Streetcar

[TheTravellers]

If they are delayed more than a couple of minutes they should really let people out of the streetcar if they want to get out. I could see that single handedly driving many people away.

No way that's going to happen, I can pretty much guarantee that the only place people can get on/off is at designated boarding platforms, it's a liability thing (or something like that, I'm no expert, but I'd bet there's some legal thing somewhere that says that).

[Jersey Boss]

Seems obvious that the only solution is to eliminate curbside parking. It is the easiest and most efficient.

[OKC Guy]

Seems obvious that the only solution is to eliminate curbside parking. It is the easiest and most efficient.

Again, where is the OKC business study showing businesses support this? You are making personal assumptions so its not obvious.

The obvious path is to strictly enforce no parking zones. I mean, people speed on local roads too should we outlaw cars due to some lawbreakers?

Increase fines/fees for downtown area and make it painful to illegally park. After car is towed a 3rd time maybe have a 30 day impound time. Not sure of legalities but if their car is impounded for a month they might not do it again. Most times the towing and impound fees are over $300 (other cities) not sure about here.

If we care about our $170m SC investment then hire full time watchers who can call police on speedial, or call wreckers (if we put signs up saying its a tow zone then maybe can do without police)? Watcher and Wrecker both snap picure of offense for proof if needed. Then the person has to work with salvalge (tow) yard to pay fee to get car back. Could even have wrecker pay city a percentage of fees collected as a primary award (have wrecker companies bid on the contract for a year long and get exclusive rights to the tows).

I am against hurting legit car drivers who park legally to use a business (just support SC). There are ways to fix problem by only penalizing offenders not all people.

Eliminating parking is a bad idea. In fact if they were gonna do that then should have been done up front and could have placed SC rails in those spots and not taken car lanes.

[turnpup]

No way that's going to happen, I can pretty much guarantee that the only place people can get on/off is at designated boarding platforms, it's a liability thing (or something like that, I'm no expert, but I'd bet there's some legal thing somewhere that says that).

It's funny you bring this up because we were riding it during the first couple of weeks of operation when a car was stalled on 10th just east of the Midtown stop, blocking the tracks. The streetcar driver actually asked people to volunteer to get out and help push the disabled car out of the way. Several people got off and helped, then got back in and we continued the route. In that instance it worked out well, but the liability thought did cross my mind.

[Zorba]

No way that's going to happen, I can pretty much guarantee that the only place people can get on/off is at designated boarding platforms, it's a liability thing (or something like that, I'm no expert, but I'd bet there's some legal thing somewhere that says that).

That is just stupid. You can get out of a car or bus anywhere along a curb. Taxis and ubers let people out in the right lane all the time. But if you make a habit out of stranding people in the car for 45 minutes, nobody will ride it. If that ever happened to me I'd never get on it again. Its not like it is stopped in the middle of a busy highway, it is stopped in the right lane with an exit facing a curb or a parking lane in an area people walk all the time.

[shawnw]

Technically you are no longer allowed to board/exit a bus anywhere you want, they changed it awhile back, must be at a designated stop. There are exceptions, such as recently when a driver missed that I pulled the cord and dropped me off right where we were.

[Urban Pioneer]

Eliminating parking is a bad idea. In fact if they were gonna do that then should have been done up front and could have placed SC rails in those spots and not taken car lanes.

I think it is important to understand why streetcar tracks are directly adjacent to parallel parking in Automobile Alley and some other locations.

Traffic Engineers... and aesthetic concerns.

The Streetcar Subcommittee advocated for the pedestrian island stops with the streetcar track in the left-hand lane. This would provide a pedestrian refuge for those crossing the 80' wide Broadway Avenue and get the tracks away from operating parallel to parking areas.

Between the traffic engineers being afraid of center island stops and their effect on automobiles, the unwillingness of some involved in Auto Alley to disrupt the signature "medallions" (circular-patterned pavers at each intersection), and the unwillingness to narrow the street and shift parking to other locations, this is what you get.

