2018 Oklahoma City Aviation Thread

[jonny d]

https://newsok.com/article/5598827/o...onstop-flights

I would very much be on board with the 2 flights they are working to get (Miami and LaGuardia).

And yes, pun intended. Haha

[no1cub17]

https://newsok.com/article/5598827/o...onstop-flights

I would very much be on board with the 2 flights they are working to get (Miami and LaGuardia).

And yes, pun intended. Haha

I would imagine AA would be the one to start MIA if that happens. Not sure about LGA - maybe DL? Now that AA has added PHL, I don't see them adding LGA out of OKC, but I'm just armchair quarterbacking.

[damonsmuz]

I saw that DL is turning AUS into a focus city. Will be interesting to see how the approach the new cities. Will they compete against WN and try to connect regional cities with a few bigger cities mixed in or will they just go with a bunch of bigger cities.

BTW: Crazy DL story for me. Flew out of OKC to ATL this past Saturday on a 737-700. Flight made it south of Birmingham and to the Alabama/Georgia state line when the pilot came on and said we did not have enough fuel to make it into ATL. We did not circle any but did make a small deviation into ATl compared to how you would normally do it. I don't know if there are any DL employees on here but is the airline really running certain flights with the bare minimum fuel allowed? How often does DL refuel in OKC? I find it unbelievable that this flight here, 90 mins into it could not proceed into ATL. (BTW, we were cleared into the airport but according to the pilot we didn't have enough fuel for the approach where you fly east of the city and then turn and have a long final. He could only get in if we had a direct shot. Odd, I know)

[BG918]

I saw that DL is turning AUS into a focus city. Will be interesting to see how the approach the new cities. Will they compete against WN and try to connect regional cities with a few bigger cities mixed in or will they just go with a bunch of bigger cities.

I would imagine it is a mix of both connecting regional cities to AUS and flying more P2P to large cities including a couple international routes like AMS year-round. Probably similar to their CVG or RDU operation. It could open up the possibility of connecting OKC and TUL with a smaller aircraft. Not sure how VIA Air would respond.

[catch22]

I saw that DL is turning AUS into a focus city. Will be interesting to see how the approach the new cities. Will they compete against WN and try to connect regional cities with a few bigger cities mixed in or will they just go with a bunch of bigger cities.

BTW: Crazy DL story for me. Flew out of OKC to ATL this past Saturday on a 737-700. Flight made it south of Birmingham and to the Alabama/Georgia state line when the pilot came on and said we did not have enough fuel to make it into ATL. We did not circle any but did make a small deviation into ATl compared to how you would normally do it. I don't know if there are any DL employees on here but is the airline really running certain flights with the bare minimum fuel allowed? How often does DL refuel in OKC? I find it unbelievable that this flight here, 90 mins into it could not proceed into ATL. (BTW, we were cleared into the airport but according to the pilot we didn't have enough fuel for the approach where you fly east of the city and then turn and have a long final. He could only get in if we had a direct shot. Odd, I know)

Keep in mind you have to have enough fuel (before beginning the approach) to fly the full approach, one go around, and then enough fuel to divert from the go around to an alternate airport and enough fuel to do a missed approach at the diversion airport. You had enough fuel to go to ATL. Maybe not enough fuel for extra contingency.

[LakeEffect]

Keep in mind you have to have enough fuel (before beginning the approach) to fly the full approach, one go around, and then enough fuel to divert from the go around to an alternate airport and enough fuel to do a missed approach at the diversion airport. You had enough fuel to go to ATL. Maybe not enough fuel for extra contingency.

But why? OKC-ATL is their most flown route daily.... you'd think they know how to fuel up for that?

[no1cub17]

But why? OKC-ATL is their most flown route daily.... you'd think they know how to fuel up for that?

Something is off ... the pilot shouldn't have said "we don't have enough fuel to get to ATL". In that case I'm sorry but the flight wouldn't have made it. I'm guessing the pilot meant to say they were running low on reserve fuel which as catch described is enough fuel to go around, divert, plus 45 minutes (I may be wrong on that though). It is bizarre that fuel would be an issue at all on an OKC-ATL flight though, unless there was some kind of unforeseen delay, bad weather at an alternate, etc.

[catch22]

But why? OKC-ATL is their most flown route daily.... you'd think they know how to fuel up for that?

Yes. But they likely planned the fuel load based on a more direct flight path as well as a different approach. So, when they flew an indirect routing they are up their fuel that could have been used on the longer approach from the east. You still have to have on board enough fuel to fly the full approach, do a go around, fly to Birmingham, do another go around, and be able to land without declaring an emergency. Since they flew an indirect routing they simply weren’t legal to continue.

Sometimes things just don’t work out how they plan. Usually they do and no ones the wiser.

[gopokes88]

Via air is only running at 35% load factor company wide. So our 25% doesn’t look so bad by comparison.

https://airlinegeeks.com/2018/06/21/...t-largest-hub/

[OUman]

Just as an aside, AA/Eagle have long had a focus operation at AUS (at least I've seen it being referred to as such), and more recently Frontier has converted AUS into a focus airport as well. As for DL/DL Connection, they already fly between AUS and some non-hub destinations, RDU and CVG (CVG is not currently a hub in the DL network).

As for Via Air, hoping that the load factors will keep improving. Those 50-seat jets are not cheap to operate, especially with such low load factors.

[catch22]

some schedule changes I've ran across

Southwest ends okc-mdw and mco in feb; okc-dca flight times adjusted to midday departure.

