Covid-19 in OKC (coronavirus)

[TheTravellers]

Can't remember if this has been posted, but this is a good thing.

https://oklahomawatch.org/2021/08/18...-mandating-it/

"Nursing homes in Oklahoma and across the nation are in danger of losing staff or funding following pressure from the Biden administration spurred by a resurgence of COVID-19.

Nursing homes that refuse to mandate COVID-19 vaccines for their staff will lose Medicare and Medicaid funding. "

[PhiAlpha]

^

Did you ever get vaccinated?

Not yet. With all the studies that have been coming out surrounding the longevity and strength of natural immunity and reinfection rates still hoovering around 1% of cases (the vast majority of which are more mild than initial infection), I'm holding off for a bit longer. Especially encouraging is the study below that found natural immunity from a previous infection is 13 times more effective than vaccine induced immunity (from two doses of the mRNA ones) against the delta variant. Pretty much every article or study has of course suggested that both types of immunity wane with time (though there is still a lot of research and debate as to those time frames, 8-12 months has been cited a lot recently) and getting at least one dose of the vaccine will boost natural immunity.

I was officially over my covid case during the first week of December last year so unless new info at the time suggests otherwise, I'm leaning toward getting a single dose of whichever vaccine appears to be best handling the newer variants toward the end of the year after a few more months of them being tested against at least the delta and lambda variants on a large scale.


https://www.science.org/news/2021/08...-remains-vital

[Pete]

Yeah, didn't think so.

[PhiAlpha]

Yeah, didn't think so.

If I hadn't previously been infected with the virus, I definitely would've by now...probably months go...but I've been pretty consistent in how I've said I planned to handle it.

[Plutonic Panda]

If I hadn't previously been infected with the virus, I definitely would've by now...probably months go...but I've been pretty consistent in how I've said I planned to handle it.

Have you gone to a doctor and asked if you should take it?

[d-usa]

Parks and Rec was spot on with their town halls…

https://youtu.be/areUGfOHkMA

[soonerguru]

The political cowardice of Councilman Stonecipher and others on this matter is breathtaking. Why even choose to be a civic leader if you cannot take simple, principled stands on protecting the public? I can't imagine the shame and embarrassment I would feel allowing psychotic bullies like the Hefners scare me into voting a certain way on such an important matter.

[Bits_Of_Real_Panther]

I did a covid test last Tuesday morning at the corner pharmacy, I believe it was processed by DLO. Results back within 36 hours. Negative fortunately.

I'm feeling like hunkering down again, after the spiking numbers the last week or 2.

Once I read the news about the metro hospitals being at capacity, and the denial and lack of leadership by multiple levels of government, I mean, what else can one conclude than we are on our own during a storm that is inundating us?

[Mott]

The political cowardice of Councilman Stonecipher and others on this matter is breathtaking. Why even choose to be a civic leader if you cannot take simple, principled stands on protecting the public? I can't imagine the shame and embarrassment I would feel allowing psychotic bullies like the Hefners scare me into voting a certain way on such an important matter.

If it’s going to be a sport, then let em get COVID-19. And not take up hospital space from those that are vaccinated.

[Bunty]

I started to feel that way last summer when I was real active in the fight for a mask mandate in Edmond, after sitting through all the crazy council meetings... until I started seeing videos from other states and I realized that crazy and ignorant isn't limited to geography. The only thing that really made me feel better is that I noticed it was the same, very loud, very obnoxious dozen or so anti-science nuts at all the meetings.

They're probably being stirred up like silly by leading anti mask and anti covid vaccine fanatics on the Internet. The things they say go over the top unbelievably. As I have mentioned before, I hope they can be subject to bankruptcy causing civil lawsuits for causing needless sickness and death. Freedom of speech that causes all that shouldn't come without serious consequences.

[runOKC]

The guy that owns Bedlam BBQ had some serious crazy eyes as he was blabbering on. Dude was big mad.

[dankrutka]

The political cowardice of Councilman Stonecipher and others on this matter is breathtaking. Why even choose to be a civic leader if you cannot take simple, principled stands on protecting the public? I can't imagine the shame and embarrassment I would feel allowing psychotic bullies like the Hefners scare me into voting a certain way on such an important matter.

So many "leaders" are far more influenced by social pressures (or misinformation) than doing the right thing. As MLK said in his Letter from Birmingham Jail, we are morally obligated to follow just laws and we are also morally obligated to disobey unjust laws. I'd rather be fired a few times in my life and live with principle. Being in education, it's been disheartening to see how many principals and other leaders just bow to public pressure even if it risks the mental and physical health of the teachers, students, and community under their care.

[PoliSciGuy]

The GOP continues to be a misinformed death cult, right down to the local level. These folks lack critical thinking skills and use violence and misinformation to try to overcome their own ignorance, and the public suffers for it.

[PhiAlpha]

The political cowardice of Councilman Stonecipher and others on this matter is breathtaking. Why even choose to be a civic leader if you cannot take simple, principled stands on protecting the public? I can't imagine the shame and embarrassment I would feel allowing psychotic bullies like the Hefners scare me into voting a certain way on such an important matter.