If we want a truly hospitable environment for pedestrians and public transit initiatives it requires thinking completely differently and not being afraid to make big steps. The resulting layout is the result of compromise and attempting to manage public input with the traffic engineering department's way of thinking.

[BoulderSooner]

there also was a push back on having the solid line next to the Parallel parking a different color (like is done in other cities) this would go a long way in helping fix the problem

[Anonymous.]

I hate the stamped circle things in Auto Alley. They don't even look nice, they just vibrate your car/bike/scooter to death. And that is in addition to the rest of the road being terrible quality.

[HOT ROD]

That is just stupid. You can get out of a car or bus anywhere along a curb. Taxis and ubers let people out in the right lane all the time. But if you make a habit out of stranding people in the car for 45 minutes, nobody will ride it. If that ever happened to me I'd never get on it again. Its not like it is stopped in the middle of a busy highway, it is stopped in the right lane with an exit facing a curb or a parking lane in an area people walk all the time.

?? I don't understand this.

If you want rail, get used to having dedicated stops at platforms and/or stations ONLY. This is true for every type of rail be it Trolley, Streetcar/Tram, Monorail, Light Rail, Metro, Commuter Rail, Intercity Rail or High-Speed Rail. Even BUS RAPID TRANSIT has dedicated stops at platforms (you wont be getting on/off elsewhere). ...

You can not just jump on/off a train when you feel like it - makes sense, right?

[Urban Pioneer]

The streetcar is so much faster and a much more enjoyable ride now as compared to a couple of weeks ago thanks to signal prioritization, not stopping at all stops, and aggressive driving. I was so pleased when I rode on Saturday!

Over $3 million approved today by the OKC Council for the remaining signals, spare parts, and a wheel trueing machine.

[TheTravellers]

Over $3 million approved today by the OKC Council for the remaining signals, spare parts, and a wheel trueing machine.

Yay, a clue, they finally got one....

[Urban Pioneer]

Lol. The question really is now how fast they will implement them. My guess is 2 - 3 months for the most problematic ones. The maps process is 6 weeks at the fastest. The City Manager can expedite it and we can pay Public Works back. But I believe we have met the threshold with the current improvements and will have to go back out to bid. With the weather bad, ridership is visibly down. Hopefully this can be quickly improved with the signals on Hudson and also 10th happening first. The lane changes also need to be implemented on Sheridan in Bricktown.

[OKC Guy]

Maybe I misread but a month or so ago all we needed was around $450,000 or so for all the light prioritization. So how did we increase to $3,000,000?

Is there a breakdown of all these costs the public can see? This seems a bit bait and switch to me but again, maybe there is more to this I am not aware of.

I would think the light issue and any other maintenance needs would be seperate line items.

$3,000,000 is a lot of money after the fact of spending over $170m already.

[Urban Pioneer]

Guess you missed the reference to spare parts and a wheel-trueing machine. We are going to buy quite a few parts. And also $140 million. Not $170.

[Mott]

Guess you missed the reference to spare parts and a wheel-trueing machine. We are going to buy quite a few parts. And also $140 million. Not $170.

Are the streetcar wheels equipped with flange lubricators? If not, they should be as that will reduce the wear on the flanges going in to the curves.

[DoctorTaco]

I rode twice this week inbound into Downtown, and yes, it is moving much quicker down Robinson. But one other thing I noticed is that the streetcars are stopping at every stop, regardless of whether that anyone pushed the button or if anyone is waiting. In January when last I rode, the streetcars go on past any stop where no one had requested a stop and there was no one waiting. This week it stopped at every stop for about 30 seconds, even though zero of them were needed stops. This negated much of the gains of the streetlight optimization.

Any color on this?

[OKC Guy]

Guess you missed the reference to spare parts and a wheel-trueing machine. We are going to buy quite a few parts. And also $140 million. Not $170.

