Full list of proposed MAPS 4 projects

[Jake]

The general population will most likely see all these things listed (minus the stadium and fairgrounds arena) and think they're positive things. Bet this passes.

[Bullbear]

.

I have so much against MAPS 4 and for the first time I am voting no. Too vague, not transformative and way too much added future underfunded operating costs. Some propose to create new jobs but nothing about how they will be administered nor what they will even pay. So whoever is picked by ?, could pay way over market value for positions and who controls that? Likely the same people picking the leader.

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not transformative is what I am struggling with personally. that was the original MAPS vision and it is a bit muddy this go around.

[Ed Shadid]

Ed,

Do you realize that all 460 players in the league, plus all ownership groups, pay the state of Oklahoma income tax for each game played in the state ?

That's a huge sum that is collected on the state's behalf. It's okay for the state to repay a small percentage of the Thunders employees income tax due to the QJA. But they spend a lot of taxed money in the community that is not refunded.

No, I didn't know that and we are getting off topic (my almost sole focus is the logrolling aspect) and far outside any area of expertise on my part but I am intrigued. How is it that players on teams outside of OK pay income tax to the State of OK? Lebron James pays income tax to OK for each game played in OKC??? They pay a different amount to each state based on each state's tax rate???

[jedicurt]

No, I didn't know that and we are getting off topic (my almost sole focus is the logrolling aspect) and far outside any area of expertise on my part but I am intrigued. How is it that players on teams outside of OK pay income tax to the State of OK? Lebron James pays income tax to OK for each game played in OKC??? They pay a different amount to each state based on each state's tax rate???

in the NBA, players are paid game checks based upon the location of the game. so yes, on the game that lebron james plays in OKC, his game check for that game is subject to Oklahoma income tax. not all sports are done this way, but the NBA is.

[jerrywall]

That's how I've had to do it as a consultant/contractor. I routinely have had to file non resident tax returns for other states that I've worked in while a resident of Oklahoma.

[Ed Shadid]

in the NBA, players are paid game checks based upon the location of the game. so yes, on the game that lebron james plays in OKC, his game check for that game is subject to Oklahoma income tax. not all sports are done this way, but the NBA is.

Interesting. Thank you. NBA Players must enjoy playing games in Texas just a little more lol.

[HOT ROD]

^ California (4 teams: LA Lakers, LA Clippers, GS Warriors, Sac Kings).

Ed, I don't believe Texas (3 teams: Dallas Mavs, Houston Rockets, SA Spurs). has income tax. ..

Weird that its this way when the players are employees of the team/city they represent; you'd think they'd just pay tax in that state (if any) and a "use" tax when playing in away games. Weird on the NBA.

Must be a nightmare nonetheless having to file so many state returns. One of the reason's players hawk about "Seattle" as an NBA destination is that like TX we also have no income tax. Oregon (Portland Trailblazers) has no sales tax.

[OKC Guy]

Quick dive into taxes athletes pay this is from 2017 article but shows how complicated it is. You need a great tax man to decipher and file lol.

Income Taxes For Pro Athletes Are Reminder Of How Complicated U.S. Tax Code Is

Kurt Badenhausen9:20 am
By K. Sean Packard

LeBron James was the highest-paid athlete in the U.S. last year with more than $80 million from salary and endorsements. King James will pay his fair share of taxes, but the level of complication for James and his financial team when they are filing is off the charts since he earned money in at least the 21 states where NBA teams are located.

Athletes file taxes not only in their home state but also in every state—and some cities—in which they play. Not every state uses the same calculation to determine what portion of an athlete’s income to tax, and some use different calculations based on the sport. For example, Pennsylvania taxes baseball, basketball and hockey players on the ratio games in the state over total games played, including pre- and postseason, but they tax football players based on days worked in the state over total days worked. Michigan uses the same method but excludes the preseason. Most other states use the days worked method. Arizona uses that method but excludes days worked in the pre-season (otherwise MLB would be shopping for a new spring training home).

Read the rest here:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kurtbad.../#5fe8e40c411e

But you don’t get double taxed so if OKC player pays Cali taxes for days played in Cali (worked) those days are deducted here. Its complicated.

[ShadowStrings]

And that's why people like me exist.

[David]

That is totally off-topic, and really damn fascinating.

God, the accounting that must be required to keep up with it...

[Laramie]

And the increase in value of the team since the purchase has increased from its purchase price in 2006 of $350 million to something like $1.5 billion today (429% return in 13 years). Everyone needs to get up off their knees and stop acting like the financial benefit goes one way (from benevolent oligarchs who own the team to the people of OKC). How about the people of OKC get an equity position in the team ala the Green Bay Packers.

Forgive me since the topic has shifted into the tax angle...

