National Cowboy and Western Heritage Museum

[jonny d]

Here is an article about a new expansion to the museum. Nothing earth-shattering, but I know a lot of tourists go to the museum.

https://newsok.com/article/5616164/n...liichokoshkomo

[mugofbeer]

This is good! I hope the new Native American Museum is just as good in it's own right. The two would be an interesting set of educational facilities to have so close together.

[dankrutka]

The last time I went to the museum I found it more miseducational than educational. It basically just sold old Cowboy and Indian Western myths. That's in addition to one of the docents interrupting me and an Indigenous scholar (who traveled to Oklahoma) to claim Indian casinos are "Red Man's revenge" to steal White people's money. Ugh. It made quite an impression on both of us as you'd expect.

Now, in this docent incident the museum at least responded that that was unacceptable after we lodged a complaint, and I know the museum has hired some high quality educators.... but can anyone speak to the quality of the museum? I want someone to give me a good enough reason to go back. I typically love museums with any history.

[MagzOK]

The last time I went to the museum I found it more miseducational than educational. It basically just sold old Cowboy and Indian Western myths.

I've really enjoyed the various times I've been to the museum. I would be interested to know what types of materials they have are myths. Thanks.

[dankrutka]

I've really enjoyed the various times I've been to the museum. I would be interested to know what types of materials they have are myths. Thanks.

From my memory, there's actually a lot of Cowboy and Western TV paraphenalia. While TV has a history of its own, I don't remember seeing much information discussing how historically inaccurate Westerns were. A lot of those narratives are built on the myth of individual (White) Cowboy bringing justice and law to the West. Really the only Indigenous items were some quilts, including a 9/11 one, back in a corner of the museum. Moreover, the very first thing you see is the huge statue of a defeated Indian slumped over on a horse. A lot of crappy textbooks tell Indigenous histories as the histories of defeated peoples (by 1900) too. Of course, that's not the stories Indigenous nations tell as they are still sovereign nations to this day and that's a very narrow, Western view of history. In general, that's the type of narrative the museum seemed to tell. Give An Indigenous Peoples History by Oklahoman Roxanne Dunbar Ortiz a read and see how the museum narrative matches up with Indigenous histories, which are obviously a huge part of any "Western" history. (BTW, the very name "Western" History is a White settler point of view as most Indigenous nations weren't part of some "Manifest Destiny" moving westward).

That's all from memory and also from two years ago. I am not at all claiming that's everything, but that's the distinct impression the museum left me with when I last visited. Maybe things have changed. I don't know.

[jerrywall]

Are you talking about "End of the trail"?

https://www.metmuseum.org/exhibition...d-of-the-trail

[d-usa]

I’ve gotten in trouble there for carrying a toddler on my shoulders because of “insurance reasons” and we were not allowed to drink the drinks they sold us. It feels like a place that doesn’t know what it actually wants to be sometimes.

[Laramie]

The $15 million improvements expansion for the museum will add to the amenities for children of patrons who visit the museum. You ever drag kids along; you're ready for fine dining like a steak & wine while they savor for a hamburger, soda pop, french fries or macaroni & cheese.

Persimmon Hill is a nice scenic setting as you round the historic Route 66 drive through the red clay hills & deep fork basin, a beautiful site; someone should invest in some hotels in the Adventure District; especially with the upcoming expansion of WCWS softball stadium and the OKC Zoo properties. OKC wants to solidify itself in the mold of a big league city; you've got to improve other areas to make our city more attractive throughout.

[Jersey Boss]

I’ve gotten in trouble there for carrying a toddler on my shoulders because of “insurance reasons” and we were not allowed to drink the drinks they sold us. It feels like a place that doesn’t know what it actually wants to be sometimes.

What you mean they wouldn't allow you to drink purchased drinks? You make a purchase and then have to get someone's approval to consume said purchase?

[mugofbeer]

Maybe they didn't want you to drink your drink while carrying a toddler on your shoulders.

[PhiAlpha]

Are you talking about "End of the trail"?

https://www.metmuseum.org/exhibition...d-of-the-trail

Good article. I never thought that statue was intended to celebrate the Native Americans’ defeat but that it was more of a sad commentary on it.

[d-usa]

What you mean they wouldn't allow you to drink purchased drinks? You make a purchase and then have to get someone's approval to consume said purchase?

We got in trouble for drinking our bottled drinks in other areas of the museum. I didn’t recall any signage restricting you from taking a drink from your bottle of Diet Coke in random places.

We still take out of town guests there if they are into the Cowboy legacy of things, but I think it is just weirdly run. It still feels more like it’s “just” a hall of fame celebrating Cowboys heritage that manages to get their hands on some museum pieces and now tries to double dip as “western heritage museum”.