I get that you're upset and understand why but it seems as though every time a city or state leader has an opinion that differs from yours, they are automatically a coward, an embarrassment, don't care about the safety of the public or anyone other than themselves, have some ulterior motive, are yielding to bullies, etc. All of them initially voted for a mask mandate with the primary goals of flattening the curve and buying time for the vaccines to be developed while allowing businesses to reopen. I think the extension passed 7-1 or something like that and it was in place for a nearly a year. So I think it's a bit harsh and inaccurate to characterize them as such. Tulsa just decided against a mask mandate as well. Which brings me to the question...which large cities are actually enforcing a mask mandate? Are OK's two largest cities unique for not doing so?

I watched press conferences with the heads of the three major hospitals in Tulsa two(ish) weeks ago when the city began revisiting the idea of a mask mandate. When asked if they supported it, one doctor said yes and the other two said they'd prefer to put all their weight behind getting more people vaccinated and were concerned that the negative public reaction and fallout from another mask mandate would vastly overshadow and distract from the vaccination effort and would hurt then end goal of increasing the state's vaccination rate...which based on a small sample size, seems pretty accurate.

The city council allowed time to flatten the curve, gradually reopen and now we have at least 3 vaccines but cases are rising again, including an increasing number of breakthrough cases. I think most doctors have resigned themselves to the fact that Covid-19 is here to stay with the primary goal now being to reduce the amount of cases, reduce the severity of infections and improve treatments. The NPR interview with a doctor from Johns Hopkins below is one of several I've seen that says as much. There is no way we're ever going to achieve 100% vaccination so it's going to be some combo of vaccine induce immunity and natural immunity with likely a bunch of holes for unvaccinated people who haven't had the virus. Both natural immunity and vaccine immunity wane over time so whatever percentage of those people don't get booster shots will be more susceptible reinfection as time goes on. Even if we somehow vaccinated everyone, there would still likely be a large amount of breakthrough cases, especially as new variants develop (as the Israeli's are now figuring out).

So I guess my question to you is: I know cases and hospitalizations are rising again which obviously isn't good, but what's your end game on mask mandates? Do we wear masks for another year? Two years? Three years? Forever?

I'm genuinely interested because everyone in the mask mandate camp seems to be clamoring for the government, at any level, to bring them back then get irate when everyone chooses not to do so, but they don't seem to have any plan besides "we need masks!" I could see the value in doing it in schools until more students are eligible to be vaccinated since especially the younger students are in such close contact, but the rest of the public?

https://www.npr.org/2021/08/01/10233...9-reinfections

[king183]

Some of you may recall Ken Reddick, one of the anti-mask and anti-vaccine protest leaders in Tulsa, former Tulsa mayor candidate, and attendee at the January 6 riot at the Capitol. He organized a protest at the end of June, calling vaccine and mask advocates all sorts of vile names. Two weeks later he was in the ICU on the verge of death, infected with COVID. He now likely has permanent lung damage due to scarring. He can’t walk more than a foot without losing breath. He can’t use the bathroom on his own. He can barely speak. He has small children at home, he is self-employed as a roofer, and his wife has been begging for money through a fundraiser to help them get by.

This is the tragic consequence of COVID and the arrogant denialism people like Ken Reddick espouse. He didn’t just hurt himself by refusing to mask and get the vaccine; he has put his family in a major bind. They are now dependent on the goodwill of other people—something he was unwilling to extend to others.

Who will be the next Ken Reddick in Oklahoma?

[PhiAlpha]

Have you gone to a doctor and asked if you should take it?

I talked to my doctor about it. His answer (I'm paraphrasing) was along the lines of: "Out of an abundance of caution we recommend that even people who've fairly recently been infected get vaccinated after around 90 days. That said, natural immunity is part of the picture that isn't being discussed or weighed heavily enough and based on what we know currently, you should have fairly strong immunity protection from reinfection for 8-12 months, possibly longer. In under a year, reinfection is very rare. Getting fully vaccinated or at least one dose probably would further reduce your already low risk of reinfection, but the jury's still out as to how much. If reinfection does occur, it generally has been mild. Regardless of whether you take the vaccine you're very unlikely to catch it again within 8-12 months of when you had it so if you don't get vaccinated now, check back in around that time."

Doing the math, right now I likely have around a 1% chance of being reinfected with a very mild case if I do nothing and according to a study just released by the CDC, that potentially drops to around 0.5% if I get vaccinated. If I go the vaccine route, at minimum...based on everyone I know who has gotten vaccinated and already had Covid, there's a pretty good chance that I'll feel like crap for a day or two, maybe longer, with each dose but the potential exists (however low) for additional side effects. If I don't get vaccinated right now, the potential for any side effects at all is zero and my odds for catching it again are still likely around 1%. It just makes more sense to me to wait until my natural immunity really starting to fall off.

[Bits_Of_Real_Panther]

Yeah sure, what you got last winter will protect you against a different strain.

I wish I could have poor critical thinking skills

[PhiAlpha]

Yeah sure, what you got last winter will protect you against a different strain.