Ed you have our support, continue with being the watchdog for our city as it relates to programs & facilities.

True, the NBA franchise is valued at $1.5 billion; that figure only becomes liquid when they sell the franchise. There are groups who would love to own an NBA franchise; Seattle, Vancouver, Virginia Beach-Norfolk & Louisville are all in line waiting for an expansion or relocation franchise.

Keep in mind that The Peake is used for a number of events throughout the year. Thunder as an anchor tenant (first rights on dates) pays $1.6 million annually, an average of $40,000 per event to rent/lease the city's main arena.

Smart cities keep their arenas up-to-date to keep competitive with communities who aspire to covet what we already possess--that's how we obtained the Thunder.

[Pete]

That is totally off-topic, and really damn fascinating.

God, the accounting that must be required to keep up with it...

Imagine tracking royalties for music and movies...

I helped implement IT and financial systems for that purpose at Paramount and at DMX (forerunner to XM). You can't imagine all the different things that have to be tracked and the various parties that are owed.

[Teo9969]

Unless there are reciprocal agreements between two states, you almost always have to pay income tax (and employers must withhold this if you're a W2 employee) to the state in which you're working (unless that state doesn't have income tax). There are some state combinations where you are at the very least subject to double withholding (though you would likely get a credit from the tax you paid to the non-resident state toward your resident state's tax liability)

If you're interested in how non-residents have to pay, here is the OK 2018 non-resident instructions: https://www.ok.gov/tax/documents/511NRPkt-18.pdf

[Bellaboo]

No, I didn't know that and we are getting off topic (my almost sole focus is the logrolling aspect) and far outside any area of expertise on my part but I am intrigued. How is it that players on teams outside of OK pay income tax to the State of OK? Lebron James pays income tax to OK for each game played in OKC??? They pay a different amount to each state based on each state's tax rate???

Yes, all players and team owners pay the Oklahoma income tax rate charged for each game in Oklahoma. Where Texas does not have a state income tax, then they would not pay.

The Thunder are making the state and city a lot of money in the long run.

[Bellaboo]

That is totally off-topic, and really damn fascinating.

God, the accounting that must be required to keep up with it...

All income taxes for all 30 teams are handled by a firm out of Washington DC.

[Laramie]

If you own property in Texas as my family does, those property taxes more than make up for the income taxes Oklahomans pay.

Especially, since you can't file for homestead exemption. You pay property taxes for the County (Milam County) & the School District (Cameron Independent School District) on property in Texas. So don't think because Texas doesn't have income taxes that's some kind of gift.

[BoulderSooner]

No, I didn't know that and we are getting off topic (my almost sole focus is the logrolling aspect) and far outside any area of expertise on my part but I am intrigued. How is it that players on teams outside of OK pay income tax to the State of OK? Lebron James pays income tax to OK for each game played in OKC??? They pay a different amount to each state based on each state's tax rate???

yes and this started with the city of cinncinnait that started imposing thier city income tax (2.1%) on visiting baseball players ...

everywhere in this country you owe income tax based on where you perform the work .. (in most cases states don't know or care) but in the case of athletes this "jock tax" is easy to track and understand ..

[BoulderSooner]

All income taxes for all 30 teams are handled by a firm out of Washington DC.

a bunch of the nba teams use PWC

[BoulderSooner]

No, I didn't know that and we are getting off topic (my almost sole focus is the logrolling aspect)

the problem is what we are voting on is absolutly not log rolling .. (the council can do what they wnat with the money as you well know )

[chuck5815]

the problem is what we are voting on is absolutly not log rolling .. (the council can do what they wnat with the money as you well know )

We just had some very fine logs to roll with in prior MAPS initiatives—top shelf firewood if you will.

But most of the logs in this round are filled with knots, still damp from the spring rains, and have potential to cause untold damage to our collective fireplace. It only makes sense that the Voters be given the option to pick and choose which logs shall burn.

[OKC Guy]

Pete, is it possible to overlay the projects on a map of OKC? I realize we can’t map sidewalks plus some spend does not have a location picked out yet. Just curious if thats feasible. Some use existing buildings as well. Kind of like you do for other projects. If its too difficult don’t worry either.

[shawnw]

mymaps.google.com is pretty easy to use

[jedicurt]

Interesting. Thank you. NBA Players must enjoy playing games in Texas just a little more lol.

as i've dug into it. the sports that seem to do this are the ones that have teams in both the US and Canada... i'm curious if how they have to deal with that is what makes it decided to be done this way.

[Jersey Boss]

Maybe that explains why the Packers and Raiders sent skeleton crews to the exhibition game in Manitoba.

[OKC Guy]

mymaps.google.com is pretty easy to use

Thanks but I use DuckDuckGo