Wheeler District

[TheTravellers]

It is good to know and informs the discussion that you believe a $370K house is considered affordable. I'm not being facetious at all. Maybe I genuinely have an outdated view of what is considered affordable in OKC.

I also don't think $370K is "affordable". I make a pretty decent wage for OKC (just over twice the median) and there's no way I would ever buy a $370K house. I could probably afford it, but I'd most likely be pretty house-poor. My current house in Venice (~2000 sf) was bought for $180K-ish 5 years ago, and I believe is now estimated at somewhere above $200K (haven't checked in a while, so don't know for sure), and that takes 1/4 of my monthly income for the mortgage and taxes.

[Richard at Remax]

All I am going off of is the website https://www.wheelerdistrict.com/home/ and searching available homes. I can only see what is in front of me. Regardless, it sounds like we just disagree on what is considered affordable.

Do you work here? If you have the info, please share the pricing info for Phase 2.

[catcherinthewry]

$150,000-$350,000 house prices for brand new high-end construction in the downtown OKC Urban core is extremely competitive pricing.

So we've switched from affordable to competitive now? Gotcha

[AP]

$150,000-$350,000 house prices for brand new high-end construction in the downtown OKC Urban core is extremely competitive pricing. Less monthly outlay than downtown 2 or 3 bedroom apartment rental pricing. Not to mention these homes are all geothermal HVAC, metal roofs (4-5 times the price of a traditional asphalt roof), high-end interior finishes, etc. Take a look at the standard features on the Wheeler website. A very impressive list that very few new home builders match as a standard offering.

You just described the houses they are building as high-end. High-end does not equal affordable. Removing the price per sqft removes a lot of context from the discussion as well. Sure you could purchase a $215K house on pedalers lane. But you're getting 700 sqft. That's not a lot of house for a family, so a young couple or single person will typically purchase it. Not too many people making the average wage in OKC could make that work. But again, I think we are looking at this from different lenses and are working from different definitions. Which is fine and good to know. I will continue to enjoy my actual urban experience of living in a core neighborhood for a reasonable price in Shepherd.

[Richard at Remax]

August 2020 MLS Stats. Avg price ~240K.

[Plutonic Panda]

I challenge anyone to find a brand new home built near the downtown of a major metro selling for under 250k. Regardless of square feet, this is a detached home for sale. If anything like that remotely exists, then find one with the amenities that come with the Wheeler District housing. The value of these homes will go nowhere but up. Yet everyone here is so focused on 370k iS nOt AFfoRDable. Laughs in Los Angeles.

[Pete]

Just for clarification, the homes on Peddlar's Lane do not have garages or on-lot parking. They have shared covered parking that is nearby but not on the homeowner's property.

[TheTravellers]

I challenge anyone to find a brand new home built near the downtown of a major metro selling for under 250k. Regardless of square feet, this is a detached home for sale. If anything like that remotely exists, then find one with the amenities that come with the Wheeler District housing. The value of these homes will go nowhere but up. Yet everyone here is so focused on 370k iS nOt AFfoRDable. Laughs in Los Angeles.

Median annual wage in LA - $62,474
Median annual wage in OKC - $47,004
Average annual wage in LA - $70,586
Average annual wage in OKC - $26,275

Just a quick google search found these, not sure how old or accurate they are, but the massive discrepancy between the average wages completely explain why $370K is easily more affordable in LA than OKC - get a clue, PP... Anybody in any major city would laugh at how affordable most homes are here in OKC (our $200K-ish house would sell for easily 2-3 times that in Chicago suburbs, probably 4-5 times that in Chicago proper, and probably easily the same multipliers would apply in any major city).

[Pete]

If we are going to compare, we need to look at other homes in OKC not in L.A. or Manhattan.

I have no strong opinion about the Wheeler District but I find the backlash and informed debate to be fascinating. There are a lot of undercurrents to all this that are part of bigger national discussions around racism, elitism, public education, gentrification, affordability and corporate welfare.

[Mott]

Just back from quick to Franklin TN (now a suburb of Nashville). Wheeler Park would be a scaled down version of Westhaven, with its own shopping center (including Kroger, plus stores and restaurants), and dense 3-4 story structures, and houses etc, plus a golf course. It’s outside of Franklin in the country, rather than in town, and is definitely upscale in nature. Edmond, as they would imagine.

[AP]

Frankly, I don't give a **** what houses sell for in LA. I don't live in LA. I don't have the same compensation as people who live in LA. Home prices are highly regional so bringing up any other place is irrelevant unless the demographics are very similar. And this development is not downtown or really even close to downtown. It is connected in no way. Just look at the neighborhoods in this picture, to find affordable housing. Of course, those houses are not offering all the amenities of wheeler. But that is probably why they are concerned about gentrification and displacement. Again, if you are touting high-end amenities, you aren't concerned with providing affordable housing. WHICH IS FINE. Just don't say you are going to do it if you aren't.

[Plutonic Panda]

Median annual wage in LA - $62,474
Median annual wage in OKC - $47,004
Average annual wage in LA - $70,586
Average annual wage in OKC - $26,275

Just a quick google search found these, not sure how old or accurate they are, but the massive discrepancy between the average wages completely explain why $370K is easily more affordable in LA than OKC - get a clue, PP... Anybody in any major city would laugh at how affordable most homes are here in OKC (our $200K-ish house would sell for easily 2-3 times that in Chicago suburbs, probably 4-5 times that in Chicago proper, and probably easily the same multipliers would apply in any major city).