Maybe you don’t have it but is there a breakdown of the $3m approved? Spare parts when its a brand new system and for the high cost should have warranties on the cars. I think we needed around $400k for the lights so where can I find a breakdown of the other $2.6 million expense?

[Pryor Tiger]

I rode twice this week inbound into Downtown, and yes, it is moving much quicker down Robinson. But one other thing I noticed is that the streetcars are stopping at every stop, regardless of whether that anyone pushed the button or if anyone is waiting. In January when last I rode, the streetcars go on past any stop where no one had requested a stop and there was no one waiting. This week it stopped at every stop for about 30 seconds, even though zero of them were needed stops. This negated much of the gains of the streetlight optimization.

Any color on this?

Same for me - and we ride a lot. Hopefully it is only temporary!

[Urban Pioneer]

Maybe you don’t have it but is there a breakdown of the $3m approved? Spare parts when its a brand new system and for the high cost should have warranties on the cars. I think we needed around $400k for the lights so where can I find a breakdown of the other $2.6 million expense?

The lights cost more than originally estimated base don the purchasing/labor completed on the first six. Warranties do not cover normal wear and accidents. An example would be that we felt that having extra catenary poles on hand in the event of collisions or storm damage made sense. They are custom made and are throughout our downtown in a variety of configurations. Eventually, something is bound to happen to one of them and replacement lead times can be up to six months. You can find the breakdown on any of the last City Council, MAPS 3 Board, or MAPS 3 Transit Subcommittee Agendas. The matter is completed, however.

[Urban Pioneer]

I rode twice this week inbound into Downtown, and yes, it is moving much quicker down Robinson. But one other thing I noticed is that the streetcars are stopping at every stop, regardless of whether that anyone pushed the button or if anyone is waiting. In January when last I rode, the streetcars go on past any stop where no one had requested a stop and there was no one waiting. This week it stopped at every stop for about 30 seconds, even though zero of them were needed stops. This negated much of the gains of the streetlight optimization.

Any color on this?

That should really only happen if we have a spacing and timing issue between cars. I'll ask and ride it today myself as well. One thing of note, they are hiring more operators due to the expanded service every Sunday. So operators are going through training and thus going through the full stop procedure at some stops as part of that training.

Some EMBARK reps read this thread. Operators, please take note of this feedback.

[OKC Guy]

The lights cost more than originally estimated base don the purchasing/labor completed on the first six. Warranties do not cover normal wear and accidents. An example would be that we felt that having extra catenary poles on hand in the event of collisions or storm damage made sense. They are custom made and are throughout our downtown in a variety of configurations. Eventually, something is bound to happen to one of them and replacement lead times can be up to six months. You can find the breakdown on any of the last City Council, MAPS 3 Board, or MAPS 3 Transit Subcommittee Agendas. The matter is completed, however.

I found this but its mostly vague without a parts breakdown. What is a new service vehicle, a pickup? It seems we should have insurance to cover accidents too. I can understand some parts but we are talking $2.5m of extra costs approved when its only been in service 4 months! If things are breaking at low useage levels that means this could turn into a major money pit.

What I don’t understand is all this fight to approve the lights ($450k) and then out of the blue an extra $2,500,000 is added on without discussion or warning. And if we bought this system without thinking about batteries (when its electric) thats a failure to plan ahead.

Here is what is listed at the meetings:

“There is approximately $20 million in excess collections and/or interest from the Oklahoma City Capital Improvement Sales Tax Fund. EMBARK has requested additional items including a wheel truing machine, vehicle spare parts, additional ticket vending machines, additional streetcar vehicle batteries, additional mainline spare parts, an additional service vehicle, spare overhead catenary system poles, and traffic signal prioritization.”

https://agenda.okc.gov/sirepub/cache...9113648582.PDF

So where is a breakdown of the $2,500,000 added on besides just generalities? This seems like a money pit. Open for just over 3 months and added over $3,000,000 in spend. So at this rate its costing $1,000,000 a month extra over the $140,000,000 initial cost. And this is without labor or other regular costs.

