Streetcar

[shawnw]

so much open parking, I'm not sure how they could tell the difference between your car and an employee of a store. another option would be to park at the data center across the street. they don't have permits as far as I can tell, because they have a publicly used auditorium, which I've attended events at.

[d-usa]

Dreamers, fake numbers; no point debating him.

[Zuplar]

I have thought about doing this, but just not sure if the Outlets would take offense.

I've actually parked there before when meeting up with a friend that wanted to drive downtown, that way we didn't have to take 2 cars.

[shawnw]

As a regular bus rider, I can tell you that, yes, sometimes buses are empty. But at any given time in any neighborhood you see a bunch of empty cars not being used. That doesn't mean they're not needed or relied upon. There peak times and non-peak times of use, just like with cars and traffic. Three million rides per year is not nothing. And there are plenty of folks, some on this board, that would ride if the system better suited their needs. Which it may, once the RTA is stood up, and the system is expanded and inter-connected with other modes, such as streetcar, more immediately, and commuter rail, later down the line.

[d-usa]

I rode it for 6 months, and it would have been completely inadequate if I had kids or needed it for anything other than going to work and back.

[shawnw]

Understood. Keep in mind that we currently spend very little on transit. But that will change with the RTA.

https://twitter.com/JeremyMoses85/st...77387571015680


Personally, I've used it to shop, go to my optometrist, and run some errands. The system, as minimal as it is, does go by lots of shopping options (Penn Square, Outlet Mall, Quail Springs).

[d-usa]

The system does connect to many shopping options, and also provides access to many service centers and employer clusters.

The main problem is lack of penetration into neighborhoods, which is a consequence of being one of the largest (by area) cities in the United States, and frequency of service.

[Ross MacLochness]

"you don't get it" refers to the fact that we keep sprawling out with such low density that it prohibits the ability to have good, reliable transit. We have a geometry problem and we seem to not be doing anything to stop it. We'll never have good public transit when we have such low density. So in a way, both sides are right. People who might want to ride (and also have the means to drive) don't use it because it's not convenient. Not because "they don't get it". On the other hand, the streetcar is a way to kind of reverse engineer density. By creating a fixed guideway, we are reinforcing density along the fixed route, which will hopefully spur outward. It'll be a long time before public transit becomes a convenient option for all people in this city but the streetcar is a way to make it the preferred mode at least in the core of the city.

[Colbafone]

As someone who works RIGHT BY Penn Square Mall, I see people getting on/off all the time on Penn, at any number of the numerous stops between 36th and 63rd. Now that I mention this, I'll see if I can keep a tab of how many I see getting off and on. Keep in mind I don't have eyes on the stops at all times or anything, just what I see when I can. I'd bet that there are easily 40 people per day that I see getting on and off. And that's just any old dart throw day.

[Teo9969]

If FY 2015 saw 3,085,663 passengers, that's ~8,450 passengers/day which is about 1.34% of the population.

Adding just the street-car, what would everybody consider to be a success in terms of an increase in percentage of ridership? .25%, .5%, 1%?

[KayneMo]

^ Since buses don't run on Sundays, that adds over 1.400 to the daily average, bringing it to 9,858 passengers/day in 2015.

[David]

Dreamers, fake numbers; no point debating him.

That was my judgement from the start based on the username.

[Laramie]

The system does connect to many shopping options, and also provides access to many service centers and employer clusters.

The main problem is lack of penetration into neighborhoods, which is a consequence of being one of the largest (by area) cities in the United States, and frequency of service.

d-usa that was one of my fondest memories as a child. We road what was the First East 4th bus. It stopped at the NW corner of 6th & Stonewall inbound and the SE corner of 6th & Stonewall outbound in front of Butler's BBQ. All the buses home base in the 60s were on Main Street DT in front of HL Greens/Montgomery Ward/Rothchilds. Recall riding the bus DT (mother put cash/check in an envelope) and we came home with a receipt or you didn't come home. 'Your behind is mind' is what Aunt Lula use to say if you returned receipt-less. The Village raised all of the children.

Some of the buses go into the old neighborhoods, now for the most part stops are at or near major street intersections.