Well, firstly, my LA comment was obviously tongue in cheek. For those that didn’t get it you do now or either you want to use that to distract from the fact that given proper perspective these homes are affordable.

Comparing to Chicago is a not realistic. Yes you can find a home under 300k relatively close to downtown Chicago. Same thing with Detroit. Oh, make sure your realtor fills you in that you now purchased a home in one the highest crime zones in the United States. How many murders and shootings did Chicago have last weekend?

As I said, find me a new build home in a lively district right next to downtown of a major metro area for under 250k.

[BoulderSooner]

F or really even close to downtown.

how is it not close to down town? ?

[Plutonic Panda]

This is a healthy discussion about Wheeler District, though I don’t understand Dans point, taking anything from social media doesn’t make sense. Those are the same kind of people whining about traffic and lack of investment into the roads, opposing walkable, dense developments like Spring Creek Expansion in favor of cookie cutter strip malls all over the place, and then getting mad when a road is widened because of the construction needed and inconvenience posed. People are very weird.

[Pete]

Those are the same kind of people whining about traffic and lack of investment into the roads, opposing walkable, dense developments like Spring Creek Expansion in favor of cookie cutter strip malls all over the place, and then getting mad when a road is widened because of the construction needed and inconvenience posed.

It's not necessarily the same people complaining about all those things.

[AP]

how is it not close to down town? ?

On the edge of that circle that runs through wheeler is 23rd and Classen do you consider that downtown? I don't. I wouldn't consider the Capitol close to downtown either. Both Wheeler and the Capitol have the same connection issues. Except with wheeler you are not only separated by a highway but also a river.

[Plutonic Panda]

It's not necessarily the same people complaining about all those things.

I was referring to those making asinine comments on Facebook and not adding anything constructive to the table. Even though I think it’s silly, I can see people’s frustration regarding gentrification and use of public funds to facilitate developments like this.

I do think many here, even those that think 250k is not affordable in this instance, are jumping the gun on that aspect as this development is just getting started. I would love to see micro units built here in some places which could really offer an affordable alternative and give disadvantaged singles an opportunity to live here.

[Plutonic Panda]

On the edge of that circle that runs through wheeler is 23rd and Classen do you consider that downtown? I don't. I wouldn't consider the Capitol close to downtown either. Both Wheeler and the Capitol have the same connection issues. Except with wheeler you are not only separated by a highway but also a river.

23rd and Classen is a district adjacent to downtown. That is very close to downtown.

You raise good points about connectivity but Western will eventually get cycling lanes and a pedestrian bridge will become a reality on a converted former rail bridge right next to this development. Not to mention the city is increasing its investment in rail and bus alternatives. That all comes in time. At this point it doesn’t really seem to be much a factor.

[Martin]

just to add to "affordability" discussion, don't forget that there is also a $140/month ($1680/year) hoa fee to pay on top of everything else.

overall, i like wheeler and think it's going to be a net positive for the city, but i'd hardly call what is currently there "affordable." it may represent good value for the money based on finishes, location, and amenities but there are certainly better options in the city for budget conscious consumers.

[Plutonic Panda]

I would think a budget conscious consumer wouldn’t be looking for a brand new detached house in a mixed use master planned development right next to downtown but that’s just me. Those HOA fees are a tad high though.

[catcherinthewry]

just to add to "affordability" discussion, don't forget that there is also a $140/month ($1680/year) hoa fee to pay on top of everything else.

Damn! I thought my $100/mo was steep.

[Pete]

Are we sure HOA doesn't vary with house/lot size?

[Martin]

Are we sure HOA doesn't vary with house/lot size?

i'm not sure of that at all... it's been hard for me to find any hoa pricing information. i can't find anything on the wheeler site and most of the listings do not include it. the one listing i could find is for a $575k, 2375sf home on pioneer whose quotes hoa dues are $142/mo. most of the listings on zillow say "n/a" under hoa but i suspect that is not accurate.

here is the listing: https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1...81723597_zpid/

edit: it must be variable. just saw this 1924sf listing and it is quoted at $105/mo. it's entirely possible that the ~700sf homes have significantly lower (or no) hoa fees.

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1...81723592_zpid/

[GoGators]

Frankly, I don't give a **** what houses sell for in LA. I don't live in LA. I don't have the same compensation as people who live in LA. Home prices are highly regional so bringing up any other place is irrelevant unless the demographics are very similar. And this development is not downtown or really even close to downtown. It is connected in no way. Just look at the neighborhoods in this picture, to find affordable housing. Of course, those houses are not offering all the amenities of wheeler. But that is probably why they are concerned about gentrification and displacement. Again, if you are touting high-end amenities, you aren't concerned with providing affordable housing. WHICH IS FINE. Just don't say you are going to do it if you aren't.

Is there really any truly affordable options in the neighborhoods in this shown radius? I did a quick search (the exact radius you use and my hand drawn attempt doesnt match up perfectly) and there are only 5 houses currently coming up in this radius under 225k and they are either tear downs or need massive remodels. It's really tough to get inside this radius for under 250k now.

Here

Note: i did filter for houses only. There are 4 condos in Sycamore Square and 1 APT at Maywood Lofts that would also fall under the $225,000 price

[AP]

That radius includes all of CTP so yes I can. I found 7 in CTP alone under 250.