All I heard and read is we needed the signals upgraded for $450,000 and then they snuck in an extra $2,500,000 in other costs. Seems a bit sketchy to me and as a taxpayer I need to address this with my councilman.

[BoulderSooner]

I found this but its mostly vague without a parts breakdown. What is a new service vehicle, a pickup? It seems we should have insurance to cover accidents too. I can understand some parts but we are talking $2.5m of extra costs approved when its only been in service 4 months! If things are breaking at low useage levels that means this could turn into a major money pit.

What I don’t understand is all this fight to approve the lights ($450k) and then out of the blue an extra $2,500,000 is added on without discussion or warning. And if we bought this system without thinking about batteries (when its electric) thats a failure to plan ahead.

Here is what is listed at the meetings:

“There is approximately $20 million in excess collections and/or interest from the Oklahoma City Capital Improvement Sales Tax Fund. EMBARK has requested additional items including a wheel truing machine, vehicle spare parts, additional ticket vending machines, additional streetcar vehicle batteries, additional mainline spare parts, an additional service vehicle, spare overhead catenary system poles, and traffic signal prioritization.”

https://agenda.okc.gov/sirepub/cache...9113648582.PDF

So where is a breakdown of the $2,500,000 added on besides just generalities? This seems like a money pit. Open for just over 3 months and added over $3,000,000 in spend. So at this rate its costing $1,000,000 a month extra over the $140,000,000 initial cost. And this is without labor or other regular costs.

All I heard and read is we needed the signals upgraded for $450,000 and then they snuck in an extra $2,500,000 in other costs. Seems a bit sketchy to me and as a taxpayer I need to address this with my councilman.

the timing is because just now is when the maps 3 surpless funds are starting to be given out to the various projects ..

[baralheia]

I found this but its mostly vague without a parts breakdown. What is a new service vehicle, a pickup? It seems we should have insurance to cover accidents too. I can understand some parts but we are talking $2.5m of extra costs approved when its only been in service 4 months! If things are breaking at low useage levels that means this could turn into a major money pit.

What I don’t understand is all this fight to approve the lights ($450k) and then out of the blue an extra $2,500,000 is added on without discussion or warning. And if we bought this system without thinking about batteries (when its electric) thats a failure to plan ahead.

Here is what is listed at the meetings:

“There is approximately $20 million in excess collections and/or interest from the Oklahoma City Capital Improvement Sales Tax Fund. EMBARK has requested additional items including a wheel truing machine, vehicle spare parts, additional ticket vending machines, additional streetcar vehicle batteries, additional mainline spare parts, an additional service vehicle, spare overhead catenary system poles, and traffic signal prioritization.”

https://agenda.okc.gov/sirepub/cache...9113648582.PDF

So where is a breakdown of the $2,500,000 added on besides just generalities? This seems like a money pit. Open for just over 3 months and added over $3,000,000 in spend. So at this rate its costing $1,000,000 a month extra over the $140,000,000 initial cost. And this is without labor or other regular costs.

All I heard and read is we needed the signals upgraded for $450,000 and then they snuck in an extra $2,500,000 in other costs. Seems a bit sketchy to me and as a taxpayer I need to address this with my councilman.

While I understand where you're coming from, the idea with spare parts is to ensure high availability of service. That allows maintenance techs to quickly repair a streetcar vehicle when a problem does arise and get it back on the route without having to wait for insurance, etc.

[Laramie]

the timing is because just now is when the maps 3 surpless funds are starting to be given out to the various projects ..

Let's hope these surplus funds can be distributed in a way that it enhances projects that may have been underfunded or quickly added something unforeseen to the project.

Get the streetcar rolling in the right direction; signal prioritization.

We all realize the convention center wasn't among the most favorable projects; but as many of us have gone to other cities and seen their facilities--OKC needed to replace the Cox CC.

Still love the idea Plutonic Panda mentioned about a $100 million endowment fund in MAPS IV; this could be the last item funded for repair-upgrades of aging MAPS projects.