has always been a dick and hated OKC but what he’s saying isn’t any different than what we’ve been saying here. No guarantee that the thunder leaves after a single no vote but it absolutely does open up the possibility for it. To deny that is extremely foolish and shows a massive amount of ignorance for how these things have gone in the past. If you don’t like the proposal and are fine with them leaving then vote no but doing so because you think they’ll come back to the table with a plan you like better if it fails is ignorant at best. Real F around and find out potential there. If you like having an nba team and want them to stay, you need to vote yes regardless of your feelings on this. Or hell, if you don’t like the plan that much…just abstain from voting. A no vote absolutely means “I’m okay with the team leaving if we don’t get the arena deal I want” despite what any of you who are against it think you’re doing. That would not be the hill I wanted to die on but hey, at least you’ll have plenty of free time opening up 41 nights per year to reread the 5 arena financing studies that you’re using to justify your position.

[caaokc]

particularly, when you consider Holt's response so far to the No Vote is that THEY will alway vote NO. But in reality, there's quite a few in that current NO side who otherwise would vote Yes and/or support the Thunder or 'all things OKC', but feel like this time the city has gone too far. I really do hope the city/Thunder can do some great PR - I am starting to worry about this. The vote is 2 months away, 60 days is not a long time.

I agree, I won’t be surprised if it’s a lot closer than expected. I do think it’ll help if this Thunder team gets off to a good start.

[OKCRT]

So Simmons says he hates to start sh!t, but then starts sh!t. He's a clown and has been an OKC hater from day one calling the Thunder the OKC Zombies. He would love nothing better than for the Thunder to move back to Seattle.

Simmons is full of it. OKC isn't the smallest market and Seattle isn't a large market, it's a medium market. NY-La-Chi ect. are large markets. I wouldn't worry about anything he spouts off about the Thunder because he is in no way considered a Thunder insider. I will be voting *Yes* regardless of how much the owners pony up.

[Plutonic Panda]

Fu€k Bill Simmons.

[BDP]

Unfortunately, Simmons isn't wrong. That's just the economics of the NBA.

They do not like to speak on relocations, but the reality is a new arena is something the NBA as a whole wants. Who knows what happens or on what time line, but it is a certainty that no major league sport will be playing in the current arena in 10 years. Whether the Thunder stays here or moves to a larger market, it will be in one with more revenue growth potential.

[jdg78]

Bill Simmons with the most basic elementary argument. Big vs. small. Same argument he made as to why the thunder would fail. He’s a dip **** and if I'm not mistaken we aren't the smallest market in the league.

[jdg78]

3rd smallest tv market and 4th smallest overall based on a quick search. However, our numbers seam off given the metro’s size and then adding in tulsa and the state.

https://hoop-social.com/nba-team-market-size-rankings/

[Urbanized]

It’s a marginal market. Passionate fan base (when we’re winning), great front office, surprising corporate support for a city not brimming with Fortune 500 companies. But we will always lack many of the natural revenue streams that larger markets enjoy. We can’t be in the business of minimizing revenue potential for a team competing in an insanely expensive league.

We’re incredibly fortunate to be an NBA city and we need to recognize that. And right now we need to act like we do indeed understand that part of the equation.

[mugofbeer]

Let Simmons spew shlt all he wants. It will start to work against him and push more people to vote for the arena just to stick it to the west coast elitist arrogants

[Laramie]

Bill Simmons with the most basic elementary argument. Big vs. small. Same argument he made as to why the thunder would fail. He’s a dip **** and if I'm not mistaken we aren't the smallest market in the league.

We aren't the smallest market in the league. Based on MSA population OKC (1,459,380) is larger than Memphis (1,339,855), Salt Lake City (1,266,191) and New Orleans (972,913). And we're not the smallest market by TV viewership we are ahead of New Orleans and Memphis.

Salt Lake City (1,168,540) uses the whole state when reporting their DMA viewership. Oklahoma City (743,340)-Tulsa (543,710) combined viewership = 1,287,050 far exceeds that of Utah. Former Mayor Mick Cornett often suggested to the NBA that
Oklahoma City-Tulsa combined was considered one market when calculating DMA market viewership data.

Source: 2022-2023 Nielsen DMA Ranking https://ustvdb.com/seasons/2022-23/markets/

[Laramie]

Oklahoman in Sunday's Editorial:

Why we support building a new arena:

...We are confident this city is on a growth trajectory and can support inclusive and transparent practices in the process. Bring everyone
along in its transformation. A new arena is a social and cultural investment we’re willing to risk.

For the full editorial (estimated 16 paragraphs), pick up a copy of the Oklahoman: Sunday, October 15, 2023

[Teo9969]

Let Simmons spew shlt all he wants. It will start to work against him and push more people to vote for the arena just to stick it to the west coast elitist arrogants

I honestly wondered if someone from within the NBA prompted him to write about it to create a narrative the citizens of OKC would want to shoot down by approving the arena.

[Rover]

I honestly wondered if someone from within the NBA prompted him to write about it to create a narrative the citizens of OKC would want to shoot down by approving the arena.

That’s a heavy duty conspiracy theory. Lol

[DoctorTaco]

If they money is so good for the Thunder ownership who is to say they don't sign the lease and then break it? To my knowledge we have no idea what the financial terms are for this 25 year deal Holt is hyping and if someone offers Bennet $5 Billion it may be perfectly doable to just pay the penalty and walk or just walk and let the lawyers sort it out.

I guess I am saying if the Thunder owners truly want to sell this arena probably doesn't stop them

[PhiAlpha]

If they money is so good for the Thunder ownership who is to say they don't sign the lease and then break it? To my knowledge we have no idea what the financial terms are for this 25 year deal Holt is hyping and if someone offers Bennet $5 Billion it may be perfectly doable to just pay the penalty and walk or just walk and let the lawyers sort it out.

I guess I am saying if the Thunder owners truly want to sell this arena probably doesn't stop them

Doesn’t stop them, but does theoretically lock the team in and give them an arena that is much more competitive revenue wise with the rest of the league. Not sure I’ve ever seen a team move from a city in which they’d been extremely successful by any metric for nearly their entire existence (attendance has only been down in 2021-2022…Covid policies + rebuilding…and last year…still rebuilding) that had just built a state of the art arena…that would be very unprecedented.

[Laramie]

We'd like to see what we're getting for $900 million that could potentially swell beyond $1 billion+ depending on how a loan is structured.

Our city is gambling that the December 12 initiative will pass. Will be of interest to see what kind of campaign strategy pushes this across the finish line.

Selection of a site for construction will give of a critical piece to this project puzzle.