I wish I could have poor critical thinking skills

Yeah, 60% of the time, being an ass is a lot easier than just reading the results of the study I posted, every time:

https://www.science.org/news/2021/08...-remains-vital

[Plutonic Panda]

Phi, it sounds to me unless I misunderstood your doctor told you to get the vaccine. I hope you do and stay safe man. God bless.

[king183]

Yeah sure, what you got last winter will protect you against a different strain.

I wish I could have poor critical thinking skills

CDC Study: “Being unvaccinated was associated with 2.34 times the odds of reinfection compared with being fully vaccinated.“

And the study was done before Delta was widespread.

Also from Phi’s own link: The researchers also found that people who had SARS-CoV-2 previously and received one dose of the Pfizer-BioNTech messenger RNA (mRNA) vaccine were more highly protected against reinfection than those who once had the virus and were still unvaccinated.

[PhiAlpha]

They will literally talk themselves into anything.

CDC Study: “Being unvaccinated was associated with 2.34 times the odds of reinfection compared with being fully vaccinated.“

And the study was done before Delta was widespread.

It was widespread enough in Israel to do a study on it and draw a conclusion.

The newly released data show people who once had a SARS-CoV-2 infection were much less likely than never-infected, vaccinated people to get Delta, develop symptoms from it, or become hospitalized with serious COVID-19.

The new analysis relies on the database of Maccabi Healthcare Services, which enrolls about 2.5 million Israelis. The study, led by Tal Patalon and Sivan Gazit at KSM, the system’s research and innovation arm, found in two analyses that never-infected people who were vaccinated in January and February were, in June, July, and the first half of August, six to 13 times more likely to get infected than unvaccinated people who were previously infected with the coronavirus. In one analysis, comparing more than 32,000 people in the health system, the risk of developing symptomatic COVID-19 was 27 times higher among the vaccinated, and the risk of hospitalization eight times higher.

https://www.science.org/news/2021/08...-remains-vital

And yes, I've read that CDC study and the part you mentioned in my article...I mentioned both above. Reducing my risk of reinfection from around 1% to between 0.4% and 0.5% isn't all that significant .

[Plutonic Panda]

I just know even into June my doctor in LA sat me down and talked to me. I said, look man, I went through the whole pandemic without getting sick, my immune system is good, the vaccine is stupid and I don’t need it. He responded, Campbell, I love you but you’re being an arrogant jackass. I spent 10 years of my life studying and becoming a doctor learning about the human body and using science every step of the way to save people’s lives and you want to tell me how it works? That’s like you telling a climatologist climate change isn’t real, or a physicist the earth is flat… I walked out to my car, thought about what he said, and went back into to the building and got the vaccine.

I felt like a complete ass for being arrogant and having took so long to get it. I can only pray I didn’t infect anyone else with it. I will get the booster ASAP.

[Plutonic Panda]

It was widespread enough in Israel to do a study on it and draw a conclusion.





https://www.science.org/news/2021/08...-remains-vital

And yes, I've read that CDC study. Reducing my risk of reinfection from around 1% to between 0.4% and 0.5% isn't all that significant.

It also says this being updated:

*Clarification, 28 August, 1:20 p.m.: This article has been updated to reflect that in an analysis involving previously infected people who received one vaccine dose, not all people received that dose after, rather than before, becoming infected. It has also been updated to clarify that the vaccinated people in the other two analyses had never been infected prior to being vaccinated.

Also says multiple times that getting the vaccine is vital.

[PhiAlpha]

I just know even into June my doctor in LA sat me down and talked to me. I said, look man, I went through the whole pandemic without getting sick, my immune system is good, the vaccine is stupid and I don’t need it. He responded, Campbell, I love you but you’re being an arrogant jackass. I spent 10 years of my life studying and becoming a doctor learning about the human body and using science every step of the way to save people’s lives and you want to tell me how it works? That’s like you telling a climatologist climate change isn’t real, or a physicist the earth is flat… I walked out to my car, thought about what he said, and went back into to the building and got the vaccine.

I felt like a complete ass for being arrogant and having took so long to get it. I can only pray I didn’t infect anyone else with it. I will get the booster ASAP.

That's certainly understandable. If I hadn't had the virus yet and had no idea how my body was going to react to it, I would've done the same thing. Probably would be lining up to get the booster as well.

[PhiAlpha]

It also says this being updated:



Also says multiple times that getting the vaccine is vital.

Yes it does. Primarily in reference to the uninfected and unvaccinated and for the idiots who inevitably will use the study to say "screw it, I'll just catch covid on purpose instead of getting vaccinated"

The study demonstrates the power of the human immune system, but infectious disease experts emphasized that this vaccine and others for COVID-19 nonetheless remain highly protective against severe disease and death. And they caution that intentional infection among unvaccinated people would be extremely risky.“What we don’t want people to say is: ‘All right, I should go out and get infected, I should have an infection party,’” says Michel Nussenzweig, an immunologist at Rockefeller University who researches the immune response to SARS-CoV-2 and was not involved in the study. “Because somebody could die.”