[OKC Guy]

All streetcar track will be done in about a month. In addition to the ribbon cutting on the 14, that whole weekend will be a 3-day grand opening event of some kind. Also of note, the light going in at 11th will be a streetcar only light that will only turn red (for cars) when the streetcar needs to turn left across both directions of traffic to go down 11th.

This may be a dumb question but my understanding is the SC uses car lanes so if there are 3 cars ahead of SC in same lane does that mean those cars get priority so SC can get throuh intersection? Or is that section lane marked as SC only? And if cars can use that lane it seems more cars will move to SC lane to get through intersections? Maybe I have it all wrong which is likely.

[shawnw]

Cars in front of streetcar would get to go

[Anonymous.]

Yep that is definitely how it works. I keep hearing people argue the idea of "well it will be stuck behind cars just like all the traffic anyways" or the linked theory of "well it will only cause more traffic because people will want to get around it".

When in actuality, the streetcar lane will be the best chance to get through traffic due to prioritization. Especially after the first few months of operation and the route prioritization is adjusted for times accordingly.

[Teo9969]

^ Since buses don't run on Sundays, that adds over 1.400 to the daily average, bringing it to 9,858 passengers/day in 2015.

Ah, great point.

So that's ~9,850/day or 1.56% of the population.

So the question to everyone still remains: What is a reasonable bump in overall percentage ridership from the streetcar?

[Laramie]

Don't know if this has been addressed (probably has), my only fear about the streetcar lane; someone's car stalls in the lane blocking traffic--it will throw the whole timing of the streetcar off. Surely there will be a tow truck positioned much like ambulances to deal with the problem.

[TheTravellers]

Don't know if this has been addressed (probably has), my only fear about the streetcar lane; someone's car stalls in the lane blocking traffic--it will throw the whole timing of the streetcar off. Surely there will be a tow truck positioned much like ambulances to deal with the problem.

From what I"ve read, yes, there will be tow trucks on call to deal with stalled and illegally parked cars on the tracks.

[catch22]

Robinson is now open in both directions all the way through downtown.

[Jim Kyle]

d-usa that was one of my fondest memories as a child.

When my family returned to OKC in 1946, when housing was almost impossible to find, we had to take a two-room "apartment" that was actually a converted garage near NW 13 and Robinson for the first six months. During that time, I rode the streetcar to school every morning, and back home every afternoon. When we bought a home near NW 20 and May at the end of that year, I rode the bus from NW 17 and May to Classen, instead. But to go downtown, I took a different bus at NW 23 and May.

Now, I've lived near NW 122 and Council for more than 30 years. It's more than a mile to the nearest supermarket, and almost three miles to pick up my prescriptions. The nearest bus stop, I think (I've never seen a sign for it) is at NW Highway and Council, again about three miles, and the schedule is so infrequent that it's unusable. Our city's attempt to outgrow Houston, back in the mid-Fifties, effectively destroyed any possibility of implementing usable public transportation for most residents.

Yet a hundred years ago, developers built such systems in order to make their efforts attractive to prospective purchasers. The original streetcar system was created by Classen to help him sell lots around what is now the Plaza district, Gatewood, Crestwood, and so on! By 1947, it had been replaced by bus routes for the most part, so the last car rolled down the track that year -- and folk began to drive everywhere, instead.

At least we're trying to rectify some of our mistakes. But the sprawl continues to spread. The more things change, the more they remain the same...

[shawnw]

Jim, the city would like to hear from you.

https://okc.gov/Home/Components/News/News/2805/5123

Stories needed from people who remember original Oklahoma City streetcars

[Jim Kyle]

I copied #7521 to them. Didn't mention riding the Linwood line back in 1939-40, from NW 19 and Independence to downtown and the old Terminal Building! Or that my wife's grandfather was a track foreman for Oklahoma Railway Company back when the cars still ran...

[Pete]

Official Streetcar Ribbon Cutting is set for Dec. 14th at Leadership Square.

[ChowRunner]

Here is the Facebook event about the ribbon cutting
https://www.facebook.com/events/966064113597215/?ti=as