[pure]

We got in trouble for drinking our bottled drinks in other areas of the museum. I didn’t recall any signage restricting you from taking a drink from your bottle of Diet Coke in random places.

We still take out of town guests there if they are into the Cowboy legacy of things, but I think it is just weirdly run. It still feels more like it’s “just” a hall of fame celebrating Cowboys heritage that manages to get their hands on some museum pieces and now tries to double dip as “western heritage museum”.

I'm there often for events, I know they have a sign just as you are leaving the Museum Cafe area that says No Food or Drink beyond this point. When there is an event in Prosperity Junction (The Western town), they will set up signs at the exits so you don't take your glasses and plates out into the rest of the museum.

[Dob Hooligan]

Seems like most of what I have seen on this thread are generational differences. Younger commenters appear to have issues with product, presentation and management; and older commenters think it works pretty well as is?

[ABCOKC]

The last time I went to the museum I found it more miseducational than educational. It basically just sold old Cowboy and Indian Western myths. That's in addition to one of the docents interrupting me and an Indigenous scholar (who traveled to Oklahoma) to claim Indian casinos are "Red Man's revenge" to steal White people's money. Ugh. It made quite an impression on both of us as you'd expect.

Now, in this docent incident the museum at least responded that that was unacceptable after we lodged a complaint, and I know the museum has hired some high quality educators.... but can anyone speak to the quality of the museum? I want someone to give me a good enough reason to go back. I typically love museums with any history.

What's wrong with a museum or exhibits that tell a story from the point of view of the settlers? Especially seeing as how ~97% of Oklahoma Citians are not American Indian?

[d-usa]

You can have a museum from the point of view of someone, while also acknowledging facts and when those points were wrong.

I went to the Documentation Center museum in Nürnberg, which does just that in a stunning fashion.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Docu..._Rally_Grounds

A Cowboy Hall of Fame should be free to glorify Cowboys and highlight their impact on our culture. A Western Heritage Museum should educate on the impact the Cowboy and western heritage had, and continues to have, on our culture, including both positive and negative aspects. A museum has a responsibility to educate on the subject it is covering, and to do so comprehensively. And I think that this is an area where the history of being a Hall of Fame (to celebrate a subject) has infiltrated the current mission of a museum (to educate on a subject).

Edit: no, I do not equate Cowboys and white settlers with Nazis. I was just using it as a good example of covering a subject in all aspects.

[MagzOK]

From my memory, there's actually a lot of Cowboy and Western TV paraphenalia. While TV has a history of its own, I don't remember seeing much information discussing how historically inaccurate Westerns were. A lot of those narratives are built on the myth of individual (White) Cowboy bringing justice and law to the West. Really the only Indigenous items were some quilts, including a 9/11 one, back in a corner of the museum. Moreover, the very first thing you see is the huge statue of a defeated Indian slumped over on a horse. A lot of crappy textbooks tell Indigenous histories as the histories of defeated peoples (by 1900) too. Of course, that's not the stories Indigenous nations tell as they are still sovereign nations to this day and that's a very narrow, Western view of history. In general, that's the type of narrative the museum seemed to tell. Give An Indigenous Peoples History by Oklahoman Roxanne Dunbar Ortiz a read and see how the museum narrative matches up with Indigenous histories, which are obviously a huge part of any "Western" history. (BTW, the very name "Western" History is a White settler point of view as most Indigenous nations weren't part of some "Manifest Destiny" moving westward).

That's all from memory and also from two years ago. I am not at all claiming that's everything, but that's the distinct impression the museum left me with when I last visited. Maybe things have changed. I don't know.

I gotchya. I appreciate your impression. I hadn't thought of it in those ways. Take care,

[Pete]

Reopening May 18th:

https://www.okgazette.com/oklahoma/p...cDQzU3jg4zPwVw

[Pete]

Plans have been filed to build a parking structure into the side of the hill on the east side of the property:

[David]

That's a fairly creative use of that hill.

[Plutonic Panda]

Does that mean they’ll expand onto the current lots?

[unfundedrick]

I suspect that parking structure is mainly to take care of special events being held there. I've never seen a lack of parking availability when just visiting the museum.

[Urbanized]

^^^^^^^^
Seems like that amount of investment would only be occurring if they intended to make additional investment elsewhere. I’m with PluPan; this could be a harbinger of future expansion.

[Soonerman]

This is going to make it so much easier when they have the Chuckwagon feed.

[Celebrator]

Too bad that will take out a lot of natural growth on that hillside. Won't be as nice to look at coming down I-44. More old trees going to bite the dust. Hopefully their landscaping around the parking structure will be nice--soften the impact of it a little on the aesthetics of that hillside which is pretty.