American extends the summer schedule for clt through Oct (3x daily)

Delta adds ATL capacity in Oct, 1x 737-800 5x MD88 (fall is usually 2x 737-700 4x 717). Shifts all RJ flying in OKC to SkyWest (Likely at the request of SkyWest for efficiency with the mx base opening). The big airlines won't go out of their way to do this, but will usually be as accommodating as possible

[HangryHippo]

Are the Southwest changes just seasonal?

[catch22]

Hard to tell. Their schedule window is so narrow you can only see 8-9 months out. If I remember right OKC-MDW had a brief suspension earlier this year around January. (I think). In august they will extend their schedule for the spring and we can see whats going on.

[gopokes88]

Hard to tell. Their schedule window is so narrow you can only see 8-9 months out. If I remember right OKC-MDW had a brief suspension earlier this year around January. (I think). In august they will extend their schedule for the spring and we can see whats going on.

I thought I saw something they were reducing mdw flights and the okc-mdw flight was getting cut.

[damonsmuz]

How's ViaAir been doing lately? I see they've had a bunch of canceled flights in the last 10 days. Anyone here know how many people have been booking in July? Seems like a busy travel time of the year for a string of canceled flights

[catch22]

I’ve also noticed their abysmal cancel rate.

With all of these recent route additions from AUS, they are likely stretched on aircraft and crew availability. 1 frame down for unexpected maintenance could cripple their schedule.

[BG918]

I’ve also noticed their abysmal cancel rate.

With all of these recent route additions from AUS, they are likely stretched on aircraft and crew availability. 1 frame down for unexpected maintenance could cripple their schedule.

I know one person who was flying AUS-TUL and the flight was canceled at the last minute. They ended up getting back to TUL on Southwest via DAL and swore to never fly ViaAir again. I hope Delta does indeed make AUS a focus city and OKC and TUL get added as regional routes on RJ's.

[brianinok]

Any rumblings on what Alaska might be up to soon in OKC? I think someone posted recently they repainted to accommodate all/most of their plane types.

[Downwind17]

Any rumblings on what Alaska might be up to soon in OKC? I think someone posted recently they repainted to accommodate all/most of their plane types.

I too, am anxiously awaiting any developments. The source mentioned "mid-summer" as a potential time period when something would be announced. So, we wait. We know that the yields on the OKC-SEA have been tremendous and quite consistent. Perhaps it's an additional SEA flight or something new. Yes, back in early May, they re-striped the j-line at gate 2 to include all Alaska fleet types (including ex-Virgin America types). This was done so they could accept company diversions. It does make you wonder how they could accept diversions if they are only staffing for one flight a day. Fingers crossed...

[OUman]

Seems like Via's expanding too rapidly when the equipment's just not there in numbers. Just a few quick searches on FlightAware for some of its routes turns up several cancelled flights just in the past ten days! Can't be doing much good for its reputation.

[Bits_Of_Real_Panther]

overbooked flights coming into okc, the question i have is where do these originate from?

my experience:

MSP-OKC (flight coming into okc) on Delta was a CRJ (maybe holds 70). My thought is the post 4thofJuly holiday has a boost of demand, hence:

it was overbooked this week by 5 for that flight(4702). so, they needed volunteers (me being one) and got 5 at $800 per. Whats the math with this, why not add a bigger aircraft?

[catch22]

An algorithm determines the number of seats an airline will oversell in order to make sure the airplane flies out full. Based on historical data, a particular theoretical flight serves by a 100 seat airplane may have a 2.6% no show factor, the airline will sell 103 tickets. On your average day 3 or so people will not show up for whatever reason (missed connection, late to the airport, overslept, car broke down, meeting ran late, etc.) and the flight will leave the gate with exactly 100 people on board and the airline won’t even ask for volunteers. The oversell algorithm worked and no one is the wiser. This revenue management tool actually works more often than not, and most flights are oversold but still leave with empty seats at door closing time.

Less likely is when everyone does show up and the airline has to ask for volunteers, such as your case.

[brianinok]

overbooked flights coming into okc, the question i have is where do these originate from?

my experience:

MSP-OKC (flight coming into okc) on Delta was a CRJ (maybe holds 70). My thought is the post 4thofJuly holiday has a boost of demand, hence:

it was overbooked this week by 5 for that flight(4702). so, they needed volunteers (me being one) and got 5 at $800 per. Whats the math with this, why not add a bigger aircraft?

Delta can't figure out what they want to do with OKC-MSP. I fly that route quite a bit, and I've been on everything: CRJ-200, CRJ-700, CRJ-900, ERJ-175, and A319. Most common the last couple years is CRJ-700. But that flight has always been full when I've been on it-- it doesn't matter if they are flying the route 2, 3, or 4 times that day (Delta can't decide how often they want to fly that route either). It is also almost always in the $500 range for regular coach (3-4 month out, even higher if booked closer to departure). It is the most frustrating route out of OKC as far as I am concerned.

[OUman]

From what I gather, what Delta/Delta Connection do is called "right-sizing" - putting just the right plane on a certain route based on expected demand. DL/DL Conn seem to take it to the limit however and that results in two things - a higher frequency of aircraft changes and higher frequency of full flights (thus, no matter what the aircraft type is). This has also resulted in higher profits for obvious reasons. Overbooking doesn't factor into it because no-shows are more subjective on a day-to-day basis. The 319 for instance is only operated on this route in the summer, and that too when the demand dictates it.

[HangryHippo]

Josh - any idea when the June aviation activity report will be posted to flyokc.com? Thanks!